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The unpleasant truth

Washington Taylor beat Panthers

Rymanofthenorth

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UTEP


We are not a good team, we were not one player away from being playoff contenders and we wont be good this year and probably next year. the problems on this team are not quick fixes.

the reasons
1- we brought in an offensive coordinator who is brilliant at being an OC and has shown almost nothing as a head coach and less than nothing as a management guy, we needed an OC and iinstead we were forced to give shanahan full control and he has crapped the bed. his player decisions have been head scratchers, yeah we have had a few hits but we had way more costly misses.

2- we brought ina 4-3 guy to oversee a change to the 3-4, then on top of that we waited a year to make any changes in personelle, THEN we pretty much had 100% TURNOVER on defence spending valuable resources for almost no improvement. (yeah we are so much better than the year we ran the 3-4 with 4-3 guys, so what? we are approximately the same as we were running the Blah 4-3.

3-We didnt committ to a youth movement right off the bat, we recycled other teams old guys.

4-we made bad moves in free agency, these were not balanced by the few really great moves.

5-why is it that fans with no access to scouting reports or NFL film, have been calling out these missteps and guys getting 6 figures keep making them?


Bottom line is that we need to see some improvement, some vast improvement or I think we need to find an OC who is willing to work with RG3, find a real DC and let him choose his own scheme, find a special teams coach who isnt all reputation and no go. keep Bruce allen as I think with some more power he will be fine, and get a HC who is willing to grow with a young team.

im not gonna yell for shannys head YET but a few more weeks of garbage like this and I wont be shy.
 

Goaldeje

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James Madison

Mostly agree, Ry. I am willing to grant a little patience with Kyle, because when he is on his game, he calls a brilliant game. One of the best game callers I have seen in a while, when he reins himself in.

I wouldn't shed a tear if we fired Haz tomorrow, or Smith for that matter. I think we need to shake some **** up and get some people's attention. And in order to do that, we may need a sacrifical lamb. If it's Haz, I'm good with that. His gameplans and lack of adjustments have been brutal so far.
 

Bulldog

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the truth is that Jordan Black is not an NFL tackle. Not at age 29 and having been out of the NFL for the past season. coming back at 270 to play in the NFL when he was an average player at his best at 295 a couple of years ago?

was a disaster waiting to happen if any injuries hit with Trent. Bingo!

to be honest, though, Tyler Polumbus made his guy look like a HOFer as well.

the Bengals are a mid-tier team who were better than their start on defense, but still not a top 5 unit.

the Redskins made them look that way all afternoon.

inside the Redskins are merely average with Montgomery, Chester, and Lichtensteiger.

these guys would be backups on most NFL playoff caliber rosters.

On defense, the cornerback position here is as poor as it has ever been in my experience.

even when the Redskins were not a very good team overall in the past we had a Champ Bailey, Darrell Green, Lemar Parrish, etc. on the outside.

this unit is awful. worst in the NFL. one can wonder why the only move there was to sign Cedric Griffin who had been TOAST in Minnesota last year.

At 30 and coming off two ACL reconstructions, Griffin was supposed to be new and improved in Washington?

Let's face it, LeRibeus now looks like a wasted pick. He couldn't really compete with Montgomery or an 80% Lichtensteiger for a spot inside and is firmly seated on the bench.

If there is an injury no doubt the team will reach for Maurice Hurt first and then Adam Gettis.

LeRibeus is only going to see the field in an extreme emergency.

We could have signed 35 year old Jeff Faine to be a backup center to Montgomery and used that high #3 pick on a cornerback, tackle or safety.

Poor Robert Griffin. Here the media and commentators talked about his transition to the NFL and what he has to learn.

Well, one of the first things he has learned is he has no protection up front and will be lucky to make it through the season.
 

Henry

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This team still has holes. We knew this going in. We all wondered why our front office ignored the OL and the secondary and it shouldn't come as a huge shock that those units are killing us now. This is a rebuilding team. I know we all wanted to pretend it wasn't but it is. I'm not down on things because of this. Some things look good. Griffin looks like the real deal. Our receivers make plays. Our RBs look good. Our front seven, even with the injuries, looks stout against the run and occasionally disrupts the other team into making mistakes. We don't turn the ball over. Areas that were once holes are now filled and in some cases strengths. Next offseason we can concentrate on the secondary and the line without worrying about other spots, and then I think we can expect a truly competitive team.

This is Year Two of a three year rebuild. While I agree with Ryman that Shanahan's first year was a waste and we are still paying for that, I disagree that it's time to start calling for heads to roll. I seriously doubt anyone would accuse me of being an optimist on this board ... just yesterday I said eight wins would be a good season. But I'm not upset at what I'm seeing. We're not finished yet and it shows.
 

Bulldog

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Yeah, but I think there is a difference between simply having holes that need to be addressed in the future and running a scheme and selecting players for it that simply fails and the 'holes' that are there are as much due to the pre-conceived ideas on who to run the scheme as they are about mechanically identifying and drafting OL next April.

For some reason Kyle Shanahan thought bringing Jordan Black back to the NFL out of a year long retirement was a better option than other NFLers available over the summer.

No doubt it was because he was familar with the scheme.

But knowing the scheme does not equal performance on the field.

Just ask Rex Grossman or John Beck.

This organization has to be honest with itself and recognize that what it has done on the OL and CB on defense has FAILED and new ways of doing business are called for.
 

Henry

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Honestly, Griffin is good enough that we can get away with a crappy line. Our offense is putting up 24+ points a game, every game. That's not the production of a scheme ill-suited to it's players. So in that area yes, it's simply a hole that needs to be addressed in the future. Would I have like to have seen us address the OL? Yes. Could we have? Yes again. But I don't think that's going to do us in this year.

The secondary was always gonna kill us, but now with two key starters already out for the season on the front seven our defense is going to be absolutely unwatchable. We are going to lose a lot of games like this. Hell we going to before we lost Orakpo and Carriker. Now I think it's safe to say we're going to be this year's Carolina Panthers.
 

Bulldog

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I think you are laboring under a misconception. I don't think that Shanahan looks at the OL as a unit where he HAS to necessary spend specific picks or sign name veteran free agents to fill.

He honestly seems to believe he can find capable players on the waiver wire or as 6th or 7th round draft picks and just have them work to improve.

meanwhile the limited cupboard allows for the moves for a Josh Morgan, a player judging by the first 3 games we really don't need.

notice how we always carry 7 or 8 wide receivers on the club and go short on the OL and in the backfield? :)

has a way of catching up doesn't it?
 

tshile

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disagree. our entire organization was overhauled starting 3 years ago.

we're a secondary and an o line away from being pretty competitive. then we need a big name WR.

our lb core is the best it's been in a while. our wr's, while not perfect, are also better than they've been in a while. same with our d line. our QB is better than we've had in a real long time. this is the best coaching staff we've had in a long time too.

we're closer than you think. we have a terrible secondary. we knew that before the season even started. teams are exposing it. this should not be a shock, we knew this would happen going into the season.

in related news, the saints lost again and are 0-3. yeah, that week 1 win is looking less and less impressive. i think i mentioned that being a pretty good possibility after the win and was shot down for being wrong.
 

Bulldog

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$42M - I hope Pierre Garcon is the 'big' name receiver we need :laugh:

we can't afford to spend another $40M on another player at WR under the cap.

yes, great that in 3 plus years we have been able to fortify linebacker with #1, #4, #4 picks from the draft, including Orakpo as a former #1 in 2009 and the continued leadership of London Fletcher.

we need to be more efficient in player acquisition if we are going to field a competitive 53 man roster before I am ready for Social Security :laugh:
 

Henry

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BD,

I think Shanahan has been trying to fill the OL with late round picks as he's been using his high picks and FA money on other holes. I think he's rolling the dice in that area in favor of other areas because the team had so many needs. I think now that those other needs are filled he will address the OL next offseason. Again, not the way I'd have built the team, but if we are putting up over three TDs a game and leading the league in scoring until that area gets addressed I'll consider it a small quibble.

The OL is weak but offense really really isn't our problem at the moment.
 

Boone

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That's true only if you consider scoring the only goal Henry.

Not getting your mega-million dollar, cost us three 1st round picks, star QB killed is another goal. And for that, you need to have some kind of an offensive line. There may be reasons why we couldn't build a star o-line to date, but BD is right in that the team could have done more in that area (the unnecessary move to get Morgan being a prime example).
 

Henry

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Griffin's a guy that's going to take a ton of hits regardless of how good his line is. It's the type of player he is. We're going to run him 8-10 times a game and run that option another 5-10 times. Pressures and sacks are not going to do this guy in. Not as much as the game the way he plays it will. This is the guy we drafted. We will live and die with Griffin playing Griffin's game. If we didn't want our QB to get smacked around we should have drafted someone else.
 
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redskins76

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why wasn't there any adjustment made at halftime ? rg3 kept getting hit just about every play , why not use extra blockers TE"S or both backs chip a lil ...
 

Hog Fever

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I hate to paraphrase Dennis Green but "We are who we thought we would be".

We thought the offense would be better with Griffin at the helm. I'd say 99 points in the first three games is pretty damn good. In addition we seem to have found a RB that we can count on in Morris. All this and we've only had our number one receiver for less than a half of football this season. We haven't made every play but I'd say the offense is fine. What more could we ask for honestly (other than Griff not needing or being asked to run so much)?

The defense is another story but it's what we thought it would be as well. We thought the front seven would be our strength and that they'd have to make a lot of big plays to cover for a suspect secondary. That hasn't happened with enough regularity to make much difference. Losing Orakpo and Carriker doesn't help. Our rushing defense is top ten but our passing defense is 31st in the league.

The OL is not a strength of the team but it isn't killing us like the secondary is. As others have mentioned outside of the trick stuff the Bengals pulled at the start of the game teams aren't doing anything special to beat us. I'm a glass half full type guy but I haven't seen a defensive backfield this bad....well, ever. We simply lack the talent or coaching in the defensive backfield for those guys to put up much of a fight. If we play zone we get scorched, if we play man we get scorched. That just about covers it right? Wish I had the answer but it looks like if we're going to win ball games this season we aren't going to be able to count on the defense to help much. The same Rams who scored 31 on us last week scored 6 points against the Bears this week. Jeez...
 

Henry

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why wasn't there any adjustment made at halftime ? rg3 kept getting hit just about every play , why not use extra blockers TE"S or both backs chip a lil ...
The offense scored three points in the first half (off a huge kickoff return from Banks) and 21 points in the second half. I think some adjustments were made at halftime.

Sent from my SGH-T959V using Tapatalk 2
 

Boone

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Henry - I think the point several are trying to make is that there's more to an 'improved offense' than scoring points. I think we're all happy that we're scoring. But this offensive group is going to get Griffin killed. He won't make it through a 16 game schedule with the kind of punishment he's taking.
 

Yusuf06

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I honestly don't know which is worse, our OL or our defensive backfield. At the very least the OL seems to be able to get us some production in the running game.

However we need to greatly reduce the triple option stuff or we're going to get RGIII killed. It should be a few plays a game type thing designed to give the opposition something else to worry about, not the bread and butter of our offense. If we keep relying on option runs this way the hits RGIII is taking from the lack of pass protection will probably be the least of our worries.

As for the secondary, I seem to remember mentioning the fact that even though Carlos Rogers wasn't the best thing since sliced bread we simply didn't have the draft picks to be able to replace him and shouldn't create another hole. Even if he was still playing the Edward Stonehands role, he'd be head and shoulders above anyone we've got back there now.
 

stevenaa

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This team still has holes. We knew this going in. We all wondered why our front office ignored the OL and the secondary and it shouldn't come as a huge shock that those units are killing us now. This is a rebuilding team. I know we all wanted to pretend it wasn't but it is. I'm not down on things because of this. Some things look good. Griffin looks like the real deal. Our receivers make plays. Our RBs look good. Our front seven, even with the injuries, looks stout against the run and occasionally disrupts the other team into making mistakes. We don't turn the ball over. Areas that were once holes are now filled and in some cases strengths. Next offseason we can concentrate on the secondary and the line without worrying about other spots, and then I think we can expect a truly competitive team.

This is Year Two of a three year rebuild. While I agree with Ryman that Shanahan's first year was a waste and we are still paying for that, I disagree that it's time to start calling for heads to roll. I seriously doubt anyone would accuse me of being an optimist on this board ... just yesterday I said eight wins would be a good season. But I'm not upset at what I'm seeing. We're not finished yet and it shows.

My sentiments exactly. We're 2 years out. I think the cap mess hurt tremendously. Though I'm really out on Haslett.
 

China

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Henry - I think the point several are trying to make is that there's more to an 'improved offense' than scoring points. I think we're all happy that we're scoring. But this offensive group is going to get Griffin killed. He won't make it through a 16 game schedule with the kind of punishment he's taking.
Well they better stop running the option then. One of the hardest hits he took today was on the option.
 

Ax

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why wasn't there any adjustment made at halftime ? rg3 kept getting hit just about every play , why not use extra blockers TE"S or both backs chip a lil ...
Because our coaching staff is weaker than our Oline, and more poorly schemed than our secondary.

Better coaching/scheming would make up for some of the lack of talent in those areas. Our coaching/scheming only accentuates it.
 

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