Haskins - Going Forward

[Kel Varnsen]

In my lifetime, they've went from a team with a Coach who could take a player that wasn't polished or perfect, figure out that players strengths and use them to their advantage and win with them.......to a team with coaches that give up on players after 11 weeks and only seem to be able to work with players that come prepackaged,ready to play that were coached up by somebody else.

I agree with this. One of my biggest criticisms of this organization is that they don’t use players to maximize their strengths. But in this case, the issue seems to be less about coaching and more about following the coaching. So the best coaches in the world won’t help if the player is not on board.

 

[SilentThreat]

In my lifetime, they've went from a team with a Coach who could take a player that wasn't polished or perfect, figure out that players strengths and use them to their advantage and win with them.......to a team with coaches that give up on players after 11 weeks and only seem to be able to work with players that come prepackaged,ready to play that were coached up by somebody else.

It is very frustrating, but Rivera and co are only 5 games in... I dont think it's fair to lump them into the previous regime's shortcomings. Rivera has proven in the past to adjust team to talent... see Cam Newton and Christian McCaffrey. Hes had 1 offseason and cant fix it all, hell... hes probably just now getting a clearer picture of what talent he has.

 

[Boone]

There’s no such thing as ‘this team’ - that’s a fan creation since we have suffered sustained pain. I say that because nearly the entire org is brand new.

If Haskins was a blown pick, the best thing that can happen is for the team to move on as quickly as possible. Holding onto him and hoping he proves everyone wrong so you don’t have to admit it was a mistake drafting him is not necessarily the smart move.

Ultimately moving on from Haskins will be judged on whether he has significant NFL success down the road, and nothing else.

 

[SilentThreat]

And we can't continue to complain that we 'can't hit on QBs' because the current regime hasn't drafted one yet.

 

[SilentThreat]

btw...

 

[Boone]

That tweet by Ross Tucker is dumb. Quite possible Haskins really does have a virus. Anyone who’s gotten a bad GI big knows it can last awhile. The only reason this is news is because of speculation he’s faking illness to avoid being there.

 

[SilentThreat]

That tweet by Ross Tucker is dumb. Quite possible Haskins really does have a virus. Anyone who’s gotten a bad GI big knows it can last awhile. The only reason this is news is because of speculation he’s faking illness to avoid being there.

It's what we're all thinking....

and in the middle of a pandemic a player missing 5 days of practice due to an illness, it's going to be news worthy... hence the reason every report states 'not believed to be Covid related'

 

[Boone]

It's what we're all thinking....

and in the middle of a pandemic a player missing 5 days of practice due to an illness, it's going to be news worthy... hence the reason every report states 'not believed to be Covid related'

Oh I agree. But it is possible all that speculation is dead wrong and he’s really sick. The stress of last week would in and of itself make him prone to getting sick. Just sayin’...

 

[SilentThreat]

 

[Henry]

There’s no such thing as ‘this team’ - that’s a fan creation since we have suffered sustained pain. I say that because nearly the entire org is brand new.

Are you suggesting five games isn't enough time to rush to such a judgement?

 

[Boone]

The theme of almost all of DP’s recent posts has been that this new regime is just a continuation of a long parade of dysfunctional leadership. That’s the context in which I’m replying to his post. If you guys (I mean those that are actually watching the games that is) want to characterize the benching of Haskins as horribly misguided, premature, or just bad management of a young QB - that’s fine.

Im suggesting that Rivera may have good reason not to stick with and groom Haskins that go beyond being a stubborn, vindictive, or impatient prick, or just a clueless head coach.

We are also all assuming they’ll drop or trade Haskins. Maybe they will - my money’s on that - but it’s also possible they like his ceiling but are trying to assist him in growing up and getting his head out of his ass.

 

[Burgundy Burner]

I'll go with the third paragraph.

 

[SilentThreat]

It's a continuation of people viewing the team saying. "We should never draft a WR in the first two rounds because we haven't been able to do it ever"

WELL... the people who swung and missed on Michael Westbrook, Devin Thomas, and Malcolm Kelley are not the same people evaluating Ja'marr Chase or Jaylen Waddle. To say 'this team has been so bad at 'X' for however long is an inaccurate argument... because it's not the same people making the decisions.

 

[Henry]

The theme of almost all of DP’s recent posts has been that this new regime is just a continuation of a long parade of dysfunctional leadership. That’s the context in which I’m replying to his post. If you guys (I mean those that are actually watching the games that is) want to characterize the benching of Haskins as horribly misguided, premature, or just bad management of a young QB - that’s fine.

Im suggesting that Rivera may have good reason not to stick with and groom Haskins that go beyond being a stubborn, vindictive, or impatient prick, or just a clueless head coach.

We are also all assuming they’ll drop or trade Haskins. Maybe they will - my money’s on that - but it’s also possible they like his ceiling but are trying to assist him in growing up and getting his head out of his ass.

That is absolutely a fair point.

The only thing I can say is, insert "Shanahan" or "Spurrier" or "Gibbs" or "Gruden" for "Rivera" and we've had this exact same conversation for 20 years. I mean, literally the same conversation. I think that is what makes this team 'this team'.

Just like Snyder has tried every different type of coach, from the college coach to the rookie coordinator to the old proven guy, so also has the team done with the QBs. They've traded for vets, they've drafted high first first round, low first round, later round ... brought in all manner of journeymen. The result is always the same. Our coach knows something and that guy has to go. And that guy. And the next guy. And each one has a bad attitude and didn't try and never got along with anyone. Every. Single. Time. That's this team.

My attitude at this point is until things are different, they aren't. This is not different. And I think that's a totally fair position to take as well.

 

[Boone]

I get that - you know I do. But I’ll argue your point about QBs. It’s true that we have not been able to draft or trade for a franchise QB in too long to even quantify. We feel doomed on that front. BUT our good coaches have made the right call on the QBs who they had at their disposal. Gibbs immediately benched Patrick Ramsey who, while a great kid, was never going to be anything other than an ‘ok’ NFL QB. Mark Brunell was past his prime, but even so was good enough to help us win games and get back to the playoffs again. Shanahan quickly figured out that RG3 was pretty much a 1 trick pony. When he tried to move on it cost him his job, but he knew Cousins had more potential. When a 2nd coach in Gruden came to the same conclusion, we moved on.

Yes - the QB position has largely been a debacle. And Snyder’s ugly little meddling hands may be plastered in his pockets for now - but how long will that last?

I‘M basing my ‘reserve judgment’ position on a couple things. Rivera has a history of success and competence and being able to groom a QB. Haskins has a history (at least at this level) of inconsistent play and questionable maturity. If in Rivera’s mind Haskins either isn’t close to being ready now, or if he thinks he’ll never be -he’s getting the benefit of the doubt from me.

 

[DieselPwr44]

The theme of almost all of DP’s recent posts has been that this new regime is just a continuation of a long parade of dysfunctional leadership. That’s the context in which I’m replying to his post. If you guys (I mean those that are actually watching the games that is) want to characterize the benching of Haskins as horribly misguided, premature, or just bad management of a young QB - that’s fine.

Im suggesting that Rivera may have good reason not to stick with and groom Haskins that go beyond being a stubborn, vindictive, or impatient prick, or just a clueless head coach.

We are also all assuming they’ll drop or trade Haskins. Maybe they will - my money’s on that - but it’s also possible they like his ceiling but are trying to assist him in growing up and getting his head out of his ass.

Nope.
My theme is that the staff has given up on a young player too quickly.

Now, Ron says he hasn't given up on Haskins but now you have all these rumors about moving him at the trade deadline, Ron's not discussing any football business..etc., so we'll see.
But the idea that you'd give up on a Qb and ship him out after 11 weeks(if that turns out to be true)....well, would be a pretty big red flag for me.
Especially after all we've ever heard about Ron is how he connects to players and helps them.

The only thing we do not know is if Haskins personally offended Ron and his staff in some way and if it eventually comes out that's what he did, I'd agree he needed to be moved. But if they move him because they feel they don't have the time to develop him? As Sam Beckett would say....

Oh boy......

 

[Bulldog]

The problem is Snyder. His history of meddling at specifically the quarterback position is a major reason this team has been a loser.

Signing of Jeff George in 2000 - a true locker room cancer who was cut by Marty after 3 games in 2001. Meanwhile Brad Johnson leaves here and goes on to win a Super Bowl in Tampa.

Trade for Donovan McNabb 2010 - an owner inspired deal for a 34 year old qb his coach didn’t want and his OC couldn’t hide his declining skills. Any Reid steals picks from us we need to improve.

Decision to draft Robert Griffin III 2012 - the owner announced he had flown down to Baylor and scouted Robert himself. So, the team traded a generation of draft picks to move up slots in Round 1 and take a player that had never played under center or ran a system with any degree of complexity under Briles. Then, after Griffin was injured and came back to play horribly in 2013 and 2014 as a newly minted pocket passer it took team coaches 4 hours to convince Snyder what Doc Walker has said for two years, namely that Kirk Cousins should be the starter.

Handling of Cousins contract - we all can disagree on whether Cousins deserved the rich deal he ultimately was looking for but to be unable to turn a productive asset into more than a compensatory #3 pick was a crime. Once again Snyder and his henchman Bruce Allen carried on for months they had it all down and Allen indicated a deal would eventually get done. The entire NFL laughed at this one. Cost the team a #1 pick in trade compensation all to succor Allen and Snyders egos that ‘ no one dictates to us the terms of a deal’, etc.

Trade and extension of Alex Smith - it’s not necessarily the trade that set the team back but the fact the HC learned about the deal from the radio and the team then gave Smith an extension as if he were a 28 year old entering his prime were head scratchers. Smith had proven with a much better team in KC than he had here that he didn’t win the big games, losing in Round 1 four years and having that meltdown against the Titans in his last start.

Selection of Dwayne Haskins in 2019 - let’s face it Urban Meyer’s offense at Ohio State was probably less complex than some high school programs. It definitely didn’t prepare anyone for the NFL. Burrow had to leave to be developed.

Dwayne was the owner’s public choice and it was clear Gruden didn’t assume any responsibility for the first round pick. That selection made no sense given the team’s decision to bring Gruden back for another year and not move on to a rebuild.

So there Dwayne sat and no doubt made his own situation worse by sulking and tuning out the veterans like Peterson that told him he had to work harder in this league.

With a 3-13 loser that saw no fan support Snyder was finally ready to jettison Bruce Allen and 52 of the players to bring in a new regime.

The holdup? That 53rd player, Haskins, Snyder had made a personal crusade to defend and partly to satisfy his own ego wanted to hear a new coach/GM would give Haskins a chance and himself a chance to stick up a middle finger at the pundits that lampooned the owner making his own picks.

I wish Rivera would have told Snyder the truth about what he truly thought and refused to accept the package deal. But I am not sure at that point Snyder would hire any coach who didn’t agree to keep #7.

Once again as usual there was something on the table more important than winning for Snyder - his insistence on turning the tables on his critics and having the last laugh as Haskins would go on and validate his actions in 2019.

 

[Kel Varnsen]

Looks like Haskins wasn't too sick to go to a soccer game yesterday:



I'm not sure what's the worse joke. The one I made or the fact that they put him in the stands with all that is going on with him right now.

 

[Bulldog]

Haskins like his sponsor Dan Snyder is a $3 bill.

These guys are both insecure and to protect themselves project an over confident and even arrogant face to the world outside.

 

[SilentThreat]

Haskins back in the building