Luck vs. RGIII?

Which QB do you WANT under center in 2012?

  • Andrew Luck

    Votes: 4 9.8%

  • Robert Griffin III

    Votes: 37 90.2%
  • Total voters
    41
To answer the poll question ...

I don't know. I don't care. I just want whoever it is to not suck.
 
Henry said:
To answer the poll question ...

I don't know. I don't care. I just want whoever it is to not suck.
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I agree with Henry on this. My expectations for this franchise are so low that I just want to stop being embarrassed by the team. I don’t care about Superbowls or probowls; I just want to get out of the toilet bowl.

The last time I went to my bank the branch manager, who was a Dolphins fan, actually laughed at me when he saw my Redskins jacket. I really need for us to stop sucking.
 
Fear The Spear said:
Ummmm, of all people, a DOLPHIN fan laughing at you ???
I think they've cornered the market sucking, lately.
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Well, that was my first thought too. But, as he reminded me, we had a worse record than they did last season. I had no snappy comeback because, sadly, he was right.
 
Anne The Fan said:
But, as he reminded me, we had a worse record than they did last season.
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But that's not sayin much. And certainly, not laugh-worthy.
It's like a classmate bragging to his parents that he got a D-Minus grade, and how it's awesome, because someone else got an F.

Not to mention you could have asked him about the past decade they compared to us, and about how their QB's of late have been worse than ours, how their whole franchise is in disarray, how no free agents want to go play in Miami, etc......
 
Lanky Livingston said:
Clearly you don't understand the argument. Until RECENTLY the big 12 and the big 8 before it were primarily run first, they just were. There is no debating this. Oklahoma averaged somthing like 475 yards rushing a GAME when Barry Switzer was coaching. They were the strong defense, strong running game conference. I'm really not sure how you can deny this.

The point being, its unfair to say "The Big 12 has never had a HOF QB," because QB wasn't primarily a passing position UNTIL RECENTLY. The last 10 years. EXACTLY WHAT YOU KEEP AGREEING WITH. Now, I'm not 100% positive, but I don't think there's a QB in the Hall of Fame with less than 10 years playing in the NFL. Just saying...
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the big 12 has been a passing conference for a long time, you are stuck in the 1990's when nebraska and the option were king, the big 12 has been a passing conference for quite a while now. when was the last time Oklahoma was known for its backs? for at least 6 seasons Oklahoma has been known as primarily a passing team, Texas, same, texas tech longer still, your argument was wrong. and I believe the Big 8 is now the big 12, but feel free to try to find some other non factual argument to argue with me now. I easily disproved your assertion about the big 12 being a running conference. whats really funny is that its a BAD conference for defence other than Texas.
 
Rymanofthenorth said:
the big 12 has been a passing conference for a long time, you are stuck in the 1990's when nebraska and the option were king, the big 12 has been a passing conference for quite a while now. when was the last time Oklahoma was known for its backs? for at least 6 seasons Oklahoma has been known as primarily a passing team, Texas, same, texas tech longer still, your argument was wrong. and I believe the Big 8 is now the big 12, but feel free to try to find some other non factual argument to argue with me now. I easily disproved your assertion about the big 12 being a running conference. whats really funny is that its a BAD conference for defence other than Texas.
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Ryman, you keep agreeing with me. The last 10 years = recent history. The last 6 years is even more recent history. Are you just arguing to hear yourself speak?

We're just now starting to see Big 12 QBs get national attention and get drafted high. Vince Young, Josh Freeman, Colt McCoy - its just now starting. Its a process. RG3 is the next step in that process.
 
Lanky, it's pretty clear what Ry is arguing. You are differing on the definition of "recent history" - which to Ry equals the past 6 years (because I seem to remember Oklahoma having a fairly dominant runner named Adrian Petersen before that). And his point is valid.

Over the past 6 years, exactly how many HOF QBs has the conference produced?

None.

In your face.

<tongue firmly in cheek>
 
Goaldeje said:
Lanky, it's pretty clear what Ry is arguing. You are differing on the definition of "recent history" - which to Ry equals the past 6 years (because I seem to remember Oklahoma having a fairly dominant runner named Adrian Petersen before that). And his point is valid.

Over the past 6 years, exactly how many HOF QBs has the conference produced?

None.

In your face.

<tongue firmly in cheek>
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Touché, I yield to that. In the last 6 years, the Big 12 has not produced a Hall of Fame QB. :)
 
Strangely, it isn't RG3's on-field stuff that sold me on him. It was this interview:

http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-combine/09000d5d82742179/RGIII-shows-his-smarts

Until I saw that, I thought of him more as another superior "athlete" putting up big numbers against average defenses. Why? Mostly because I have never seen him play an entire GAME...only select plays with no context. Highlights tend to make people look good.

But his skills are not in question. The man is a freak.

He also has more IT factor oozing from his pores than any college draftee I can recall....ever. Seriously, name me the last college kid that had this kind of electricity coming out. Not "just" for his freakish skills but for his character.

What finally sold me on Luck, once it became even remotely possible we could end up with him (which I still 98% discount as media hype---the Colts are nabbing his ass), was the look in his eyes behind center as he scans a defense, processes info and starts directing traffic. If you've watched the highlight packages and his game (I've seen a couple full ones), you may have seen it.

I've seen that look before. Brady. In that look you can SEE that the game--the college game, yes--is not too fast for him. And you can PROJECT from that, given he's been successful at the highest level of college ball for 3 years, that his mind/body will not be overwhelmed by the speed and complexity of the pro game. No, you can't KNOW that...but I for one feel pretty good about it. It's what I've wanted in a Redskins QB for so many years....a guy dictating to the defense rather than reacting.

I also, for the record, love his VERY quick release and accuracy.

Bottomw line? Both these guys have the physical skills. It's not about that.

Both APPEAR to have what is even more important--the smarts, character, work ethic and humility to excel at the highest level of the game.

So which do I prefer for the Redskins?

Either.

Seriously. I'm so stoked about the possibilities that either of these guys brings I'm wishing a summer away. And I don't do that lightly.
 
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Interesting Andrew Luck comments this morning on the Dan Patrick show and how one guy perceived those comments.
 
Lanky Livingston said:
Ryman, you keep agreeing with me. The last 10 years = recent history. The last 6 years is even more recent history. Are you just arguing to hear yourself speak?

We're just now starting to see Big 12 QBs get national attention and get drafted high. Vince Young, Josh Freeman, Colt McCoy - its just now starting. Its a process. RG3 is the next step in that process.
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LOl seriously lanky sometimes you are pretty funny. Recent history is obviously by its nature "recent" most people who follow football go by eras, usually each era is a decade. the game has changed vastly since the 1990s.

how many big 12 qbs in the NFL? how many are even decent? Ill give you a hint, the number is one, Sam Bradford. previous to him how many washouts who were highly proficient against big 12 defences? Freeman was terriblke bad last year, but im willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, Mcoy and Young? they really just reinforce my point, both were lauded in the big 12 and hyped as rookies , neither performed remotely close to those expectations, Young in particular. Thankfully Young doesnt really equate to Griffin in anything other than measurables as Griffin has intelligence and intangibles on another level.

You seem to forget that even when they had AP, the sooners also had Jason white, its forgiviable to forget him as after a superlative college career in the big 12, he did nothing in the nfl, as did Rhet bomar who was also good in the big 12 but forgettable in the NFL, guys like Graham harrel also put up big numbers in the big 12 and then nothing in the NFL. seems to be a pattern.
 
Neophyte said:
Interesting Andrew Luck comments this morning on the Dan Patrick show and how one guy perceived those comments.
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Man, Luck makes it clear he wants to play for the Colts. Makes me cringe thinking about him forcing a trade if the worst happens and the Colts take RG3 instead. What would we do? We'd have traded up to #2 for no reason at all, and there is only a small chance we'd get the same return.
 
Ryman, perhaps you are providing evidence against yourself here with your argument about Griffin. I mean, the guys you mention in your last post not only didn't do anything in the NFL, they weren't ever really interesting to the NFL at all. Coaches and GMs looked at them and saw something so egregiously wrong that most never even got drafted.

The NFL doesn't appear to have the same misgivings about Griffin. In fact, that is so much the case that you had perhaps two of the best QB coaches and talent evaluators in the history of the league in a bidding war to get him. Surely that says something about him beyond the scope of your "Big 12 QBs suck" argument.

BTW - Harrel is currently on the Packers roster and Bomar (son of the coach that won a Texas state title with a team including my brother-in-law) is currently on the Raiders roster. Granted, my guess is it will take an act of God for either to ever see the field but they are still hanging around the league so you never know.
 
Rymanofthenorth said:
LOl seriously lanky sometimes you are pretty funny. Recent history is obviously by its nature "recent" most people who follow football go by eras, usually each era is a decade. the game has changed vastly since the 1990s.

how many big 12 qbs in the NFL? how many are even decent? Ill give you a hint, the number is one, Sam Bradford. previous to him how many washouts who were highly proficient against big 12 defences? Freeman was terriblke bad last year, but im willing to give him the benefit of the doubt, Mcoy and Young? they really just reinforce my point, both were lauded in the big 12 and hyped as rookies , neither performed remotely close to those expectations, Young in particular. Thankfully Young doesnt really equate to Griffin in anything other than measurables as Griffin has intelligence and intangibles on another level.

You seem to forget that even when they had AP, the sooners also had Jason white, its forgiviable to forget him as after a superlative college career in the big 12, he did nothing in the nfl, as did Rhet bomar who was also good in the big 12 but forgettable in the NFL, guys like Graham harrel also put up big numbers in the big 12 and then nothing in the NFL. seems to be a pattern.
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Ryman, you keep supporting my assertion. As a counterclaim (that ironically supports my claim) you cited two undrafted guys and a 5th round pick. Not to mention, White came into the NFL 7 years ago, the other two guys have been in the league 7 years COMBINED. Out of those three, which one of those guys received the hype that RG3 got? Or even the hype Colt McCoy got? Spoiler alert: none of them.

Ryman, I am willing to concede you are correct that in the past 10 years the paradigm of the big 12 offenses has shifted more towards prolific passing offenses. In fact, this is what I've been saying all along.
 
Neophyte said:
Ryman, perhaps you are providing evidence against yourself here with your argument about Griffin. I mean, the guys you mention in your last post not only didn't do anything in the NFL, they weren't ever really interesting to the NFL at all. Coaches and GMs looked at them and saw something so egregiously wrong that most never even got drafted.

The NFL doesn't appear to have the same misgivings about Griffin. In fact, that is so much the case that you had perhaps two of the best QB coaches and talent evaluators in the history of the league in a bidding war to get him. Surely that says something about him beyond the scope of your "Big 12 QBs suck" argument.

BTW - Harrel is currently on the Packers roster and Bomar (son of the coach that won a Texas state title with a team including my brother-in-law) is currently on the Raiders roster. Granted, my guess is it will take an act of God for either to ever see the field but they are still hanging around the league so you never know.
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Bomar was a 5th round pick, Harrell went undrafted. I would be willing to bet the number of QBs who make the pro-bowl after being drafted in the 4th round or later is a pretty short list, and the list of HOF QBs in the same category is probably less than 5 names.
 
That article seems to confirm my biggest fears - that the Colts will draft Griffin, we will be stuck with Luck, and RG3 will wind up as the better of the two.

The reporter can twist it any way he wants to try to ease the pain of fans like me who want to see Griffin here instead of Luck, but seriously.....did anyone read that and not immediately think Irsay was being pretty obvious that he is more enamored by Griffin than Luck? He gets excited about Griffin, but when pressed about Luck, he seems to respond in a way that feels like he's thinking oh yeah, that guy - he's ok too I guess.

Honestly, I think I might cry if they call Griffin first at the draft.
 
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