Commanders Trade for QB Carson Wentz

Agree Boone that if they draft someone on the last day it becomes pointless and wasteful.

ST you’re trade-back scenario and possibly landing Strong or Ridder sounds like the best solution to this. Question though, do you see either sliding into the 3rd round?

Having a promising rookie on site gives so many more options. Whether he’ll be replacing Wentz in 2023, or used as trade bait if Wentz balls out and is worthy of starting for 3-5 years. Recouping future picks is a winning formula as well, IF they take a promising kid.

As far as Wentz goes he should be expecting a rookie to come in to learn from him, and challenge for starting spot in a year or 2.
 
I agree with all that but I’ll bet you anything Ridder is long gone by the 2nd. I wouldn’t even be shocked if he was the first QB taken - I’ve seen him rated that high by some.

I’m okay if they don’t take one. I’d prefer that to a late rounder that has no chance to be a starter (I know there are those rare late picks that turn out to be world beaters but Washington isn’t finding that guy :))
 
I am very high on Ridder but I don't think he's the first one gone. I do think he falls to the 2nd because a LOT of the teams previously in the early draft QB market have added QBs.

It would not shock me to see someone trade up into the back end of the 1st to take Ridder tho... because of the 5th year option
 
This talk from the colts owner now sounds like a jealous ex "yeah, well we don't want you anyways! You were the biggest mistake I've ever made"

Just shut up. It's over. Move on. I'm not overly happy with it, either. But, good Lord. Just shut the yapper!
 
MikefromOH said:
This talk from the colts owner now sounds like a jealous ex "yeah, well we don't want you anyways! You were the biggest mistake I've ever made"

Just shut up. It's over. Move on. I'm not overly happy with it, either. But, good Lord. Just shut the yapper!
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It definitely seems like he’s overcompensating. I wonder if he thought this was going to be well received by the players. Then when it wasn’t, he has to come out full throttle to justify what he did.
 
So, besides the picks in the actual transaction, what else did the trade essentially cost us, in the form of players lost for salary cap reasons, due to his $28 Million salary ;
Ioannidis, Settle, Flowers, Collins ?
Maybe not all of them are related to his salary issue, but some of them ?
So, when evaluating the true cost of the trade, it makes sense to include those players along with the draft picks.
 
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Are we sure those two things are cause and effect - that they didn’t retain any of those guys because they had to clear cap for Wentz? We had the $28 million already available I believe - but someone correct me if I’m wrong…
 
Boone said:
Are we sure those two things are cause and effect - that they didn’t retain any of those guys because they had to clear cap for Wentz? We had the $28 million already available I believe - but someone correct me if I’m wrong…
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I’m not the expert, but the Commanders currently have almost 11 million in cap space according sportstrac: https://www.spotrac.com/nfl/cap/2022/

I don’t know if we can really know if those guys were cut because of Wentz or not. Ionaidis and Settle both have low cap hits for this year. Flowers and Collins haven’t even been signed. So I suspect the commanders could have kept the two d lineman if they really wanted to. The other two, there doesn’t seem to be much interest in from other teams either.
 
Kel Varnsen said:
Flowers and Collins haven’t even been signed... there doesn’t seem to be much interest in from other teams either
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Collins cannot really be said to be un-signed by another team, since he was designated as a post-June 1st cut, and therefore is not even able to be signed by anyone else until then.
 
Actually, I think he can sign with a team - the ‘post-June 1’ designation just means the team isn’t relieved of his cap burden until then. I’m pretty sure one of the reasons they allow this is so that players CAN find a new home while teams still have cap money available.
 
Yeah that's why the Post June 1 designation is in the best interest of the player. Team gets MORE money back on June 2 than they would have cutting in March. Doing it this way doesn't handcuff the player til June after free agency and draft are done.. it's a win-win
 
I especially appreciate you guys explaining all that, because it eases a lot of the pain for me, considering I was not in favor of the trade, as far as the overall ramifications, and the giant picture.
Now, it doesn't look so bad, as far as I'm concerned.
But one other thing that hurts, is the deal the Colts made, to compensate for the loss of Wentz ; just a 3rd Round pick for Matt Ryan ?
I wonder how many WC fans would have preferred that deal, if it was offered ?
 
Lovin Cousins said:
I especially appreciate you guys explaining all that, because it eases a lot of the pain for me, considering I was not in favor of the trade, as far as the overall ramifications, and the giant picture.
Now, it doesn't look so bad, as far as I'm concerned.
But one other thing that hurts, is the deal the Colts made, to compensate for the loss of Wentz ; just a 3rd Round pick for Matt Ryan ?
I wonder how many WC fans would have preferred that deal, if it was offered ?
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Ryan presents a different set of issues. First off he’s 36, so he is at the end of his career. Could he have a couple of good years left? Possibly. But his current contract is a mess. The cap hit this year is only 18 million, but next year it’s 35 million and the dead cap money for next year is 35 million as well. So they would really have to work around that or extend him until he’s almost 40 to get this number down next year. That will work if he can give a Brady-like performance in his old age. But what if he plays like Roethlisberger or even Peyton Manning in his last year. So while the cost was 1 less pick for Ryan, the chance of him making a longer impact is much much less than Wentz. Wentz is 29 and his cap hit next year is 26 million. So roughly the same and if he plays well, there will be an extension which then they can maneuver the cap numbers. There is also an out if he sucks, so there is no penalty to release him next year like there is with Ryan. I wasn’t high on Wentz before the trade or right after, but I’ve grown to like it. Or at least accept it and root for him. He may have been the best option for what the team could afford to give up.
 
I agree with pretty much all of that.
I just find it interesting that a lot of people in general, are acting as if Wentz is also at the end of his career, just like Ryan ; Since a lot of people, including even "draft analysts", are still pushing for us to draft a QB high, or at least 'mid to high.'
That seems to give the impression that Wentz doesn't have much left in him, even in a best case scenario.
I guess it's mainly a question of whether you agree with those people.

And interesting, that we play the Colts this year. That's 3 games for Wentz to go against his former teams.
 
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Wentz had a good, but not great year last year. However, the lasting impression was the week 18 game against Jacksonville when they lost on a win and get in game. Wentz did not play well and he took the brunt of the criticism for that loss. I think it was an awful game plan as they barely gave the ball to Taylor, but it doesn’t change the fact that Wentz wasn’t good (17/29 185 1TD 1INT). Ultimately that’s why they traded him and from the words of coaches and players, it seemed like an ownership move not a coaches move. But now he’s gone and the narrative is that he couldn’t get it done in two places. That’s why there is talk of him not working out in DC and the Commanders drafting a QB. There is always talk of drafting a QB here since none have worked out. But the national media is mostly out on Wentz until he does something to reel them back in.
 
Most of the talk about Wentz is about his very last game.
But realistically, his last 5 games were pretty dismal, looking strictly at his yardage production.
His passing yards in his last 5 games, in chronological order :

158
57
225
148
185

Someone might defend that by pointing out their run-heavy or run-first offense, and/or having less than 30 pass attempts in those games.
But it's still concerning, to suddenly drop to rock bottom like that, for 5 consecutive games to end the year - at a time when they're in the playoff hunt especially.
 
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Lovin Cousins said:
Most of the talk about Wentz is about his very last game.
But realistically, his last 5 games were pretty dismal, looking strictly at his yardage production.
His passing yards in his last 5 games, in chronological order :

158
57
225
148
185

Someone might defend that by pointing out their run-heavy or run-first offense, and/or having less than 30 pass attempts in those games.
But it's still concerning, to suddenly drop to rock bottom like that, for 5 consecutive games to end the year - at a time when they're in the playoff hunt especially.
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I read your post and that 57 yards got me intrigued big time so I went back and looked at that. They played New England.

Wentz went 5/12 (not a typo.. .12 pass attempts) 57 yds, 1 td, 1 int.

On the first drive Wentz had Pittman open by about 2 steps down the right side that he flat out over threw him by about 3 yards. Had they connected, that would have been about a 30 yard completion. I just finished the 2nd offensive drive which was where Wentz got his passing TD. His passing TD was on a double reverse, but he handed the ball forward (behind the line of scrimmage) so it's technically a forward pass instead of a rush. They attempted 0 ACTUAL passes on that drive.

Taylor ran for 170 yards in that game. New England had no answer to the running game of the Colts, but it was clear that it wasn't just a run 'first' approach, it was a 'run it down their friggin throats' approach. That itself can be looked at two different ways, either they were riding Taylor no matter what, or they didn't trust Wentz... I don't know enough to have an actual answer.

Indy was up 20-0 with 7 min to go in the 3rd and was completely content with just bleeding clock..

Just saw a play where Wentz was rolling right and tried to rifle a ball to Hines on the sideline that SHOULD have been intercepted and taken back the other direction by Collins who broke under the throw and just flat out missed it. It was a bad decision, he got very lucky...

1650800104121.png
 
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