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Fred Davis: See You Later Gator

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Lanky Livingston

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Not sure that decline is about age - also possible it is about scheme, coaching staff, supporting cast, or even loss of confidence. Point well taken on Winfield's age though...he would obviously be a stopgap pickup at his age.
I will have to find it, but I read an article that looked a lot of CBs production once they hit 30, and how it declines rather sharply. The author predicted Asomugah wouldn't play well in Philly, as he was hitting the 30-year mark. I will do some digging...

EDIT: but yes, scheme, etc. could play a big part in that as well.
 
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servumtuum

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I got curious and started digging for stats relating to the Davis vs. Paulsen question -(big surprise, huh? :)) and found a site that was nice enough to have compiled things like passes dropped, drop percentages and the like and here's what I found.

Logan Paulsen-Targeted 37 times, 24 receptions, 3 dropped passes, drop percentage 8.11%

Fred Davis-Targeted 32 times, 24 receptions, 2 dropped passes, drop percentage 6.25%.

Source: http://www.sportingcharts.com/nfl/stats/drops/2012/

Digging further, in an effort to put these numbers in a more performance indicative context.

Logan Paulsen-308 yards receiving, 12.3 yds/reception, 113 yards after the catch, 1 TD, 17 first downs.

Fred Davis-325 yards receiving, 13.5 yds/reception, 139 yards after the catch, 0 TDs, 17 first downs.

Source: http://espn.go.com/nfl/statistics/player/_/stat/receiving/sort/receivingTargets/qualified/false/count/161

These numbers obviously don't tell the entire story but they do at least give somewhat of an indication of comparative contribution to the passing offense.

Davis, unfortunately has a problem with judgement regarding the use of recreational drugs that carries with it an added risk that I, personally, am not altogether comfortable with and he seems to be a bit of an "underachiever" in terms of actual performance versus potential ability, IMO, which leans me toward the position of his being expendable-especially if we could con some other team into actually giving us something of value for him.
 

Bulldog

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IMO Davis is using the Bills to up the ante on Washington. No one us going to offer Davis a multi-year deal for big bucks so he is looking for another audition for dollars in 2014.

When you compare the qbs in Washington with those in Buffalo Davis can see his stats for 2013 are going to look a lot better here.

And that is what translates into dollars.

That said the Redskins I think have to evaluate Davis not just as an athlete but as an all around player. There are enough questions mitigating against just begging him to return.
 

Henry

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I dont pay much attention to offseason posturing durIng negotiations. Happens all the time and largely means nothing.

We will either resign Davis or we wont. Either way I wont be pulling my hair out over the guy.

... but lets not fool ourselves. Hes a lot better than Paulsen. A lot better. Paulsen is a backup, which is why his numbers over sixteen games are similar to Davis' number in just seven.

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Fear The Spear

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I dont pay much attention to offseason posturing durIng negotiations. Happens all the time and largely means nothing.
What it DOES mean is that it's foreshadowing that Davis will take even bigger potshots against the Skins than the typical bitter ex-Redskin, when he leaves town for another team, than if he wasn't making such extreme statements. Not that that means much, either :)
 

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... but lets not fool ourselves. Hes a lot better than Paulson. A lot better.

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Normally I would agree but apparently not in this offense. According to the numbers in Serv's post above, these two guys are a statistical dead heat in this offense which gives Paulson the advantage because he is cheaper and apparently wiser.
 

Henry

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Normally I would agree but apparently not in this offense. According to the numbers in Serv's post above, these two guys are a statistical dead heat in this offense which gives Paulson the advantage because he is cheaper and apparently wiser.
Again Paulsen amassed his numbers in over twice as many games, including three more starts. Paulsen averaged 19 yards a game to Davis' 46.

And sorry, theres no way Paulsen only dropped three passes all season.

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Fear The Spear

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Well, considering that Paulsen is also playing next to the "future Shannon Sharpe", that can only make him better as a player, both from a mentoring aspect, and the fact that our "Shannon Sharpe's" double-teams mean single coverage for Paulsen, which means danger for every defense we face :D
 

Henry

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And im not saying I want Davis back, but lets not talk ourselves into thinking Paulsens as good. Hes a sold backup who was pressed into service and did ok. But wed be better with a starting calibre TE in there, be it Davis or someone else.

Thats all Im saying.

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Again Paulsen amassed his numbers in over twice as many games, including three more starts. Paulsen averaged 19 yards a game to Davis' 46.
Remember, Davis was playing without Garçon, who is clearly Griff's favorite target. There were more balls available for the TE when Garçon was sidelined than there were after, which is supported by the number of targets each got per game. What they did with those targets is a dead heat.

And sorry, theres no way Paulsen only dropped three passes all season.
I kinda scratched my head over this as well. Perhaps it is just the importance of the drops that Paulson had...?
 

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I think fansince hit the nail on the head. Logan Paulsen is no replacement for Davis...I believe we need to do that with the 2nd or 3rd round pick. I believe Paulsen is the bruiser who will do anything but is best as a compliment to a speedier guy. I just hope we can find someone with the goods and is at least 6'5". These prototypes (Graham, Gronkowski) are the future of the position. You don't need blazing speed, just fast enough with size and hands to make the ILB's in the league sweat when they run down the field.

Sleepy just needs to go. We have one more season of low expectations...after this season we will likely be the creme de le creme of the NFC East and near the top in the NFC. This season we still have obstacles so we should draft a youngster to fill the receiver TE we desperately need and give them a year to grow. Bringing Sleepy back is a step in the wrong direction.
 

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I can't believe how obsessed this fan base is about the tight end position.

If we acquire a starting corner and starting tackle in the draft there will be someone bemoaning the fact we didn't snag a top tight end.

We went 10-6 last year with Moss making most of the grabs TEs do on other clubs.

If our qb doesn't get hurt and we have a better secondary we beat Seattle and may be go deep into the playoffs.

Stop obsessing about Davis and TE.

RT, CB are much more important to the teams fortunes in 2013 along with the return to health of our walking wounded.
 

Henry

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If I were obsessed wth Davis I'd have started a thread about him. All I said was I could take him or leave him and that we shouldnt rely on Paulsen as a full time starter.

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Snydershrugged

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If I were obsessed wth Davis I'd have started a thread about him. All I said was I could take him or leave him and that we shouldnt rely on Paulsen as a full time starter.

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LOL, well played sir!:cheers:
 

Go Deep

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TE's are a dime a dozen. FD is good, nothing great or near elite. Considering his situation it would be best if he did leave.

I agree with Fan, having a good TE in our scheme is a need, but I am not worried that we couldn't find one. I haven't gave up on Paul yet. He had a rough year last year, but it was his first year at a new position. He's probably faster than Davis and probably just as physical.
 

fansince62

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If I were obsessed wth Davis I'd have started a thread about him. All I said was I could take him or leave him and that we shouldnt rely on Paulsen as a full time starter.

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yup. and the it as a false choice to start with. getting better at all positions is the goal.
 

burgold

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Fred Davis is amongst a long line of former Redskins whose potential always dwarfed their production. We have played the what if game with too many players.

Davis needs to realize he was given a freebie last year by getting franchise money he didn't earn esp. coming off that suspension. This year, coming off a really serious injury that he still hasn't recovered from he has two strikes against him and a mega contract for him would be grounds to fire a GM.

He is a very high risk prospect.

In that sense, at this moment, Paulson is a much better player if for no other reason than if we played a game tomorrow Paulson could play in it.
 

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Bulldog, I am obsessed with the TE position because the position is evolving. The offenses in this league that have a great one like New Orleans, New England, Green Bay and Atlanta, all have the best offenses in the league.

You're argument that we went 10-6 with Moss making many of those catches is the same as if I say we went 10-6 with a secondary of riff-raff and an RT that couldn't stop me in Pass pro.
 

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