Commanders Trade Deadline Thread

[Boone]

Invest? Past prior performance does not guarantee future performance.

Not every move works out. Certainly looking like the Lattimore trade was a bad one, but not yet a certainty.

I agree on your primary McNabbism.

 

[Primus Porcus]

You should always be skeptical when a team gives up a "supposed" shutdown corner because it's very rare to give up one of those in a pass heavy league.
Lattimore was like the hot,crazy chick that some guys look at and think "Yeah she's crazy but I can fix her". And we all know how that works out.....

To be fair, this front office and coaching staff has done it pretty successfully in the short time that they've been here.

Bobby Wagner
Zach Ertz
Austin Ekeler
Javon Kinlaw
Noah Brown
Jameson Crowder
Olamide Zaccheaus
Jeremy McNichols
Nick Allegretti


Most of them have been key contributors and most were considered past their prime. Even if the Lattimore experiment is truly done, NOBODY bats .1000. it's just not a thing. When the trade for Lattimore was made, It was always a 'swing' type of pick. A relatively low investment for what he may be able to be. It's a chance.

 

[method man]

To be fair, this front office and coaching staff has done it pretty successfully in the short time that they've been here.

Bobby Wagner
Zach Ertz
Austin Ekeler
Javon Kinlaw
Noah Brown
Jameson Crowder
Olamide Zaccheaus
Jeremy McNichols
Nick Allegretti


Most of them have been key contributors and most were considered past their prime. Even if the Lattimore experiment is truly done, NOBODY bats .1000. it's just not a thing. When the trade for Lattimore was made, It was always a 'swing' type of pick. A relatively low investment for what he may be able to be. It's a chance.

I liked the trade at the time but not having those three picks really hurt us. With our 3rd, the Saints grabbed Jonas Sanker who would be our best safety this year. They also grabbed Quincy Riley with our 4th. He’s outplayed Lattimore and may end up a future starter

 

[Primus Porcus]

I liked the trade at the time but not having those three picks really hurt us. With our 3rd, the Saints grabbed Jonas Sanker who would be our best safety this year. They also grabbed Quincy Riley with our 4th. He’s outplayed Lattimore and may end up a future starter

Kind of unfair to say we would have even had the same draft strategy. it's one thing to argue what was on the board when we were, but another to look at things in a hindsight argument like we would have taken their exact draft in replacement of Lattimore

 

[DieselPwr44]

To be fair, this front office and coaching staff has done it pretty successfully in the short time that they've been here.

Bobby Wagner
Zach Ertz
Austin Ekeler
Javon Kinlaw
Noah Brown
Jameson Crowder
Olamide Zaccheaus
Jeremy McNichols
Nick Allegretti


Most of them have been key contributors and most were considered past their prime. Even if the Lattimore experiment is truly done, NOBODY bats .1000. it's just not a thing. When the trade for Lattimore was made, It was always a 'swing' type of pick. A relatively low investment for what he may be able to be. It's a chance.

Those were free agents that didn't cost draft capital.
Peters gave up picks for a corner with injury history who most thought was on the decline.

 

[Primus Porcus]

Those were free agents that didn't cost draft capital.
Peters gave up picks for a corner with injury history who most thought was on the decline.

But the mentality was the same. Players most thought were on the decline. If it ultimately doesn’t change course and doesn’t work out it will be a miss, I agree, but i don’t think it’s some egregious failure, the spend was low for what ‘could’ have been. All transactions are based on what can potentially happen.

 

[Boone]

It certainly looks like a miss at present. But if you're Peters, and you're staring at Benjamin St-Juste and Forbes at corner, you have to do SOMETHING. All moves (free agency, trades, draft picks) are calculated risks. And Peters will be judged over time by how many hits he makes and how many whiffs he has. But you can't hit if you don't swing.

 

[Neophyte]

Peters former boss, John Lynch, traded a 3rd round pick to Washington for Chase Young. Peters turned it into Luke McCaffery.

Lynch is the same guy who traded 3 1st rounders and a 3rd to the Dolphins to move up and take Trey Lance.

Lynch is considered one of the best GMs in the league.

NFL front offices are not places for small-balled, weak-willed men lacking confidence. It's place that rewards courage exercised with intelligence. Peters appears to be that kind of guy.

Yeah, the Lattimore move looks like a whiff right now but you know what? He is still better than BSJ or Forbes, even if he hasn't been the shutdown corner we all hoped we were getting.

I'm fine with Adam's cooking so far. I mean, even his misses are edible.

 

[heisenberg]

You should always be skeptical when a team gives up a "supposed" shutdown corner because it's very rare to give up one of those in a pass heavy league.
Lattimore was like the hot,crazy chick that some guys look at and think "Yeah she's crazy but I can fix her". And we all know how that works out.....

Im leary of all trades involving veterans.

it seems to me far more often than not the team acquiring the veteran gets screwed.

high quality young or youngish players just dont become available often through trade or free agency, every team needs as many as they can get their hands on and dont want to let them go so when they are made available for whatever reason im always skeptical and think at best were getting a solid contributor with warts and at worse we're getting a lattimore.

 

[Boone]

That feels right heisenberg. I think things have shifted in the NFL as GMs realize how difficult it is to find cornerstone players and the impetus to retain them long-term when you do find them has really changed the nature of free agency and the trade environment.

I think the Front Office needs to focus on finding them in the draft. And I think that’s the most valid argument to be made for draft over other player acquisition options even if there are no guarantees there either.

I’m moving a lot closer to what burgold has been arguing for awhile as tome goes on.

 

[method man]

Kind of unfair to say we would have even had the same draft strategy. it's one thing to argue what was on the board when we were, but another to look at things in a hindsight argument like we would have taken their exact draft in replacement of Lattimore

I implied my argument was a bit of a hindsight argument but I did have the feeling that this draft was loaded and didn’t buy what the so called experts were saying regarding that given how deep CB, S, RB, DT, WR, EDGE and TE were.

I remember us being very interested in Billy Bowman Jr and we worked him out a few times. He was definitely up there on our board. He would have been a pretty good pick for us in rd 3.

 

[method man]

Peters former boss, John Lynch, traded a 3rd round pick to Washington for Chase Young. Peters turned it into Luke McCaffery.

Lynch is the same guy who traded 3 1st rounders and a 3rd to the Dolphins to move up and take Trey Lance.

Lynch is considered one of the best GMs in the league.

NFL front offices are not places for small-balled, weak-willed men lacking confidence. It's place that rewards courage exercised with intelligence. Peters appears to be that kind of guy.

Yeah, the Lattimore move looks like a whiff right now but you know what? He is still better than BSJ or Forbes, even if he hasn't been the shutdown corner we all hoped we were getting.

I'm fine with Adam's cooking so far. I mean, even his misses are edible.

The Niners also had a lot of picks going into the 2024 draft and traded away a 3rd comp pick to make a real run at a Super Bowl. Different situation (and Chase did deliver for them in the Super Bowl)

I don’t think anyone had an issue with the trade at the time. As skinsinparadise calls out, the issue was keeping him this year vs cutting him after he clearly looked cooked. Cutting him and moving on would have been the courageous move

 

[method man]

Back to topic, who are the desperate GMs who need to aggressively buy to try to keep their jobs? For me, Poles is the obvious mark and they may actually want Lattimore

 

[RexTomb]

Back to topic, who are the desperate GMs who need to aggressively buy to try to keep their jobs? For me, Poles is the obvious mark and they may actually want Lattimore

A 4th would be so worth it.

 

[Neophyte]

The Niners also had a lot of picks going into the 2024 draft and traded away a 3rd comp pick to make a real run at a Super Bowl. Different situation (and Chase did deliver for them in the Super Bowl)

I don’t think anyone had an issue with the trade at the time. As skinsinparadise calls out, the issue was keeping him this year vs cutting him after he clearly looked cooked. Cutting him and moving on would have been the courageous move

Lordy, I love how we fans rewrite history.

Yeah, Lattimore didn't look good last year but he was injured and we all knew he was injured. For me, that trade was this year and next, not last year. I HOPED Lattimore could contribute last year but I never really exected it. So cutting him before he had an off-season to get right physicall would have been crazy.

As for Young, he had a sack in the Super Bowl but he didn't deliver. He was the same guy, half assing it while chasing the ball that we saw the last two years here in DC. The dude has started all of 2 two games since that trade and those 2 were for the Saints this year. You want to talk about cooked? Young makes Lattimore's contributions look like those of an All Pro.

 

[Chris]

I had an issue with the trade when it happened and was quite vocal about it. I think most were focused on the player he used to be vs the player he actually was. His history was readily apparent.

That said, I understand the impetus to address an unquestioned need at that point in a surprising situational time. I still think that help in the position down the stretch was paramount in Peter’s thinking. Lattimore was just not the right choice given the circumstances of both his current physical condition at the time or his performance over recent history. Luckily even though the draft capital is forever gone the financial burden is not a concern beyond this season.

 

[Simeon]

How about we trade a first and third to get a shutdown Defensive Coordinator? That might actually make a difference.

😃

 

[burgold]

I was frustrated with the trade once I realized he wasn't playing because he was actually hurt and not disgruntled. I mean it's one thing to trade for a guy to get you over the top because the season is turning into something special, but it's another thing to trade for someone to get you over the top who is unavailable and can't help you. I really thought that (like some other players) Lattimore was not playing because he wanted out and his old team chose to respect his wishes for a trade and so sat him. This makes me think someone either lied to Peters or he was too optimistic.

After we traded for him, Lattimore basically sat out for a month, even though we needed him for the playoff push. After that, he was barely serviceable/able to play during the playoff run. That's a failure in due diligence. The fact that it hasn't really worked out in the long or short term makes it worse.

I do reserve a tiny bit of doubt that Lattimore would look better in a different scheme or with a different play caller and that him playing with backup safeties and our fourth and fifth defensive ends as starters makes it hard for him to succeed, but again, part of the reason we have less talent is because he was supposed to be that talent. He was supposed to be worth multiple highish draft picks.

 

[Voice_of_Reason]

- Keeping a player like Deebo going into his 30s is a bad bad move. It’s not just the injury history but everyone is forgetting the weight issues too. We are seeing contract year Deebo this season. I would move him and use the money on an emerging young player like Wan’dale or Shaheed instead

I'm not sure. It's going to be a question of cost and length. One way or the other, I think they should also be going after younger guys as well, because both Terry and Deebo are getting older. But you can do both.

- You can make similar arguments about Lattimore. We’ve had our back and forth about PFF but his PFF grade and other advanced metrics were solid when we traded for him. It’s the same player as last year but healthier this go around. I think the league knows our scheme is trash. There are also a lot of NO alums around the league like Payton, Campbell and Allen who may want him

Lattimore won't be here, but nobody is going to trade for him.

- We’ve discussed this before but Payne is not a $28m salary next year to the team that acquires him. It is $17.5M. If the team that acquires him sees him as a difference making near Pro Bowl caliber player, that’s solid value even if you don’t extend him

It's true. However, I'm not sure what the value is. A 3rd for a contender? Probably not a second.

- I am not moving Coleman for a pick unless someone offers a 3rd, which we are not getting, but I’d listen to player for player trades. The Browns, for example, desperately need a left tackle. I’d swap Coleman for Isaiah McGuire, for example. McGuire is on his rookie deal in year 3 and probably gets an extension this offseason

We might get a 3rd for him. He was a 3rd round pick who played LT last year. You never know. The question is if he is in the plans down the road. If he is, then you keep him. If he isn't, then you move him.

 

[Voice_of_Reason]

Invest? Past prior performance does not guarantee future performance.

Not every move works out. Certainly looking like the Lattimore trade was a bad one, but not yet a certainty.

I agree on your primary McNabbism.

Man, it would take a heck of a turnaround at this point to make the Lattimore trade not look like a bad one. I supported the move, and still think it was the right thing to do at the time. But it hasn't worked out. Shrug, that happens.