Redskins Get #2 Pick!

You know, the most interesting thing Bruce Allen said yesterday was that he was pleased that we have had 18 draft picks over the past two years. Its working according to plan. Not sure if that had been mentioned yet but a significant point on how Bruce and Coach look at things.

Plus, I agree, looks like the Rams will be picking in the lower part of the round for the next few years with those picks.
 
Neo,
Donovan Mcrapp, rex grossman, John Beck, Chase Daniels,Jason Campbell. those were all mistakes made by Shanny judging qbs RECENTLY.how many hall of fame qbs has Shanny drafted? how many pobowlers? I am pretty sure he made his bones as a qb evaluator when he was an OC but his missteps here have me really questioning his evaluation skills.

By all reports, McNabb is really the only one you can lay on Mike. Kyle recommended bringing in Rex because he was free and knew the system. Kyle was the one gushing about Beck and urging that Houston draft him when he came out of college. Chase Daniels was brought in and let go by the Zorn/Cerrato mess so Mike wasn't even involved. I don't know who didn't like Jason so that might be Mike or it might be Kyle but the point there is after years I think we all knew what we had with Campbell and while he would have been better than Rex, he would have stayed just good enough to break our hearts.

Mike did do pretty well with guys named Greise, Plummer and Cutler in Denver though and had he had a defensive coordinator with anything up there the last couple of years, I think he would still be the coach there.

Our Oline was terrible, we playe ok against weak Dlines against dcent Dlines, we got no push, got dominated on short yards and never delivered in the clutch, we have a barely adequate LT, weak guards a solid center and a RT who is done.

After Kory went down and we were struggling to find a replacement, sure. I totally agree. Early in the year we did pretty well and late in the year it all seemed to come back together. We kept the Giants and the Cowboys in check, for heaven's sake, and those are two of the best pass rushes in the league. Williams might be considered "barely adequate" to you but I'm fine with him as the only sacks Ware has on us since Williams got here have come from the right side.

we dont have terrible receivers but they arent great, to me they hinge on hankerson being healthy, which an acl is rarely ok until the second year after.

Hankerson does not have an ACL injury. It is a torn labrum in his right hip. And I never said out receivers are great but they were still running open in the secondary and the guy charged with throwing them the ball failed more often than not. Great is not a requirement for me, open is and they guys were getting that. Now if Griffin starts delivering the ball on target and guys are dropping it, I will happily revisit this topic.

I am genuinely hoping this kid has a Newton type season, but thats ONE guy who has done that.

Hardly one guy. Andy Dalton had a great season this last year too. Sam Bradford had a pretty solid rookie outing for the Rams two years ago. Ponder did fairly well and on a team that is arguably worse then we are even though we lost to them. Josh Freeman had a great season as rookie.

Wake up, man. This is not the league of the 70s and 80s where QBs come in still needing to learn their craft because they ran the Wishbone and had 10 completions on 15 attempts for a season. These kids throw the ball and are expected to read defenses. There is a reason rookies are doing a better job these days and its because they are more ready then at any other time in league history. Newton was not an exception last year except that he posted a new QB record for rushing TDs. In fact, Dalton's numbers are nearly identical to Newton's except for Yards Per Catch but Cam was throwing to Steve Smith, a seriously wily veteran.

I don't see why either Griffin or Luck can't do much the same thing for the Skins.
 
the whole " there are two franchise qbs" argument is bunk, I believe Lanky showed that its extremely rare for the top 2 qbs drafted in any draft to both pan out let alone become Probowlers. yeah the market was inflated, thats a major reason why this was such a terrible deal, you dont pay what people want, you pay what you can afford. we arent exactly deep and filled with talent, I don't know what part of that relatively simple logic you dont grasp is. We overpaid, not just a small amount but a massive amount. the move is desperation personified, last year was how you rebuild, you draft bpa but you trade down if bpa doesnt fit and stockpile picks to fill needs with the remaining bpa. someone else said something brilliant it would be great if we now traded the second for a boatload of picks.

Ridiculous. Each draft is it's own entity and each player his own man. Sure, it is wise to take a look at history but it cannot rule you. Each guy has to be evaluated on his own merits. Assuming that Griffin will be a bust because Luck is a sure fire franchise guy is about as faulty as logic can get.

And there is absolutely no way to know if we overpaid right now or not. Zero. It is your opinion and that is fine but it is not a fact. Would I have preferred to get him for less? Oh yeah. Would I have given more? Very possible but then I am all in on this kid.

I know we will be lucky to win 8 games next year, but you and I both know, after the most recent run we have had, that the pressure on this kid is going to be massive. If you spend 3 firsts on a player and a second, you better be getting a guy who is not just THE man but a difference maker who takes you to the playoffs. Nailing down the position for a decade is worthless of we dont put some weapons around this kid and protect him. David Carr was a cant miss prospect, Alex Smith was a cant miss prospect. I am not saying we need an immediate superbowl, I am saying we need playoffs, and a rookie of the year performance or this kid is gonna get crucified, the second pick is already under pressure, now its gonna be even more massive.

The pressure was on when he got to Baylor too. In fact, even before he got to Baylor. He committed there before the end of his senior year in high school and one of his high school playoff games was at Floyd Casey Stadium on the Baylor campus. Baylor students and fans came out in droves to see him play and treated him like a savior for their program. He appears to delivered just fine. Under pressure.
 
Neo,
Donovan Mcrapp, rex grossman, John Beck, Chase Daniels,Jason Campbell. those were all mistakes made by Shanny judging qbs RECENTLY.how many hall of fame qbs has Shanny drafted? how many pobowlers?

I am genuinely hoping this kid has a Newton type season, but thats ONE guy who has done that.

A Newton type season? Oh you mean a season where so-called experts and knowitalls (Terry Bradshaw, Skip Bayless,etc) had to eat crow from Game 1 on after saying how much he was going to suck and he lit up the place?

I was one of those brilliant fans who hoped for promising results from our young players but to a point that we were in position to draft Luck or RGIII (Suck for Luck or Awfull for RGIII) instead of the typical mediocre record that has us out of the top 3.

There was no way in Hades that the fanbase was going to accept another retread or bandaid under center.
 
Do I need to spell out how all of the sniveling on this topic describes those in the minority?

realview.jpg


But even that is okay because the RGIII or Luck Bandwagon will have plenty of space for all of you before and during the regular season. :) :D
 
I think the issue with QB was a lot of bad luck. The only one that I would put on Shanny was Beck. McNabb was done... I mean DONE. However, the fact that he also had no interest in learning a new offense once he got here had a lot to do with it too. A lot of the signs that McNabb was going down hill was probably in practice so Reid knew to get rid of him. Grossman is what he has always been, sometimes he looks like an NFL QB and other times he doesn't. As far as Campbell and Chase Daniels just because they look good one offense doesn't mean they will look good in others. Besides Chase Daniels is still a backup in New Orleans. Now Mr. John Beck is completely Shanahan fault. Through his arrogance he thought he could make this guy into a starter. Yeah, he was dead wrong.
 
At some point you have to stop fearing the past and fearing the unknown. We're fans. We have no tangible stake in the successes and failures of a football team, other than our emotional involvement. If you are so jaded and fearful that you can't enjoy each season as it's owns entity on some level, and leave behind the past, why even be a fan. There's no fun in that. Screw the past. The past != the future. Damn the torpedos full speed ahead.

This does not feel like the futile efforts of past mega signings, and RG3 feels as much the real deal as we've hoped to land in many decades. Heck yeah he could bust, but I'll be smacked upside the head if I'm gonna worry about that. I'm gonna enjoy the process, the potential, and the ride. I'm sitting hear dreaming of RG3 throwing accurate passes. Heck, I'm not sure I'll know an accurate pass when I see one, it's been so freaking long. The prospect of watching a game and not cringing with fret every single time our QB drops back to pass is liberating. I'm so tired of expecting failure at that position. Everyone touts his arm strength, accuracy and smarts. He's the freaking Anti Rex.

With decent QB play last year, we would have been in the playoff hunt. Simple as that. I don't expect RG to go out and shoulder this team right away, but he certainly does have the potential to fill that role. There's not a true professional who is making a cogent argument otherwise. From what I'm seeing the consensus is that if he is what he seems to be, the trade cost is easily worth it.

This article perfectly outlines the reason and why it's worth it.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/1099355-washington-redskins-trading-for-robert-griffin-iii-is-a-well-calculated-risk


The days of committing $40 million to unproven draft choices are gone, so even if Griffin is not as advertised and becomes the next JaMarcus Russell, then the Redskins can simply reboot in three years time, essentially in the same position as they are now.
 
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I've been watching highlights of RG3 and getting goosebumps just thinking about him in B&G. I realize that I've been watching highlights not whole games, but a couple of things about him jumped out at me that refute the two most common complaints about him.

"But he's just a running QB" Yes, he is a running QB. However unlike Vick he throws an incredibly accurate, catchable ball. In many cases he throws his receivers open by making passes to to an area where only the receiver has a shot at catching it. Those kind of passes trump coverage every time. In that sense, I think he compares more favorably to this guy (**special shout out to you Ryman) than Vick.

Moreover, in looking at many of his scrambles, he's frequently not just tucking the ball and taking off, instead he's keeping his eyes down the field, buying time and passing the ball...with deadly accuracy. That he completed 72% of his passes while throwing deep as much as he did is just amazing.

"He's going to get crushed in the NFL". It's certainly a risk. However what I'm seeing is that he's the anti-Mike Vick when it comes to running style. RG3 avoids contact not only with speed and moves, but also by running out of bounds and sliding when necessary. This is something Vick still has yet to learn.

Yes, we gave up a LOT to get the second pick but I think he'll prove to be worth it. Aside from my goosebumps, the stats (i.e. Lewin Forecast 2.0) bear it out as well. Quite frankly I'm hoping that Irsay has his heart so set on Luck that he doesn't pay much attention to film of RG3. Either way though, whether it's Luck or RG3 I think the chances are damn good that we're finally in business at the QB position.
 
<best Seth Meyers/Amy Poehler voice>

Really? Really?

Come on Ryman, don't do that ****, you're better than that.


Its called a joke, I believe Boone is about 5 years older than me, he insinuated I would stop being a fan before him, since the only way I will stop being a fan involves a dirt nap I took a shot at his advanced age.
 
Ok few things,

1-when I watch film to predict things, I go by a few different things an amalgamation of stats, film, scouting reports and impressions from scouts I respect. I do look at precedent, I can clearly recall the last time there were 2 QB's who were thought of as cant miss guys, Rivers and manning both turned out to be pretty good but not worth 3 firsts and a second, then you go back to the time before and you see one HOF guy and one guy who was perhaps a bust on the level of jamarcus Russel. same thing with when I rank players or try to prognosticate their careers I look at where they played and who they played, for one thing RG3 came from the big 12 I cannot think of any good pro QB's from the big 12 in the past 20 years, Bradford thus far has been decent. I cannot think of any QB's other than Newton who are Black QB's who had a decent first few years as QB;s barring my favourite player Warren Moon who went to the cfl for 5 years first, I don't know why, I know its not simply skin colour but it is what it is and when millions of dollars are at stake you look at EVERYTHING. I cant think of any QB's who had ridiculous stats in weak conferences who came in and lit it up in the NFL either, the windows are so much smaller.

2- Oline, we couldnt run to the left, Chris Chester was terible as well, he got owned a LOT on short yards, he is simply too weak to be effective as more than a back up. our Pass pro was not very good either, blame Rex all you want but Rex didnt call the plays or protections. TW was flat out awful a few games as well. our Oline played well a couple times, but never put together a run like the great Olines do.Lick is a great backup but shouldnt be a starter, monty improved a lot over the year but I think he is a marginal starter who flashes.

to the people who dont see the corelation between this and the Mcrapp move? really?
Mcrapp was signed because Shanny knew that the biggest problem on this team was offence, campbell was younger, healthier and would have been a better choice to stay with as he wouldnt have cost a second rounder, but the FANS were fed up with dink and dunk and were very vocal about it, Shanny looked at Mcrapp and saw a guy who physically looked a lot like elway, strong arm, fairly mobile, but didnt see the downsides , not smart, didnt pick up offences well and basically was uninterested in doing anything but being the focal point. But we gave up a second because the FANS were loud about wanting a new guy. It was strictly a win now, get the fans onside move. it flopped but on paper it looked ok but expensive.

We just gave up 3 firsts and a second to get Rg3 why? because as several people in this thread have just said " the fans didnt want any more retreads" so screw the fact that we wasted a year on revamping the defence, screw the fact that last year we actually did start building a real foundation, and screw the fact that another year like last year would actually have us set up with a strong team and actual depth for the first time since 1992, WE GOTTA GET A QB and WE GOTTA GET HIM NOW. whereas if we could have used one more draft and free agency period like last season and added more youth and skill, we would be taking the long view.

I am amused at all the hyperbole surrounding Luck and RG3 ,remember 2 years ago, Jake locker THE BEST PROSPECT SINCE MANNING last year Bradford (barring injuries) best prospect in 10 years blah blah, a few years before that David Carr, a few years before that? someone else. I am not swayed by Rg3's numbers, look at Graham Harrel, or Colt mcoy. Now granted, RG3 would seem to be the perfect player as he is also smart, and of good character, but 3 firsts and a second is a high cost even for a sure thing, let alone a risky chance.
 
I have to wonder if the Browns were close to pulling the trigger for a similar deal, and adding in 2014's first round pick was the only way to get this thing done.
 
I have to wonder if the Browns were close to pulling the trigger for a similar deal, and adding in 2014's first round pick was the only way to get this thing done.

Nope. From everything on Twitters and the Interwebz, the Rams pretty much told everyone they would NOT play bidders against each other, and would instead accept everyone's top offer by Thursday at the close of business. Apparently, we had the best offer at that point, so the Rams agreed to do the trade with us. The Browns, it is rumored, came back with a slightly better offer after that deadline, but the Rams told them they weren't playing teams against each other AND they already agreed with us, so the deal was done.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/peter_king/03/12/freeagency/1.html
 
Nope. From everything on Twitters and the Interwebz, the Rams pretty much told everyone they would NOT play bidders against each other, and would instead accept everyone's top offer by Thursday at the close of business. Apparently, we had the best offer at that point, so the Rams agreed to do the trade with us. The Browns, it is rumored, came back with a slightly better offer after that deadline, but the Rams told them they weren't playing teams against each other AND they already agreed with us, so the deal was done.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/peter_king/03/12/freeagency/1.html
Might also be a benefit of Shanny and Fischer's friendship/respect.
 
Nope. From everything on Twitters and the Interwebz, the Rams pretty much told everyone they would NOT play bidders against each other, and would instead accept everyone's top offer by Thursday at the close of business. Apparently, we had the best offer at that point, so the Rams agreed to do the trade with us. The Browns, it is rumored, came back with a slightly better offer after that deadline, but the Rams told them they weren't playing teams against each other AND they already agreed with us, so the deal was done.

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2012/writers/peter_king/03/12/freeagency/1.html

Interesting! Cheers to us.
 
Ryman - I was the one who did the research on the top 2 QBs to be drafted. However, what if Luck is the bust? At this point, its still a 50/50 shot. Nobody wants to talk about Luck being the bust - he's a more "guaranteed" thing than RG3 is at this point.

For the record, I think he'll be a superstar for the Colts for 14 years just like Manning was - but there is still the potential that HE is the one who doesn't live up to the hype.
 
Might also be a benefit of Shanny and Fischer's friendship/respect.

That's what I thought too Ax, but I've seen a couple of different articles saying that the GM of the Rams had much, much more to do with this trade than Fisher did.

Of course, I can't find those articles now to link to, but they were there, I swear...

:)
 
Ryman - I was the one who did the research on the top 2 QBs to be drafted. However, what if Luck is the bust? At this point, its still a 50/50 shot. Nobody wants to talk about Luck being the bust - he's a more "guaranteed" thing than RG3 is at this point.

For the record, I think he'll be a superstar for the Colts for 14 years just like Manning was - but there is still the potential that HE is the one who doesn't live up to the hype.


that's what they said bout blain gabbert last year ...that he was tha most pro ready QB , but cam newton proved them wrong ...just saying these experts may know tha draft ... but there not scouts, they go off what tha video they watch say ...they could both be bust ( i hope not )for are sake..it depends what tha team does to make them excell..personally i think were better position then tha colts ...there o line shot and no WR , so 50/50 i'll take that :eclipsee_Victoria:
 
Ryman - I was the one who did the research on the top 2 QBs to be drafted. However, what if Luck is the bust? At this point, its still a 50/50 shot. Nobody wants to talk about Luck being the bust - he's a more "guaranteed" thing than RG3 is at this point.

For the record, I think he'll be a superstar for the Colts for 14 years just like Manning was - but there is still the potential that HE is the one who doesn't live up to the hype.

absolutely
 

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