Commanders vs. Seahawks Day After Tell The Truth Oh My Goodness Thread

[mcdonaldrw]

I don't think that was ever going to happen. It would have been more about a 6th for 7th swap and getting some of that base salary off our books so it would roll over into extra cap room for next year

I would have jumped for joy if we could have even gotten a burned grilled cheese for him haha. I mean he already provided the burned toast haha

 

[Discobob]

I can think of soooooooo many things to blame whitt for but jayden being in the game last night isn't one of them.

How is jayden requesting a trade gonna get whitt fired?

Its SO obvious! 🤫

 

[Ghost of Sarge]

The best thing that came out of last night is that Whitt will be coaching high school football this time next year

 

[SkinsNumberOne]

I'll continue to defend Kliff. I think he was outstanding last year, despite all the Kliff Cliff stuff. He's been pushing a greased boulder up a hill all year. There's only so much you can do when you have WRs on the field which can't beat man coverage at all. It allows defenses to man them up, stack the box, and then you can't run, and they bring pressure, and you can't make them pay for it.

There's just no logical answer. Go under center? You'll get hit faster. Run more? Into a 9 man box. Get the ball out quickly? Impossible if your WRs can't get position or separation. There's nothing to do when you don't have anybody on the outside that scares anybody.

I can see him trying differnt things. But he also has to keep things simple, because they're constantly shuffling people in and out of the lineup, from QB down to the OL.

The difference between him and Scott Turner is he is trying stuff. There are nits to pick for sure, and he's not Kyle Shanahan or Andy Reid, but he's a really good OC. And he has a really good offense. Right now, he can't even come close to running it.

Hm - I don't see how anyone can still say he's a really good OC, or he has a really good offense. A really good OC and a really good offense can do better in the last 3 weeks against the teams we played. Some of them are absolutely no slouches (KC and Sea), and one of them is kind of a slouch (Dal). No, a "really good OC" and/or a "really good offense" can do better in the last 3 weeks. You don't get this many "WHOLE games off" as a "really good OC" with a "really good offense."

Kliff is another former QB who is living his QB dreams as an OC. It doesn't work. He wants to win his way. It's not good enough.

Your point about keeping things simple has validity but even there, his scheme has always had characteristics that are present now. Even last year, there were quite a few games that end as big fat Ls without JD scrambling. Those weren't drawn up by Kliff; that was the QB making him look good. So even last year, there were some problems equating the record and the scoring purely with Kliff's scheme.

When you have a RB averaging 5 yards/carry and he was heavily involved on your lone TD drive, most smart OCs keep using him. CRod rode the pine. Why? Most likely because he is the least effective in the passing game. However... he was averaging 5 yards / carry and the eye test told you he was the hot hand. The 3rd quarter is way too early to abandon the run.

We see his all the time, and no more apologies for Kliff.

If you want to see an actual "really good offense," rewatch last night and look at what Kubiak does. That's not just about the defense they were playing; on O and D, it's really hard to ever tell what the Seahawks are doing. That aspect of football shouldn't be considered so hard to figure out; you gain so much with effective disguising, but this team seems completely unable to do that.

That is coaching.

I also think we may have players riding the pine in multiple cases who may be better than dudes we have playing, and that seems really strange. Last year we looked much better with a lot of PI mixed in, with St Juste, Sainristil, and Noah I. This year we look much worse with a lot of PI mixed in, with Lattimore, Sainristil, and Jones. I for one would activate Noah I (especially with Lattimore injured), and have him play with Sainristil and Jones, but I guess we'll see....

One last problem I have: Donatell. Why is he still a coach? In the last year and a half I have seen more PI than I have ever seen in any similar period, and it really looks like there are serious technique issues that I never see so consistently anywhere else. What does Donatell have to do to get fired?

Frankly, I think the coordinators are problems, the HC is a problem, and there are a couple of position coaches who are major problems. I also think that AP is made to look really, really bad as a result of all of the above. We regressed in part because there was a misunderstanding of where our problems really were last year. I think we had more coaching problems than we knew, and that has to fall on the HC.

 

[Voice_of_Reason]

Hm - I don't see how anyone can still say he's a really good OC, or he has a really good offense. A really good OC and a really good offense can do better in the last 3 weeks against the teams we played.

I'm just going to quote this part and say we're going to agree to disagree. I don't think Bill Walsh could have made anything from what Kliff is working with at the moment. He's damned if you do, damned if you don't. Can run, box is stacked. Can't pass, WRs can't beat man coverage. Can't scheme a guy open because it's man and the CB just follows the receiver. Can't roll the QB out because he'll be killed by a blitzing player.

There's just no options available.

Up until 3 weeks ago, even with all of the injuries, Daniels in and out of the lineup, we were still averaging more than 20 points a game. The wheels have come off.

You also flipped from offense to defense in your post. Whitt is in over his head, and I know nothing about Donatell, but his units certainly haven't been good. I'd have no problem moving on from the majority of the defensive staff.

Offensive? They were REALLY good last year with Terry + a bunch of guys. This year, they don't even have that. I personally think you cut Kliff some slack because he showed how good the offense was last year. This year they have no horses. Whitt, on the other hand, had a disappointing unit last year and a horrendous unit this year. So, I think there's enough evidence he's in over his head.

 

[Faithful Fan]

The abominations:
- Leaving Daniels in when the game was open, which isn't hindsight. People on the board and reporters (Sheehan and Nicki J. being the ones I saw) openly said he should be pulled before he got hurt. As Tony Kornheiser used to put it, this is a "gots to go" situation.

This narrative is widespread and it irritates me so much. Jayden was supposedly 100% healthy. This wasn’t a preseason game. I hate thinking our QB is so fragile we have to bench him unless it is a close game that counts. Doesn’t the guy need reps?

Also, there was still a mathematical chance we could win it. If JD scores that TD, then it’s a three possession game with 8 minutes to play. Did anybody criticize Denver’s coach for leaving Bo Nix in the game when he brought his team back from a 32 point hole in the fourth quarter a couple weeks ago?

I just hate this mentality of (a) keeping our QB in bubble wrap because we are scared letting him play will result in injury and (b) giving up on games/seasons before they’re over.

 

[SkinsNumberOne]

The best thing that came out of last night is that Whitt will be coaching high school football this time next year

You sure about that? It depends on a lot of things, it seems. DQ himself as of today is quoted to have said, Whitt is coming down to be on the field.
Also, that the players they have can execute the calls being made, and it's on all of them, coaches and players, to make sure that happens.

That means: the calls are OK, the execution is not, coaching needs to be better to have that happen, and then execution needs to follow.
That is what that means I think. I won't share my opinion for now.

I'm just going to quote this part and say we're going to agree to disagree. I don't think Bill Walsh could have made anything from what Kliff is working with at the moment. He's damned if you do, damned if you don't. Can run, box is stacked. Can't pass, WRs can't beat man coverage. Can't scheme a guy open because it's man and the CB just follows the receiver. Can't roll the QB out because he'll be killed by a blitzing player.

There's just no options available.

Up until 3 weeks ago, even with all of the injuries, Daniels in and out of the lineup, we were still averaging more than 20 points a game. The wheels have come off.

You also flipped from offense to defense in your post. Whitt is in over his head, and I know nothing about Donatell, but his units certainly haven't been good. I'd have no problem moving on from the majority of the defensive staff.

Offensive? They were REALLY good last year with Terry + a bunch of guys. This year, they don't even have that. I personally think you cut Kliff some slack because he showed how good the offense was last year. This year they have no horses. Whitt, on the other hand, had a disappointing unit last year and a horrendous unit this year. So, I think there's enough evidence he's in over his head.

We have agreed to disagree for a while now!

Care to explain CRod riding the pine after being a critical part of that TD drive? He was still healthy you know. He looked really good on that drive. Stats looked positive.
Is it going to be the ol' "we were down too many scores" again? That excuse is dead, it's unacceptable; too many examples of teams coming back big and maintaining a mix.

Believe it or not, Scott Turner *also* had a scheme that QBs liked (Alex Smith reportedly liked it a lot). Kliff has the same characteristic. These are QB friendly schemes. That doesn't mean they are winning-friendly schemes. Last year, there were MANY games (more than one) that had critical 3rd downs saved by JD scrambles. The season just doesn't look the same without that, and that wasn't Kliff's great offense.

I switched points a bit in the spirit of the thread; I know I quoted your post so the offense/Kliff part was intended for you, but I wanted to throw in the team-wide critiques that were most top of mind.

 

[SkinsNumberOne]

This narrative is widespread and it irritates me so much. Jayden was supposedly 100% healthy. This wasn’t a preseason game. I hate thinking our QB is so fragile we have to bench him to play it safe unless it is a close game that counts. Doesn’t the guy need reps?

Also, there was still a mathematical chance we could win it. If JD scores that TD, then it’s a three possession game with 8 minutes to play. Did anybody criticize Denver’s coach for leaving Bo Nix in the game when he brought his team back from a 32 point hole in the fourth quarter a couple weeks ago?

I just hate this mentality of (a) keeping our QB in bubble wrap because we are scared letting him play will result in injury and (b) giving up on games/seasons before they’re over.

Football is a violent, high-risk sport. This isn't bubble-wrap, it's the odds. The risk/reward doesn't work in that situation, that's all.

No he doesn't need those reps, under those circumstances.

 

[skinzplay]

As Keim said, you're either putting the wrong people on the field or you have the wrong people preparing them to be on the field. It's too many instances of the same problems over and over. Sounded to me like he was alluding to the secondary.

Nicki said that was the type of game that gets people fired. Agree, but who and (as importantly) when?

He also had a podcast devoted specifically to "where is the running game".

 

[SkinsNumberOne]

As Keim said, you're either putting the wrong people on the field or you have the wrong people preparing them to be on the field. It's too many instances of the same problems over and over. Sounded to me like he was alluding to the secondary.

Nicki said that was the type of game that gets people fired. Agree, but who and (as importantly) when?

He also had a podcast devoted specifically to "where is the running game".

This is 100% true. It's not all that hard to figure out. Simply stated, 100% correct.

Remember, a lot of investment was made in that OL. They can play better than what we've seen. Scheme is definitely failing them. Technique, maybe, but scheme is failing them.

In 2025 Os and Ds, there are few Os who can just dictate pass/pass/pass and win games. The thing about that also is, can you hide your intentions well? Even if you do something of a run/pass mix, are you able to at least hide what you're doing effectively? Scott Turner struggled with that, and I believe Kliff is right there with them.

I actually think JD has some fault too - but see, again, just as you stated - I think those faults are clear and the kid is so teachable. So teach him. Is that a Pritchard problem? Maybe. But the OC and HC need to see what is... dare I say EASY to see? Yet 3 weeks of the same issues?

 

[CuredFromBatteredFanSyndrome]

This narrative is widespread and it irritates me so much. Jayden was supposedly 100% healthy. This wasn’t a preseason game. I hate thinking our QB is so fragile we have to bench him to play it safe unless it is a close game that counts. Doesn’t the guy need reps?

Also, there was still a mathematical chance we could win it. If JD scores that TD, then it’s a three possession game with 8 minutes to play. Did anybody criticize Denver’s coach for leaving Bo Nix in the game when he brought his team back from a 32 point hole in the fourth quarter a couple weeks ago?

I just hate this mentality of (a) keeping our QB in bubble wrap because we are scared letting him play will result in injury and (b) giving up on games/seasons before they’re over.

It’s rather common for coaches to save a player from themselves in a blowout. The team had just punted from the 50, down 31 in the 4th. There is nothing to be gained and everything to be lost continuing to play your starting quarterback in that scenario.

 

[Faithful Fan]

Good:

1. Throwback uniforms were beautiful
2. Art Monk’s jersey retirement is well deserved, nobody is passing his 888 catches anytime soon
3. Tress Way remains one of the best in the business

Bad:

1. Turnovers and penalties, yet again
2. Defense made Sam Darnold look like a Hall of Fame quarterback, poor pass rush, worse coverage
3. Our rebuilt offensive line can’t pass protect or run block
4. Our receivers can’t get open

Ugly:

1. More injuries, probably season ending for Luke McCaffery and JD5.
2. Season over in week 9, and we only played one good game all year

 

[ImDatGuy]

I would like to see Jayden request a trade.

He shouldn't have been in the game, and he deserves better than this garbage.....and at a minimum, it would cause Whitt to be fired within 24 hours.

This post is stupid as hell, you don't know shit about fuck.

 

[skinsmarydu]

Actually, we've seen proof on multiple levels that this team is appearing to younger fans.

Jerseys in the shopping malls and grocery stores
Kids dressed up as Commanders fans during Halloween
Daniels jersey sales being among NFL top sellers.

So, there's a fanbase ready to go all in on this team if they are given reason. It's just this year, this team has given them no to little reason

We gained 5 members here since yesterday, sooo...

 

[Voice_of_Reason]

This narrative is widespread and it irritates me so much. Jayden was supposedly 100% healthy. This wasn’t a preseason game. I hate thinking our QB is so fragile we have to bench him unless it is a close game that counts. Doesn’t the guy need reps?

Also, there was still a mathematical chance we could win it. If JD scores that TD, then it’s a three possession game with 8 minutes to play. Did anybody criticize Denver’s coach for leaving Bo Nix in the game when he brought his team back from a 32 point hole in the fourth quarter a couple weeks ago?

I just hate this mentality of (a) keeping our QB in bubble wrap because we are scared letting him play will result in injury and (b) giving up on games/seasons before they’re over.

I would say the same thing for literally every single other QB in the league in that situation.

And frankly all starters. If the game is absolutely over in a violent game, discretion is the better part of valor. Get the guys out so there isn’t some freak injury and you lose a guy. I’d say the same for all starters.

I’d the game is over, there’s no reason to risk injury. This isn’t just for Daniels. It’s for literally everybody.

Let’s say Tunsil gets rolled up on down 30 in the 4th quarter and you lose your LT until week 5 of next year because of some dumbass old tough guy stupidity. In my opinion, it’s just dumb.

Get the guys out who you are counting on when the game is over. Teams do this when the game is out of hand when they are winning and have for decades. Do it when you’re losing also.

 

[skinsmarydu]

Voice_of_Reason ... you know how fond of you and your analysis I am..

But dude, you need a proof-reader.


Edit, add: maybe I meant "editor"...

 

[Faithful Fan]

Voice_of_Reason Every quarterback in the same situation? Should Sean Payton have benched Bo Nix when Denver was losing 32-0 in the 4th quarter a couple weeks ago? Was that game absolutely over?

I get pulling guys when it’s over, but it’s not over until it’s over. DQ was right on that edge, but I really don’t blame him. He said he was going to pull them the next series, fine. He said it was a mistake, fine.

Jayden’s hurt and it sucks. Hopefully he is back to full health soon.

 

[skinsmarydu]

Voice_of_Reason Every quarterback in the same situation? Should Sean Payton have benched Bo Nix when Denver was losing 32-0 in the 4th quarter a couple weeks ago? Was that game absolutely over?

Not to shot a bow, but Bo is in better shape (injury-wise).

 

[SkinsFTW]

Voice_of_Reason Every quarterback in the same situation? Should Sean Payton have benched Bo Nix when Denver was losing 32-0 in the 4th quarter a couple weeks ago? Was that game absolutely over?

I get pulling guys when it’s over, but it’s not over until it’s over. DQ was right on that edge, but I really don’t blame him. He said he was going to pull them the next series, fine. He said it was a mistake, fine.

Jayden’s hurt and it sucks. Hopefully he is back to full health soon.

Because Bo Niix and the Donkeys were never losing 32-0.

Remove the revisionist history and you will find that the score was 19-0 and the Broncos made it 19-8.

The Giants never made the Broncos defense look like it was high school level by easily scoring 31 points in the first half and could have easily done it again in the second half.

These 2 things are aren't even remotely the same.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

I would like to see Jayden request a trade.

He shouldn't have been in the game, and he deserves better than this garbage.....and at a minimum, it would cause Whitt to be fired within 24 hours.

How in the world could your star QB requesting a trade be a good thing? Why would any fan root for this? DQ has acknowledged he screwed up by having Jayden in the game, this season was lost long before Daniels got hurt.