Training Camp discussion thread

[Primus Porcus]

I ambush the other thread with updates so figured having somewhere to actually discuss is a good thing. I'll keep posting info in the other thread but here we can talk about it without it getting blown out by my updates.

 

[MikefromOH]

I just told you in chat..

We went from Josh Johnson as our QB to Alex, Dwayne and Kyle fighting it out like studs! Dwayne is looking really sharp.

That D is disgustingly good. WOW!

 

[Primus Porcus]

So far we're about a week through camp and I think these are the top things I've noticed.

1. Defense is far and away ahead of the offense. Defensively we look pretty good and could really surprise people beyond just the D-line. I actually am growing to like our LB corps with Pierre-Louis, Holcomb, Hamilton, Davis, and others. I think this unit could really shine with the talent in front of them, and I also think the secondary could stand out with the front 7 in front of them.

2. RB Depth looks to be great. A unit that we came into the season questioning loses it's premier player, and it still is the strongest unit on offense. It's likely an NFL caliber player is cut from this group to get down to our final roster number... something we haven't been able to say in a long time. There are a couple true game breaking type players in this backfield. Gibson, McKissic, and Love. All 3 are a threat to take it the distance every time they touch the ball. Another factor we have been without for a long time.

3. Apke has shown out and apparently has taken hold of the starting FS job. Sean Davis wasn't expected to come in and be some sort of a game changer, but I think most of us had Davis penciled in as the starter next to Collins from the day we signed him. Apke was presumed to be a ST contributor and depth guy and it APPEARS he's made some big time strides. Interested to see how that work out.

4. Turner is going to practice flexibility. Saw a couple reports of flexing Logan Thomas to QB and shifting Haskins out wide. Also seeing some 'gimmick' style plays to get Sims and Gibson the ball in space. I love it. Misdirection, pre-snap motion, isolating matchups and moving pieces around a lot in order to set up the defense for what you want. Chiefs, Ravens, and Eagles (SB season) do this a lot.

5. Haskins is the starter. He's been inconsistent but has periods where he looks very strong. This is to be expected with what he's got to face this offseason with no OTA, no preseason, no mini camps, new system, concerns at O-line, and question marks at WR. His development over the next 3 weeks before the season starts will determine how this offense goes. I don't see us scoring 24 - 30 pts per game, but if he can keep developing and grinding and get more consistent, our defense SHOULD be good enough to let us win more than we lose when we score 20+.

Put this in the other thread... better suited here

 

[MikefromOH]

LOL! You're killing me!

I hope they don't name a starter until week 4 of the "preseason". Just keep them hustling and competing. But, I want it Haskins 1 and Smith 2.

 

[Boone]

I have high hopes that we see real progress this year.

 

[MikefromOH]

Ugh....me, too.

 

[Boone]

LOL! You're killing me!

I hope they don't name a starter until week 4 of the "preseason". Just keep them hustling and competing. But, I want it Haskins 1 and Smith 2.

I have to push back on wanting Smith #2. Kyle Allen is very talented, young, and has a number of starts under his belt in this offense. Smith is old, damaged, and may not even be capable of surviving live action. I love Smith and I understand what a good guy, mentor, and influence he is. But you can’t make a roster decision based on that alone. If they want to keep 3 this year, I’m fine with him being #3 - that might be the best approach. But there’s no way I'm having him as a backup when I’ve got a healthy Kyle Allen available. That kid is a baller.

 

[MikefromOH]

I hear ya...I want to argue that, but you are right. He is old and damaged.

But, he is also motivated and on a mission. People with that chip on their shoulder can do amazing things.

 

[Boone]

I get the sentiment, I really do. But people are sleeping on Kyle Allen. He can really play. Grabbing him was a very smart move.

 

[MikefromOH]

I agree. He was on a terrible team outside of McCaffery.

 

[Win4us]

I may have missed it but any word on the o-line cohesion yet? Curious if the LSU tackle has beat out Christian or not

 

[Primus Porcus]

I may have missed it but any word on the o-line cohesion yet? Curious if the LSU tackle has beat out Christian or not

Charles is not practicing due to a calf injury. Christian has started to gain some positive rumblings. Likely Christian is week 1 starter. Imho Charles could end up on PUP and is a non factor til week 6

 

[Primus Porcus]

For my 5,000th post I would like to shift gears a bit with a little positive to offset some of the negativity news coming out of Ashburn. To do that I figured I would jump over here and run down some of the pleasant surprises coming out of camp.

1. Troy Apke. Somehow this guy has found himself at the starting FS position, and lately there has been more and more mention of him from camp. Boone made the comment not long ago that it would be a blessing to have Apke develop to starter material. Not All Pro, not Pro Bowl, not top 5, but at least worthy of the starting spot on the depth chart. To this point it appears that has happened.

2. Geron Christian. The last couple days have awarded Christian a bit of positive momentum. Charles is hurt, and it appears Christian has found himself squarely in the starting LT position. This COULD be because of lack of bodies, but some whispers may lead us to believe that he's actually taken a step in the right direction.

3. Hybrid RBs. Gibson and McKissic could be an X-factor that we seemed to avoid like the plague. We took Chris Thompson and tried to run him off tackle and between the guards. We would get him on a screen 1 time for 35 yards, then abandon the idea for 3 weeks. It appears we now have a couple guys we can move around, and an OC that understands just how valuable that is.... another factor our fearless leader called his shot on a few months ago...

4. Logan Thomas. He's likely not a game breaker, but it appears him and Haskins have something going. His name keeps popping up followed by 'TD.' He appears to be a good redzone threat, and if he can find himself as a safety valve for Haskins... he could see some serious targets this year with the questions we still have at O-line.

5. DE. Defensive end was a major issue until 2 years ago. Now it's likely our deepest, and most talented position. We have 3 legit starting caliber guys (Young, Sweat, Kerrigan) and have a handful more younger guys who can be used in rotation (Brailford, Orchard, Smith-Williams). For years the concerns of pass rush from the D-line seemed non existent. It would appear some of those questions have been answered.

 

[Boone]

I'm on record months ago saying we hit big on the hybrid RBs. So yay me But I don't think anyone would've selected Christian or Apke as guys likely to make a lot of noise this season. With the caveat that we have no idea whether the jump they appear to have made in training camp translates to live competition, how amazing would it be if they both turn into solid starters or more? It would demonstrate once and for all that fans really need to be more patient before completely writing young players off.

And congrats on your 5000th post - I have literally enjoyed every one of them Derek!

 

[Primus Porcus]

Seeing a lot more good things coming from the RBs and more positives coming about Christian....

 

[MikefromOH]

Agreed. him stating that he didn't try hard enough before probably went on Rivera's radar immediately. Not trying doesn't seem to be an option for our Coach.

 

[Primus Porcus]

Figured this wouldn't get washed out over here Boone with all my tweets

Posed this question to JP Finlay on twitter. Do we keep 3 QBs active this year? I say yes. I don't think there's any way you can rely on Alex as the #2, but he has earned a spot and even though I'm generally not a fan of using a roster spot on a 3rd QB, it would be worth it for mentorship purposes alone imho.

here's my response.

I think Smith COULD start the year on the PUP which allows him to remain while not effecting the 53. You PS Montez and have Logan Thomas as your emergency 3rd stringer if it gets there.

 

[MikefromOH]

live goal line drills...actual hitting in pads

AP up the gut from the 2 yard line meets Chase Young who lays him out flat. In AP's defense, they had Logan Thomas blocking CY and that will never be able to handle that beast.

 

[Primus Porcus]

live goal line drills...actual hitting in pads

AP up the gut from the 2 yard line meets Chase Young who lays him out flat. In AP's defense, they had Logan Thomas blocking CY and that will never be able to handle that beast.

Yeah, kind of a 'changing of the guard' type of thing. Old HOF RB meets new young stud...

 

[MikefromOH]

Yeah, kind of a 'changing of the guard' type of thing. Old HOF RB meets new young stud...

I do feel if someone like Scherff is blocking he might get in. still good to see it. Young didn't celebrate, hoot and holler either. just stood up and went back to the huddle.