QB or not QB

Daniels to me is the highest risk of being a bust of the top 3.

He may have great upside IF everything goes his way. That assumes he develops physically and learns to protect himself.

But the other factor that gnaws at me re Daniels is the talent level on offense that he was surrounded by in that one year of great production.

Any quarterback with two potential #1 picks on the outside and time to throw from the pocket is supposed to be DAMN productive in college :LOL:
 
I don't generally watch college football. I don't like the game. It's slow, the offenses are terrible, the defenses are worse. The best thing about it is the atmosphere. Which is incredible. But the games, eh.

I watched the Ohio State vs. Michigan game because I had family in town. And they live in Ann Arbor and bleed blue. About halfway through the second quarter, I turned to my relative and said, "team is great. Your QB is very not great." I will admit, at that time, I'm not sure i even knew his name.

And then all of a sudden, all of these things started coming out about McCarthy challenging for one of the top spots, or a great deal in a trade down. So I decided to take a look. I watched every play of the Michigan vs. Alabama game and took notes.

Bottom line up front: He stinks. Based on my 2 games watching him. One very closely, one not as closely.

Other thoughts:
- He's late to throw a lot even though he's looking right at the receiver which is his primary read.
- While he was 16/23, at least 8 of his completions were screens or balls that traveled less than 10 yards in the air.
- He didn't pre-read the field at all. He was told where to throw the ball, and for the most part, did. The best example was on a 3rd and 9. The receiver to the right was CLEARLY 1:1, there wasn't a second defender within 15 yards. The CB was playing press-man. If McCarthy recognized this, and again, it's 3rd and 9 and you have a 1:1, that's a win for a QB from a read perspective, they would have had a TD. The WR chucked the CB on his ass. If McCarthy just moon balls one out there, it's a first down at worst, and a TD at best. Never looked at it pre-snap or post snap. Threw directly to a TE who was covered and immediately tackled.
- On another third down and 8, he was looking directly at a crosser running completely free wide open 4 yard short of the sticks, turned it down, presumably because it was short of the sticks. Pressure came, he bailed the pocket, ran right, and threw underneath to another receiver who was 4 yards short of the sticks who was tackled. If you're going to turn down the easy throw to the short guy who's on the move in the pattern of the play, you can't bail and then check it down.
- He has to wait for receivers to make their break to throw the ball.
- Michigan schemed some guys so wide open, most HS QBs could hit them.
- His best play was a modified flea-flicker where he threw the ball to a receiver to his right, who threw it back to him and then he threw the ball down field. The problem was the pass back to him was atrocious, and he had to jump up and catch it, then organize himself to make his throw, both of which he did very well.
- Whenever he threw deep to the outside, the ball was late, slow and high. BAD BAD BAD.
- He had 3 plays which were either completions for big yards or an incomplete which would have ended up with his receiver being escorted to the blue tent after the ball was intercepted in the NFL. (Unless JDR was coordinating the defense, then it might have been ok.)

Overall, the tape stunk. Just awful. I am going to go do the same thing for Maye an Daniels at some point this week. I'm not going to bother with Williams. He's going to be picked by the Bears.
 
Hey Fellas...Russell Wilson's available!

Animated GIF
 
For shits and giggles let’s compare the 2 seasons of Joe Burrow at LSU playing with Justin Jefferson, Ja’Marr Chase, and Clyde Edwards-Helaire vs Jayden Daniels playing with Malik Nabors and Brian Thomas, Jr.

Burrow

Games played- 28
Attempts- 906
Completions- 621
Yards- 8565
Completion %- 68.5%
YPA- 9.45
YPC- 13.79
TDs- 76
INT- 11
TD/INT Rate- 1.2

Daniels

Games played- 26
Attempts- 715
Completions- 502
Yards- 6725
Completion %- 70%
YPA- 9.40
YPC- 13.39
TDs- 57
INT- 7
TD/INT Rate- 0.9

Rushing (because why not?)

Burrow- 767 yds 12 TD
Daniels- 2019 yds 21 TD
 
I don't generally watch college football. I don't like the game. It's slow, the offenses are terrible, the defenses are worse. The best thing about it is the atmosphere. Which is incredible. But the games, eh.

I watched the Ohio State vs. Michigan game because I had family in town. And they live in Ann Arbor and bleed blue. About halfway through the second quarter, I turned to my relative and said, "team is great. Your QB is very not great." I will admit, at that time, I'm not sure i even knew his name.

And then all of a sudden, all of these things started coming out about McCarthy challenging for one of the top spots, or a great deal in a trade down. So I decided to take a look. I watched every play of the Michigan vs. Alabama game and took notes.

Bottom line up front: He stinks. Based on my 2 games watching him. One very closely, one not as closely.

Other thoughts:
- He's late to throw a lot even though he's looking right at the receiver which is his primary read.
- While he was 16/23, at least 8 of his completions were screens or balls that traveled less than 10 yards in the air.
- He didn't pre-read the field at all. He was told where to throw the ball, and for the most part, did. The best example was on a 3rd and 9. The receiver to the right was CLEARLY 1:1, there wasn't a second defender within 15 yards. The CB was playing press-man. If McCarthy recognized this, and again, it's 3rd and 9 and you have a 1:1, that's a win for a QB from a read perspective, they would have had a TD. The WR chucked the CB on his ass. If McCarthy just moon balls one out there, it's a first down at worst, and a TD at best. Never looked at it pre-snap or post snap. Threw directly to a TE who was covered and immediately tackled.
- On another third down and 8, he was looking directly at a crosser running completely free wide open 4 yard short of the sticks, turned it down, presumably because it was short of the sticks. Pressure came, he bailed the pocket, ran right, and threw underneath to another receiver who was 4 yards short of the sticks who was tackled. If you're going to turn down the easy throw to the short guy who's on the move in the pattern of the play, you can't bail and then check it down.
- He has to wait for receivers to make their break to throw the ball.
- Michigan schemed some guys so wide open, most HS QBs could hit them.
- His best play was a modified flea-flicker where he threw the ball to a receiver to his right, who threw it back to him and then he threw the ball down field. The problem was the pass back to him was atrocious, and he had to jump up and catch it, then organize himself to make his throw, both of which he did very well.
- Whenever he threw deep to the outside, the ball was late, slow and high. BAD BAD BAD.
- He had 3 plays which were either completions for big yards or an incomplete which would have ended up with his receiver being escorted to the blue tent after the ball was intercepted in the NFL. (Unless JDR was coordinating the defense, then it might have been ok.)

Overall, the tape stunk. Just awful. I am going to go do the same thing for Maye an Daniels at some point this week. I'm not going to bother with Williams. He's going to be picked by the Bears.

I appreciate you taking the time to watch a game, form an opinion, and share it rather than falling back on easier things (preconceived notions, biases, personal suppositions, highlight videos, and media talking heads (who probably didn’t watch film either). Thanks 👊🏼
 
I realize I’m coming off as a Daniels fanboy recently but that is not a reality. I have previously posted a long and detailed film evaluation of his play across 2 complete games. (Spoiler alert- my review was definitely not a glowing one.)

That said, Drake Maye is not at Jayden Daniels level. He just isn’t. Don’t believe me? Watch a game. Start will his final game vs powerhouse NC State.
 
Boy, that 4.4 speed as a rusher is almost more important to some folks than a quarterback's ability to read the field and throw the football with the right footwork and accuracy under pressure.

If Daniels had the physical conditioning of Nix or McCarthy, no one would be salivating over him like they are.
 
So you’re just going to ignore the fact that Daniels pretty much matched Burrow over 2 years as a passer playing with high-level NFL talent?

Ok 🤣
 
Burrow to me just like Penix has INTANGIBLES when I watch him play that elevates his teammates. It's something to be seen from watching a game in real time and not on highlights or as a result of a combine cone drill.

It was no surprise to me that Burrow elevates the Bengals as a team every time he is out there in the NFL.

Meanwhile, Dwayne Haskins who 'beat him out' at Ohio State had none of those characteristics.

Some folks have it, some don't.

Justin Fields threw for 350 plus yards in a game or two as I recall this past year but overall his play is defined at this point to a great degree by his feet.

And what is Chicago doing? Shopping him after taking him in the first round a couple of years ago.

Caleb Williams to me is also a player that has intangibles. My problem with him is his very high ego and need for attention. But that may just be immaturity that he will work his way out of at the next level in short order.
 
I realize I’m coming off as a Daniels fanboy recently but that is not a reality. I have previously posted a long and detailed film evaluation of his play across 2 complete games. (Spoiler alert- my review was definitely not a glowing one.)

That said, Drake Maye is not at Jayden Daniels level. He just isn’t. Don’t believe me? Watch a game. Start will his final game vs powerhouse NC State.
Maye is better by quite a bit . Daniels has two 1st round wr on the team and a solid OLine and didn't elevate the team. Maye had a crappy Oline no wr and used his abilities to drag the team forward.
What you also have to take into account is that Maye is 21 and Daniels is 23. In College Football that two years for a QB is a big difference. Look at Daniels and Mayes 20-21 year seasons, Maye was better at that age .


Daniels 19-21 years stats

CMPATTCMP%YDSAVGTDINTLNGRTG
19730165.42,3807.9101065136.2
498458.37018.35174145.7
20533860.72,9438.717286149.2

Maye 19-21 stats

CMPATTCMP%YDSAVGTDINTLNGRTG
26942563.33,6088.524977149.0
34251766.24,3218.438780157.9
71070.0898.91046177.8
 
I remember Bill Parcells saying that the best way to get fired as a GM is to go strictly off college statistics when evaluating a player for the NFL draft.

Quarterbacks, running backs, wide receivers that lead the nation in statistical categories or put up gaudy numbers in offenses that throw all the time are often NOT a great fit at the next level.

Its the PROJECTION of talent that is the art form for NFL GMs.

If it was just a matter of saying that 'X' quarterback threw 51 touchdowns and 4 interceptions and 'Y' quarterback threw 39 touchdowns and 6 interceptions, so therefore we draft 'X' quarterback - then the whole process would be a lot easier, wouldn't it?
 
I often wonder if Parcells or any of the artful GMs watched any game film. I bet they just may have.

Maye was thoroughly outplayed in his final game as a college QB by Brennan Armstrong.

Who?

Exactly.
 
Peters isn't bringing either of those quarterbacks to Washington.

Cousins because he thinks he's still worth $40M plus in a 100% guaranteed deal and Wilson because he clearly seems to have had issues in his last couple of seasons in Seattle and then in Denver in getting along with coaches and his teammates.

In re Wilson, if you take a look at what the Capitals are going through with Evgeny Kutznetsov, the last thing you want is an entitled player whose actions show him to be a locker room cancer.

I would trade the #2 pick to Jacksonville for Trevor Lawrence though. Some Jags fans evidently want to trade him away :cool:
 
The team really has three choices
1 pick a qb at 2 and try to build around that qb
2 trade back get more picks and get a tackle projected to be a day 1 starter and go with howell and if howell fails like last season get a qb or if howell improves they may be able to get in the playoffs
3 trade back get more picks and get a tackle projected to be a day 1 starter and then go with a vet qb that fits the system they want to run and try to get in the playoffs with a deep run
 
How about we trade back, pick up a franchise LT, then draft a quarterback and let that player compete with Howell?

Then we use the bevy of extra picks to get a TE, pass rushing DE, cover linebacker and safety?

It's my own bias admittedly but I think while there are 5 or 6 quarterbacks identified as likely to go in Round 1 or Round 2, Washington can get value by taking a Penix Jr. or Nix late in the first or second and continuing to build the roster.

All of the top 3 quarterbacks have positives and negatives. But there is no 100% prospect like John Elway, Peyton Manning or Andrew Luck sitting there waiting to be taken in 2024.

If you look at 1983 after Elway we had a lot of quarterbacks taken in Round 1, in fact a record number.

But it was the LAST one picked at #27, Dan Marino, that along with Elway became the Hall of Famer.

The rest? Some were serviceable, some were busts, a guy like Kenny O'Brien had one or two really excellent seasons but no staying power over the course of a career.

That could very well happen here in 2024 where a McCarthy, Penix, Nix becomes one of the better quarterbacks and one or two of the first 3 picks is either a serviceable starter or bust.

Of that Williams/Maye/Daniels grouping, chances are ONE of those players is the real deal in terms of developing into an elite quarterback in the NFL.

The fact there is so much debate about them to me says beauty is in the eye of the beholder.
 
So if New England offered their 3rd pick and their 2nd round pick this year and next years 1 and 2 would you trade back one spot?
 
It's funny because a lot of the noise I have seen online about New England is talk of moving down and taking McCarthy at #8 in a trade with Atlanta and using the extra picks to draft a left tackle and playmaking wide receiver.

Seems they have a lot of the same thoughts we do :rotflmao: :rotflmao:
 

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