Random NFL Thoughts

I think he is referencing Art.
Meaning: tough beans, now you (nfl in general) know how it feels when someone stupidly is kept out.

The voters are very, very good…. at proving how stupid they can be.
I know. I was being sarcastic.
 
I can't agree with that. There is no reasonable justification for not putting him through on the first ballot. First of all, 90% of the hate Belichick and the Patriots get is pure jealousy. They dominated the NFL in ways no one had seen since the Packers in the 60's and the 49ers in the 80's. And it wasn't ALL just Tom Brady.

I get people have a problem with the supposed 'cheating' but I think a lot of that is overblown and even what did occur was dealt with as the NFL saw fit at the time. That should not be a legitimate barrier to giving one of the greatest NFL coaches of all time his due.

I think it's embarrassing (and not for Bill Belichick, but for the NFL).
Yeah it was pretty much mostly Brady. He showed that by going to Tampa and winning another ring while the Pats fell to 10-7 that year. Of course BB is a Hall of Famer but let's not forget he was 48-59 in New England without Brady. They lacked personnel post Brady but BB was in charge of personnel.

I get the outrage, I really do. His resume speaks for itself. The next vote won't be until August 2026 and he's 73, you know where I'm going here. But a voter explained he had only 3 votes and with some running out of time he felt required to vote for them. I get that too.
 
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Brady aside, Belichick has the most Super Bowl wins as a HC in history (6) plus two more as a DC. To not put him in the HOF as soon as eligible is ludicrous.
 
Not only that, delaying it in some pathetic attempt to ‘make a statement’ means some other guy has to wait for his moment in the spotlight. It’s just wrong.
 
Babe Ruth was not a unanimous vote. That tells me voters have an agenda, which I agree is wrong. I'm not as worked up as you guys are because I believe BB is overrated and I stated my case. But to not vote for him because he was nasty to the media or spygate is just wrong.

I always thought those cheating scandals were overblown, just as I felt that way about the Houston Astros sign stealing. Every team is trying to get an edge and they all do this sort of thing to some extent.
 
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Not only that, delaying it in some pathetic attempt to ‘make a statement’ means some other guy has to wait for his moment in the spotlight. It’s just wrong.
It could also mean someone who has been waiting and is running out of eligibility finally gets in too.
 
Not following your logic DGF. They've whittled it down to finalists. When someone doesn't get the votes, they are pushed to the next year, which likely pushes someone else out another year. They don't substitute someone in at that point (at least not to my understanding).
 
I thought it was wrong not to vote Belechick in this time until I was reminded about spygate and deflategate (although deflategate might have been more Brady). IMO Spygate is enough to leave Belechick out the first time.
 
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I thought is was wrong not to vote Belechick in this time until I was reminded about spygate and deflategate (although deflategate might have been more Brady). IMO Spygate is enough to leave Belechick out the first time.
I am not super worried about it in either direction. I think the argument for putting him in is clear, because spygate was one year and supposedly he was punished. The Hall weirdly takes it upon themselves to punish him again? What helps processes like this have credibility is some kind of criteria that is consistently followed. This is where things break down badly, I think there are plenty of players who are known to take some competitive advantages in the Hall.

It is a weird, awkward line.

Taking a step back at a personal level, I tend to agree with you Ashburn Dave - guys who are known to have cheated can be kept out for one year, for me, I have no complaint. It is an awkward slope to stand on realistically.
 
Whatever transgression Belichick and the Patriots committed, the NFL dealt with it at that time. To refresh your all's memory, for 'Spygate' Belichick was fined half a million dollars (larghest NFL coach fine ever at the time) and the team was also fined and they surrendered a 1st round draft pick. For 'Deflategate' they were fined a million dollars (the biggest NFL fine ever at the time), gave up a 1st and 4th round pick, and Brady was suspended for 4 games.
 
Not following your logic DGF. They've whittled it down to finalists. When someone doesn't get the votes, they are pushed to the next year, which likely pushes someone else out another year. They don't substitute someone in at that point (at least not to my understanding).
I'm simply following the logic shared by a voter. He said he voted for Craig, Anderson and Greenwood because they were running out of time and he only got 3 votes. If he voted for BB maybe Kenny Anderson never gets in or at the least has to wait another year.
 
Whatever transgression Belichick and the Patriots committed, the NFL dealt with it at that time. To refresh your all's memory, for 'Spygate' Belichick was fined half a million dollars (larghest NFL coach fine ever at the time) and the team was also fined and they surrendered a 1st round draft pick. For 'Deflategate' they were fined a million dollars (the biggest NFL fine ever at the time), gave up a 1st and 4th round pick, and Brady was suspended for 4 games.

Belichick cheated. Just because the NFL already punished him doesn't erase the fact that he cheated to win some of those SB's. Winning those SB's is what gets him into the HOF. His legacy will always be tainted regardless of him already being punished.

He is worthy of the HOF but not on the first ballet due to him being a cheat.

Sorry, cheating to win just isn't something I take lightly.
 
Well, of course you have the right to your opinion brother. I guess my question would be - do you REALLY believe Belichick, Brady, and the Patriots dominated the NFL because they 'cheated'?

I don't.
 
This is why it's best not to cheat on any level. There is no practical way to determine how many SB's he would have won if he hadn't cheated.

Brady is the biggest reason why NE won all those SB's so maybe NE wins all of them regardless of the cheating. We'll never know.

Belichick is a great coach and worthy of the HOF but not a first ballot though, due to his cheating which it sounds like the HOF agrees with.

PS - I also hate Belichick ever since he dropped 50+ points on us during Gibbs II. Belichick was classless in that game.
 
It could also mean someone who has been waiting and is running out of eligibility finally gets in too.
This is true of at least one HoF voter. I believe this is the article you were mentioning. https://www.kansascity.com/sports/spt-columns-blogs/vahe-gregorian/article314488692.html
But here’s how it unfolded for me during a discussion I entered with an open mind for the third spot, while figuring I’d definitely vote for Belichick and Craig, the trailblazing three-time Super Bowl champion who was on the NFL All-Decade team in the 1980s. (When I became a Hall of Fame voter in 2021, I was astonished to realize Craig wasn’t already in.)

As the presentations and discussions proceeded, I found myself wanting to vote for all five — including Steelers great Greenwood, a four-time Super Bowl champ who was All-Decade in the 1970s, and Bengals quarterback Anderson, the 1981 MVP who led the league in passer rating four times. All three have been long deserving of induction in the Hall. All three have been, well, snubbed for decades. As it came time to cast the vote, I found myself thinking not just of them but of the experiences of recent senior semifinalists and finalists who didn’t make it.

........

In the last two years, under the new system fused together with the coach and contributor candidates, only three of the six senior nominees have made it through to the Hall. None of the three who were stopped short, including Tyrer, resurfaced on the next year’s ballot. All of that went into why I felt duty-bound to vote for the richly deserving seniors, who most likely won’t ever have a hearing again as more senior candidates enter the pool and fresh cases get made for others.

Meanwhile, Belichick is inevitable soon … as he should be. At the risk of contradicting my own vote, really, he shouldn’t even have to wait. I understand why people are offended that he isn’t going in the first moment he can. In the end, though, I felt more compelled by what I perceive to be last chances and looming lost causes within the system as we have it — a system I hope the Hall will see fit to change now.
 
That may explain his vote (or it may be cover after the backlash post-vote) but we all know why Belichick did not get voted in on the first ballot.
 
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