Ax
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McVay, and Barry, are Gruden's choices. He shares whatever failures they may have, 100%
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Random Commanders Thoughts
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On that first down, Kirk could have make some chicken salad out of that chicken shit if he had taken the yards and run instead of forcing it to Davis. But even still, why no run when we were mixing it in well prior to that in the last 2 series, I don't have a clue.
I've been re-reading 'Hail to the Redskins' lately which is a book about the Gibbs years.
In his first year he was trying to install an elite pass attack (like the one he'd had in SanDiego) but it wasn't working. Theismann wasn't the man to do it. Basically Riggins, Bugel and co asked him to go back to basics. Run the ball. So he did and success followed. Then he evolved the Offense from there to be trickier and more complex. It ended up as one of the most complex Offense ever run in the NFL.
But you start at the basics.
McVay almost seems to be the reverse philosophy. Start complex!
We ALL know what works for this team. Passing is our forte and on short routes to Reed, Garcon, Davis, Crowder and even Djax were nigh unstoppable. Use them.
Then when the D cues off the pass game mix in the run.
Use that to set up the deep ball.
What McVay does is think... oooo it's 1st down let's take them by surprise and go deep!
No! Earn that deep shot by setting up the defense.
Drives me crazy. Lol
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In his first year he was trying to install an elite pass attack (like the one he'd had in SanDiego) but it wasn't working. Theismann wasn't the man to do it. Basically Riggins, Bugel and co asked him to go back to basics. Run the ball. So he did and success followed. Then he evolved the Offense from there to be trickier and more complex. It ended up as one of the most complex Offense ever run in the NFL.
But you start at the basics.
McVay almost seems to be the reverse philosophy. Start complex!
We ALL know what works for this team. Passing is our forte and on short routes to Reed, Garcon, Davis, Crowder and even Djax were nigh unstoppable. Use them.
Then when the D cues off the pass game mix in the run.
Use that to set up the deep ball.
What McVay does is think... oooo it's 1st down let's take them by surprise and go deep!
No! Earn that deep shot by setting up the defense.
Drives me crazy. Lol
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What made me mad was that Davis was open as soon as he started to roll out. He must have been looking downfield, because he could have quickly thrown it to Davis who was on the run and at worst gets 6 yards. Davis probably gets 10 or more and a first down. But once you see Davis is covered, you are correct that he should have run.
Ax
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Again, Gruden is at the very least, equally to blame. I'd so, more so. Because he's either 100% responsible for it, 100% complicit in it, or 100% powerless/clueless to do anything about it.
McVay and Gruden are coconspirators. Can't blame one without the other.
McVay and Gruden are coconspirators. Can't blame one without the other.
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Oh my TiVo channel guide said gnats @ skins all night and even when the stupid hag game was playing. Meh sounds like it was all good not seeing McVay raise my blood pressure today. Dude has no clue against a middle of the pack or better defense.
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So for those who watched who was getting blown up on the o-line?
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I remember Scherff getting blown up a few times. Moses was beat a couple of times and Thompson was hurdled on a blitz. The difference was that the Giants were bringing pressure a lot. That was causing a lot of 1 on 1 and no help when a guy was beat. Kirk also looked oblivious to the rush a few times as well. The Giants had a much better game plan than the Redskins and were just more aggressive in the trenches.
Elephant
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Here are a few takes I have as the season comes to an end.
1.) Kirk has to get over the hump. He will be in burgundy and gold next year whether we tag him or he accepts a 4-6 year offer. What we need from him is to play smarter, sharper and more calm during the big games. He did not get a lot of help from the play callers tonight, but he made a couple of terrible mistakes at key moments in the game.
2.) Joe Barry has to go. I don't care what anyone says about holding the Giants to just 13 points, the difference in the game was the pressure they got on us and the lack of pressure we got on them. We sent only 4 almost the whole game. FFS, ShEli gets pressure early, he makes mistakes. He was able to sit in that pocket on the first 2 drives way too long and he chewed our defense apart. We tighten up in the redzone. Thank goodness they shot themselves in the foot and didn't take the FG and went for it on 4.
3.) Clock Management. At the end of the first half, I wasn't sure if they were going to try to get something or let the clock tick away. Cousins allowed about 24 seconds run off the clock, they ran a play, then called a time out. WTF? If you're going for a score, call the time out! Then at the end of the game, we call the timeout on 1st down with 90 seconds left in FG range? Terrible time out when you have their defense on the ropes.
4.) Brings me to overall coaching. Our TD series? We ran and pass evenly. Next possession after the TD, when we'd just held them to 3 and out? 3 passes for a 3 and out. Clinton Portis brought it up tonight on the radio, why do we conitnue to run the ball at our weakness on the OL? Why aren't we running behind Trent or in between Scherff and Moses more? There are plenty more examples.
5.) Talent. We need 2 or 3 strong DL at least as talented as Chris Baker. We need an inside LB with speed. Compton is a smart guy, just too slow and it was obvious tonight on a couple plays. We need Sua Cravens to be moved to safety and at least one more good CB, move Breeland into the nickel. He had a poor season.
Simply said, we ended up about as good as the talent we have was coached.
One last thing? We need to re-sign Pierre Garcon! I would like to have Jackson back, too...but Garcon should get at least another 3 year deal.
1.) Kirk has to get over the hump. He will be in burgundy and gold next year whether we tag him or he accepts a 4-6 year offer. What we need from him is to play smarter, sharper and more calm during the big games. He did not get a lot of help from the play callers tonight, but he made a couple of terrible mistakes at key moments in the game.
2.) Joe Barry has to go. I don't care what anyone says about holding the Giants to just 13 points, the difference in the game was the pressure they got on us and the lack of pressure we got on them. We sent only 4 almost the whole game. FFS, ShEli gets pressure early, he makes mistakes. He was able to sit in that pocket on the first 2 drives way too long and he chewed our defense apart. We tighten up in the redzone. Thank goodness they shot themselves in the foot and didn't take the FG and went for it on 4.
3.) Clock Management. At the end of the first half, I wasn't sure if they were going to try to get something or let the clock tick away. Cousins allowed about 24 seconds run off the clock, they ran a play, then called a time out. WTF? If you're going for a score, call the time out! Then at the end of the game, we call the timeout on 1st down with 90 seconds left in FG range? Terrible time out when you have their defense on the ropes.
4.) Brings me to overall coaching. Our TD series? We ran and pass evenly. Next possession after the TD, when we'd just held them to 3 and out? 3 passes for a 3 and out. Clinton Portis brought it up tonight on the radio, why do we conitnue to run the ball at our weakness on the OL? Why aren't we running behind Trent or in between Scherff and Moses more? There are plenty more examples.
5.) Talent. We need 2 or 3 strong DL at least as talented as Chris Baker. We need an inside LB with speed. Compton is a smart guy, just too slow and it was obvious tonight on a couple plays. We need Sua Cravens to be moved to safety and at least one more good CB, move Breeland into the nickel. He had a poor season.
Simply said, we ended up about as good as the talent we have was coached.
One last thing? We need to re-sign Pierre Garcon! I would like to have Jackson back, too...but Garcon should get at least another 3 year deal.
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Bulldog
The Legend
Kirk Cousins showed in this game that he is not a franchise quarterback.
This was a game at home against a team that was playing to prevent themselves from getting rusty heading into the postseason.
In the fourth quarter, with the game on the line and the defense having prevented the Giants key playmakers, Manning and Beckham, from creating any real magic, Kirk was not able to the put the team on his back and make the one or two off schedule plays to continue that last drive for a winning TD or tying field goal.
With 1:37 left on the clock and going on a first down, Cousins inexplicably decided it would be better to throw the ball off balance leaning on one foot into the middle of the field instead of simply throwing it incomplete to the sidelines and lining up for second down.
He also didn't chose to RUN THE BALL and make a play with his feet when the opportunity presented itself.
The interception by Rodgers-Cromartie was not only the end of the Redskins season but enough evidence, together with the stinkers against the Steelers, Cardinals, Panthers earlier in the year to believe the Redskins need to move on at quarterback as we have likely seen the plateau of Kirk Cousins as an NFL starter.
There is nothing wrong with having a quarterback who puts up the 25 touchdowns/12 interceptions and 4,500 plus yards Kirk did.
You can build a very good team around a solid starter, especially if you draft a young quarterback you think may be that plus starter down the road to take a more complete team to the 'promised land'.
But you can't give the 'solid' guy $20-23M plus a year.
For a team whose offense put up that much yardage during the season, Cousins' 25 touchdowns pale in comparison to the 40 Aaron Rogers has thrown or the 37 from Drew Brees. These are some of the 'franchise' passers that have big money deals.
A couple of deals from last offseason stick in my mind.
You have the $72M deal Brock Osweiler landed from the Texans' owner, who negotiated the contract without his GM present.
The other is the long, drawn out deal Ryan Fitzpatrick ultimately signed to go back to the New York Jets.
The one year deal pays him $12-$14 million based on various incentives. But not the $21M a year deal Fitzpatrick and his agent were looking for.
In both cases the teams were dealing with quarterbacks that are not franchise performers.
Despite all their other personnel failings, the Jets realized it and correctly assumed that the 32 year old Fitzpatrick was unlikely to surpass his 2015 performance going forward.
Meanwhile, the Texans mistakenly thought that a young quarterback off a Super Bowl team was necessarily touched with some gold dust, despite limited playing time.
John Elway knew better. He gets to live and fight another day, perhaps dealing for Tony Romo and having Lynch waiting in the wings for the next 1-2 years learning from #9 before taking over the starting job.
In the era of the salary cap, it is better to avoid giving out the killer bad contract than it is to move on from a guy who can help you but is not the 100% answer.
This was a game at home against a team that was playing to prevent themselves from getting rusty heading into the postseason.
In the fourth quarter, with the game on the line and the defense having prevented the Giants key playmakers, Manning and Beckham, from creating any real magic, Kirk was not able to the put the team on his back and make the one or two off schedule plays to continue that last drive for a winning TD or tying field goal.
With 1:37 left on the clock and going on a first down, Cousins inexplicably decided it would be better to throw the ball off balance leaning on one foot into the middle of the field instead of simply throwing it incomplete to the sidelines and lining up for second down.
He also didn't chose to RUN THE BALL and make a play with his feet when the opportunity presented itself.
The interception by Rodgers-Cromartie was not only the end of the Redskins season but enough evidence, together with the stinkers against the Steelers, Cardinals, Panthers earlier in the year to believe the Redskins need to move on at quarterback as we have likely seen the plateau of Kirk Cousins as an NFL starter.
There is nothing wrong with having a quarterback who puts up the 25 touchdowns/12 interceptions and 4,500 plus yards Kirk did.
You can build a very good team around a solid starter, especially if you draft a young quarterback you think may be that plus starter down the road to take a more complete team to the 'promised land'.
But you can't give the 'solid' guy $20-23M plus a year.
For a team whose offense put up that much yardage during the season, Cousins' 25 touchdowns pale in comparison to the 40 Aaron Rogers has thrown or the 37 from Drew Brees. These are some of the 'franchise' passers that have big money deals.
A couple of deals from last offseason stick in my mind.
You have the $72M deal Brock Osweiler landed from the Texans' owner, who negotiated the contract without his GM present.
The other is the long, drawn out deal Ryan Fitzpatrick ultimately signed to go back to the New York Jets.
The one year deal pays him $12-$14 million based on various incentives. But not the $21M a year deal Fitzpatrick and his agent were looking for.
In both cases the teams were dealing with quarterbacks that are not franchise performers.
Despite all their other personnel failings, the Jets realized it and correctly assumed that the 32 year old Fitzpatrick was unlikely to surpass his 2015 performance going forward.
Meanwhile, the Texans mistakenly thought that a young quarterback off a Super Bowl team was necessarily touched with some gold dust, despite limited playing time.
John Elway knew better. He gets to live and fight another day, perhaps dealing for Tony Romo and having Lynch waiting in the wings for the next 1-2 years learning from #9 before taking over the starting job.
In the era of the salary cap, it is better to avoid giving out the killer bad contract than it is to move on from a guy who can help you but is not the 100% answer.
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It's like Elephant was in my head!!
2nd year starter. He fixed a lot and at times looked really composed. But he still has moments where his inexperience shows. That'll change.
Give credit to the Giants this week. They spent money, a lot of money on their Defense last year. It's not all on our Offense last night, they were really good. It's no fluke we had possibly our worst offensive showing against them. They mauled our line in the first half especially.
Couldn't agree more. I know this defense lacks talent but I couldn't help but feel like we just underused the talent we had. Breeland regressed, Smith was mostly invisible, felt like wrong plays at wrong times. We needed pressure at key moments and he never dialled it up.
I give no credit for last night. The Giants Offense is awful, 25th in the league. They struggle to score and Eli threw at least 1 int per game on average. This wasn't the Falcons we held to 13.
Agreed. Again I think this is an experience thing. Gruden and Kirk need to learn from this. I wouldn't shed a tear if McVay goes and we bring in an experienced OC.
It's the element of surprise! Lol
They'll never expect us to run at our weakest spot!
Seriously though you're right. Stop getting cute, find something that works and work it till they take it away. Yesterday we were way more effective running around the edges (when penalties didn't nullify the gains!)
We should have worked that till they keyed on it, then gone inside.
Same throwing. Work the bread and butter and THEN start taking your deep shots.
It was only that one TD drive where we kept them honest mixing up short passes and runs. It was a textbook drive and something we've been doing all season.
But McVay has these mad moments when he tries to be cute and it kills us.
Dink and dunk might not be spectacular but it works and we have the personnel to do it. Then hit them deep when they least expect it.
Totally agree. I understand taking it slow with Cravens, even if it was frustrating. Someone should have been on Bree early in the season when he was in his own head.
We have some talent, I don't feel we should have been the worst Defense in the league. Maybe not even average. Maybe I'm wrong, but a D that has Kerrigan, Baker, Norman, Smith and Breeland should be better.
That's how I felt anyway.
Could not agree more!!!
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2nd year starter. He fixed a lot and at times looked really composed. But he still has moments where his inexperience shows. That'll change.
Give credit to the Giants this week. They spent money, a lot of money on their Defense last year. It's not all on our Offense last night, they were really good. It's no fluke we had possibly our worst offensive showing against them. They mauled our line in the first half especially.
Couldn't agree more. I know this defense lacks talent but I couldn't help but feel like we just underused the talent we had. Breeland regressed, Smith was mostly invisible, felt like wrong plays at wrong times. We needed pressure at key moments and he never dialled it up.
I give no credit for last night. The Giants Offense is awful, 25th in the league. They struggle to score and Eli threw at least 1 int per game on average. This wasn't the Falcons we held to 13.
Agreed. Again I think this is an experience thing. Gruden and Kirk need to learn from this. I wouldn't shed a tear if McVay goes and we bring in an experienced OC.
It's the element of surprise! Lol
They'll never expect us to run at our weakest spot!
Seriously though you're right. Stop getting cute, find something that works and work it till they take it away. Yesterday we were way more effective running around the edges (when penalties didn't nullify the gains!)
We should have worked that till they keyed on it, then gone inside.
Same throwing. Work the bread and butter and THEN start taking your deep shots.
It was only that one TD drive where we kept them honest mixing up short passes and runs. It was a textbook drive and something we've been doing all season.
But McVay has these mad moments when he tries to be cute and it kills us.
Dink and dunk might not be spectacular but it works and we have the personnel to do it. Then hit them deep when they least expect it.
Totally agree. I understand taking it slow with Cravens, even if it was frustrating. Someone should have been on Bree early in the season when he was in his own head.
We have some talent, I don't feel we should have been the worst Defense in the league. Maybe not even average. Maybe I'm wrong, but a D that has Kerrigan, Baker, Norman, Smith and Breeland should be better.
That's how I felt anyway.
Could not agree more!!!
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I think that a lot of times our general inept QB play over the last 25 odd years doesn't help our case when it comes to Kirk Cousins and his long term future with this team. We've been so bad for so long that there seems to be this fear that if we walk away from him we are doomed.
If anything, the Giants game proved that Cousins is not of the elite variety. He's not Brady, Manning, Rodgers, Brees, etc., in that he's not going to make careers out of otherwise NFL nobodies. What he is is good, but not elite. With a very solid line, solid receivers around him, and a very effective run game, you can win with him, but he's certainly not irreplaceable. The issue is that I don't think the franchise is at a point where they're willing to wait it out, take a few steps back, and search for the next great arm considering some of the strides we've made the last couple years.
Ultimately, I think it points to another year of being franchised for Kirk. I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if we tried to bring in a RB via the draft/free agency that is legit and that defenses have to plan for. He then gets evaluated one final time after that by management. We don't need to look too far to see why Prescott is having so much success. He's been insulated quite well and I feel that Kirk is the same type of QB in that regard.
If anything, the Giants game proved that Cousins is not of the elite variety. He's not Brady, Manning, Rodgers, Brees, etc., in that he's not going to make careers out of otherwise NFL nobodies. What he is is good, but not elite. With a very solid line, solid receivers around him, and a very effective run game, you can win with him, but he's certainly not irreplaceable. The issue is that I don't think the franchise is at a point where they're willing to wait it out, take a few steps back, and search for the next great arm considering some of the strides we've made the last couple years.
Ultimately, I think it points to another year of being franchised for Kirk. I wouldn't be the least bit surprised if we tried to bring in a RB via the draft/free agency that is legit and that defenses have to plan for. He then gets evaluated one final time after that by management. We don't need to look too far to see why Prescott is having so much success. He's been insulated quite well and I feel that Kirk is the same type of QB in that regard.
I get where you're coming from CH but I still think a 2 year window is pretty short to judge him.
All those QBs you mention had multiple years in a system. 10+ years!
Traditionally here we're guilty of looking for the next gunslinger. If you can't prove you're elite in 2 or 3 years we're out and moving on.
Teams get suckered into thinking they can find the next big thing easily. But for every Russell Wilson there's an RGIII. It's a total lottery.
For me the safer and better option... find a QB that shows skills and an ability to learn and nurture him. Keep him in a system and mature it. Build what those Elite teams have, a stability at key positions that allows a team to be good.
Flaccid isn't a great QB by any stretch, but the Ravens committed to stability and are winners every year pretty much and a Super Bowl to boot. Just 1 losing season since he arrived.
Stability is the key to success in the NFL
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All those QBs you mention had multiple years in a system. 10+ years!
Traditionally here we're guilty of looking for the next gunslinger. If you can't prove you're elite in 2 or 3 years we're out and moving on.
Teams get suckered into thinking they can find the next big thing easily. But for every Russell Wilson there's an RGIII. It's a total lottery.
For me the safer and better option... find a QB that shows skills and an ability to learn and nurture him. Keep him in a system and mature it. Build what those Elite teams have, a stability at key positions that allows a team to be good.
Flaccid isn't a great QB by any stretch, but the Ravens committed to stability and are winners every year pretty much and a Super Bowl to boot. Just 1 losing season since he arrived.
Stability is the key to success in the NFL
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Ax
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Well, this pass happy, run loathing system, run by a coach who thinks his system is perfect, needs to go.
Kirk has been in the system for 3 years. He's a 5 year veteran. And he looked like a guy making his 1st start. He didn't get rolling until the Giants started pulling starters. And then made their second string CB look like Darrell Green with his amateur hour performance.
Kirk has been in the system for 3 years. He's a 5 year veteran. And he looked like a guy making his 1st start. He didn't get rolling until the Giants started pulling starters. And then made their second string CB look like Darrell Green with his amateur hour performance.
Not sure what to make about these comments from Francois.
Redskins end Ricky Jean Francois said the players need to change their mindset to make sure they don't repeat this disappointment.
Redskins end Ricky Jean Francois said the players need to change their mindset to make sure they don't repeat this disappointment.
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Redskins currently slated to pick 17th in the 2017 NFL draft.
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redskins26
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thats the top end of where Zac Cunningham is slated to go. Even if he outperforms at the combine I don't see him rising to much.
Ax
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So, as of today, we have the worst coaching staff, worst running attack, well, more like running joke, and the worst defense in our division.
But how 'bout them passing stats? WooHooooooo!
But how 'bout them passing stats? WooHooooooo!
In other news:
Mason Foster had 15 solo tackles yesterday.
Wil Compton had 1.
But he knows the system so well.
I hope we upgrade these spots this offseason.
Mason Foster had 15 solo tackles yesterday.
Wil Compton had 1.
But he knows the system so well.
I hope we upgrade these spots this offseason.
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