win, lose or draw

[DieselPwr44]

This was a Zorn type game.

Lay everything on the defense and hope your O can get lucky and score enough to win.

Will it ever end?

Not tonight.

 

[Lanky Livingston]

They just cut back to the MNF post game crew early during Grossman's interview, and they said he was like a little kid. Nobody has any respect for Rex.

 

[DieselPwr44]

They just cut back to the MNF post game crew early during Grossman's interview, and they said he was like a little kid. Nobody has any respect for Rex.

Why should anyone?

The guys been in this league too long to not understand ball security when flushed from the pocket.

He looks more like Ramsey the more I watch him.

 

[Rymanofthenorth]

3rd and a bus ride, and not only the same blitz call with no variation, but Dhall tries to be a hero and jump a short route? just make the tackle and we win, but no he gets busted on a double move and they get the first down. that play right there is whats wrong with Dhall.

 

[burgold]

3rd and a bus ride, and not only the same blitz call with no variation, but Dhall tries to be a hero and jump a short route? just make the tackle and we win, but no he gets busted on a double move and they get the first down. that play right there is whats wrong with Dhall.

Yeah, there were several of those plays where the Redskins coverage just seemed to go to sleep and big plays were had. This game was such a mixed bag.

 

[servumtuum]

I agree. but with a good QB we win it without thinking twice. he's a living do loop. he simply doesn't make the team better. he doesn't make it worse. IMO he definitely holds it back.

he doesn't scare anyone. apply pressure on RG and 9 times out of 10 you will not pay the price.

Fansince, I would like to point out that in spite of having Tom Brady the Pats still lost to an overachieving Bills team-the Pats defense was terrible and the Bill's pressure got to Brady with a 4 INT result. Sometimes even the best QB can't solve all other team deficiencies in a game.

Unless of course your QB is Aaron Rogers and you have a TE like J Finley. Still, I think the Packers will lose 4 games due to a sloppy pass D.

 

[Sarge]

There are about ten people on this team we need to replace over the next couple of years. One day, we might actually pay attention to the O-line again. Sexy Rexy can suck my crank. Effing turn over machine. But, he is what he is. I'm in the camp that DHall needs to go as well, but there are others that need to go first unless his man coverage starts to suck worse than it already does

I like how the team is heading, but it's going to take awhile longer

 

[fansince62]

You got them in 3rd and 21 to win and you let them convert and you say great defense?

nonsense.

the defense played well enough to win. that game should have been over by the time the first half was done. Rex Grossman on his best days is a mediocre QB. The real difference last night was a QB who could have elevated the team - a QB who could take advantage of the situation. WE DON'T HAVE THAT. dallas' QB with a busted rib, a clueless center, receivers who will be out of the league shortly......managed to lead his team to a victory. why? in part because our offense couldn't seal the deal early on when the table was set to do so.

You know...not once in all your posts have I seen you rebut the assertions:

1) RG is too short. He doesn't see the field well and this leads him to make 2-3 bad passes every game. every damn game he's either picked or close to 2-3 picks. eventually that catches up with you. he didn't see Cooley wide open toward the end of the game. I don't care what the excuse is....a good QB sees it and takes advantage of the opportunity.

2) he is not a mobile QB. when the offensive blocking breaks down he can manage a slide in the pocket to evade well enough, but if he has to run he is ont a threat to do anything. his legs can't buy time. moreover, the guy is a turnover machine when pressured. it's happened every damn game.

3) we have no deep passing game. now that may be a mix of receiver patterns and blocking time....but the very unwillingness of the OC to call these plays is an indicator that RG does not have skills that can overcome limitations elsewhere. limited mobility + no deep game kinda sets the defense's strategy: move the box up, pressure the QB. and that's what we have been seeing.

4) he holds the ball too damn long. he's said so himself on numerous occasions. the boys basically had no secondary last night...and we couldn't exploit that! are you kidding me! a good QB even with a suspect O-line would have picked that secondary clean.

5) I'm not seeing the commanding leadership on the field that elevates those around him. he doesn't make others better. he just runs out there and plays within a box - rather than rising above it. true...I'm not in the huddle so I don't know how much command and assurance he conveys...how he manages resources when events unfold in unexpected ways. so far....it doesn't seem like he has the leadership presence that transcends circumstances.

to be frank...I think Campbell is playing better in Oakland right now than RG is here. that ought to earn me some face shots!

so...make all the excuses you want. in the end, the issue isn't how others are playing around him (i.e., compensating for RG's limitations), it's that DCs know what these limitations are and can gameplan to exploit them. in RGs case that means bringing more heat than usual because the odds of paying a penalty for that with big, down-field plays has thus far been proven negligible....it's a risk worth taking.

 

[fansince62]

I like how the team is heading, but it's going to take awhile longer

me too! despite the fact that we obviously don't have the talent yet to dominate when an opponent is weak and on the outs, this team is playing much more cohesively than it has in almost a decade. some of the parts are in place. we have a real foundation to build on.

how we get our future QB with an 8-8/7-9 record...well.....Shanahallen: work your magic!

 

[fansince62]

Fansince, I would like to point out that in spite of having Tom Brady the Pats still lost to an overachieving Bills team-the Pats defense was terrible and the Bill's pressure got to Brady with a 4 INT result. Sometimes even the best QB can't solve all other team deficiencies in a game.

Unless of course your QB is Aaron Rogers and you have a TE like J Finley. Still, I think the Packers will lose 4 games due to a sloppy pass D.

are you suggesting RG is on a level with Brady?!!!! I remind you that even in seasons when the Pats o-line was horrendous...that team still managed a winning record. the analogy is also a false one. Brady had a bad game. But the multiple SB winner consistently has above average great games. the point I'm making is that RG's limitations lead to patterns that are consistent through every game.

you all are missing the point. sure...what happens around a QB makes a difference. other parts of the team are accountable for defeats/poor play. RG isn't the lone factor. what I'm arguing is that RG's limitations are a PERMANENT liability in every game....irrespective of whether these other problem areas manifest themselves or not game to game.

 

[Goaldeje]

Well, at least you're consistent.

Your opinion is well documented. My opinion was shaped a little last night in a positive sense when both Dilfer and Steve Young said Rex would end up being a top ten QB at the end of the year. Given they both have won Super Bowls, their opinions carry a little more weight than yours, frankly.

Rex had a bad game. But you are conveniently forgetting how good he looked in the second half against ARI, and practically the whole game again NY. As for your list of deficiencies, I can agree with some of those, but still will root for him to overcome them. The fact is that the playcalling did not help Rex out last night at all. Two screen plays? Really? I saw very few crossing patterns as well, designed to get Santana the ball in space.

The thing is FS, there are very few "Perfect" QBs that would fit the bill you want. Hell, Drew Brees is short and gets passes batted down often, and isn't particularly mobile. Yet most consider him top 5 if not top 3. A good OC will look at the limitations his QB has and work with him. Kyle did very little to help slow down the pass rush last night, often not even having a RB or TE chip out on Ware. Without time to throw, not even Brady or Manning can throw the ball downfield to take advantage of their CBs.

I'm disappointed too, especially since it was the Cowboys. But to put it all on Rex, or to give up already is silly. Rex had a poor game, which followed two pretty good to great games. And you're right, he likely never will run for more than 5 yards in a game, and I am thinking his leadership is lacking as well, comparatively. But if Kyle puts together a better gameplan to help Rex out, things look different.

 

[servumtuum]

are you suggesting RG is on a level with Brady?!!!! I remind you that even in seasons when the Pats o-line was horrendous...that team still managed a winning record. the analogy is also a false one. Brady had a bad game. But the multiple SB winner consistently has above average great games. the point I'm making is that RG's limitations lead to patterns that are consistent through every game.

you all are missing the point. sure...what happens around a QB makes a difference. other parts of the team are accountable for defeats/poor play. RG isn't the lone factor. what I'm arguing is that RG's limitations are a PERMANENT liability in every game....irrespective of whether these other problem areas manifest themselves or not game to game.

Fansince, of course I'm not suggesting that Rexy is on Brady's level-he's nowhere near it obviously. What I was pointing out that there are limits to how much a QB can compensate for other team failures. Some QBs are very good at this, Peyton, Brady, Rodgers, Brees at the extreme elite level for example. Most teams do not have a QB that can do that-we obviously do not so the expectation that Grossman "should" have that skill strikes me as, well, a bit unrealistic when there only a few QBs in the league with that capability. I'm not trying to excuse Rex's deficiencies either-he's inconsistent as hell which unfortunately causes me to quibble with another assertion, this one:

"Rex Grossman on his best days is a mediocre QB". If anything is consistent in Grossman's history it's his penchant for excellent games mixed with horrendous ones-it's where the whole "Good Rex/Bad Rex" dichotomy originated. He's been consistently inconsistent.

 

[Om]

Rex had a bad game. Al is going to spend the next week reminding us that he's been down on Rex. Can I save ya some typing, brother? Yes, Rex stunk it up last night. We saw.

 

[fansince62]

actually...I have no intention of "yapping it up" on Rex. Moving on to the Rams tomorrow.

I also don't think he played a bad game. I think he played a Rex game....not bad....good in parts...not enough to rise above the circumstances. and that will be the permanent marker of his performances.

make no mistake...I get just as bored having to watch and comment on the same observations week in and week out. the frustration builds and then it passes.

it's not as those each and every one of you doesn't have your own particular views on Redskin reality that the rest of us patiently read and absorb.

 

[fansince62]

serv...we can amicably disagree. I don't buy into the inconsistency narrative. that idea set opens the door of improvement to consistent excellence. my pov is that can never happen due to basic physical limitations.

anywho....let's press.

 

[Om]

I think Rex had a flat out bad game, to be honest. First one I've seen since he's been here. Made a handful of nice throws, but in general just seemed slow to process info, late with the ball and unable to ramp up the unit's overall pace. We seemed sluggish and indecisive on O all night, and fairly or not, I put that on the trigger man.

I'll admit it. There were a couple times last night I kinda hoped Shan had the balls to throw Beck out there just to shake things up. I mobile QB with a quick release is the antidote to a jailbreak pass rush like Dallas threw at us as the game progressed.

 

[Goaldeje]

The thought crossed my mind too, Om. but in retrospect, I'm glad he didn't, if only to avoid the inevitable circus that would have taken hold on the rest of the season.

 

[fansince62]

Well, at least you're consistent.

Your opinion is well documented. My opinion was shaped a little last night in a positive sense when both Dilfer and Steve Young said Rex would end up being a top ten QB at the end of the year. Given they both have won Super Bowls, their opinions carry a little more weight than yours, frankly.

coulda...woulda...shoulda! sonuds like a sound basis for building a team to me!

I don't care one iota what Dilfer and Young think. Don't imagine for a moment that there aren't other experts who argue just the opposite. Given that they have more NFL experience than you do from a coaching, defense and offense perspective...their opinions carry a little more weight than yours, frankly. nah, nah, nah, nah, nah, nah. you can see it every weekend when these sports analysts (i.e., former NFL jocks) deliver tepid endorsements. they all know he is not the long-run answer. what they know is that RG is the best answer on the roster. watch these game analyses.....you never, ever, ever hear these guys say "I give the Skins the edge in this game because of Rex Grossman". heck, when these silly comparison lists are flashed, I never see RG listed as the better QB in any of the games that matter. of the games played so far.....did we have the better overall QB in any of those games? and before you jump to the quick...I will apply logic that is familiar around these parts: Manning won a SB.

who do you think will be the better QB in next week's game? who would you rather have? when I look at the remaining schedule I see 4 games where I prefer RG as the QB.

Trent and Steve prefer Rex!!! bahahahahaha. No one thought enough of Rex to make a move when he was a FA! Seems like a disconnect to me. I remind you that the same OC whom most of you think called a horrible game last night...he prefers RG also. if his judgement is suspect in one area....why not another?

 

[CounterTrey]

And Gibbs was responsible for the pick of Desmond Howard to be a receiver. Good coaches aren't necessarily great talent evaluators. That points doesn't hold water.

 

[Goaldeje]

If you wanna throw Young out, fine. But Dilfer is fairly well respected. And I'm not arguing I want Rex long term. I'm on record saying I think we will have a new QB sooner rather than later. But imagine with me two things:

1) Kyle calls some plays to slow down the pass rush a little more. Make a difference?

2) What if we had a tall, athletic WR who could make some plays in the Redzone? Make a difference? And yes, I'm baiting you into bringing up Devin Thomas.

All I'm saying is that replacing Rex should be on the list, no argument. I think though, he can have a good season with us this year. Will it rival Brady? Probably not. It's a little disturbing though when folks seem more eager to damn his failures than to root for him. He's what we have right now. So we need to hope Kyle will do a better job of maximizing his strengths and minimizing his weaknesses.

FS, I don't think anyone is acting like Rex is not flawed, or that he is the best QB in the league. We just think he is a little better than you are giving him credit for, that's all.