Burner's Burning Questions: Free Agency, Mocks, Camps, OTAs, Roster Predictions, 2020

One of many experimental iterations ...

Elephant

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Re: Burner's Burning Questions: Free Agency, Mocks, Camps, OTAs, Roster Predictions,

El...I haven't gotten around to checking on Chase's stats: were those stock-piled against teams like Maryland and Indiana or were there multi-sack games against the premier teams in college football? While it won't escape my notice that he didn't produce much in the big, recent games.....I'm willing to leave it to the scouting department and Rivera/JDR as defensive coaches who see what they are after on tape. Agree with you that there are options that should all be considered and weighted.
In his first 8 games of the season he had 13.5 sacks against the lesser talented teams, but did have a 4 sack game against a very good Wisconsin team.

He was suspend for 2 games, then had another monster day against a good Penn State defense with 3 sacks.

Then?

The last 3 games of the season he had 0 sacks.

Michigan was blown out and he didn't play much of the 2nd half, so I guess we can give him a pass.

In the 2nd game against Wisconsin I did not see a tremendous amount of double teams against him, but they held him to 0 sacks in the Big 10 Championship when he had 4 against them in their 1st meeting.

Then in their loss to Clemson in the playoff it looked like he was double teamed more often than the Wisconsin game...again, held to 0 sacks.

Look, it's more than fair to say this kid is special...7 sacks in 2 games against 2 of the best teams in the Big 10 is proof enough. If we draft him, I will not be upset at all. But what happened down the stretch of the last 3 games? Was it scheme? Was it fatigue? Why was he unable to perform at the level he'd shown he could?

So I am ok, with a trade down...or what Isaiah Simmons offers in comparison, the more I research that kid, the more I like. Clemson had him playing slot CB, Safety, and LB...and he was dominant in all 3 facets of the game. That is Sean Taylor type of play from a player who likely would be a weak side LB/S. He can cover WR's, TE's, rush the QB, and crowd the line against the run. What do we get from Young? Pass rush and run stop.

The link I am attaching is not very substantive, but shows the general consensus on Simmons. He too, will be special in the NFL.

https://redskinswire.usatoday.com/2020/01/15/simmons-could-be-better-fit-for-redskins-at-no-2/
 

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Re: Burner's Burning Questions: Free Agency, Mocks, Camps, OTAs, Roster Predictions,

Really? We are going to judge a kid's future on 3 games? 😆

So, if he had the multi-sack game against Wisconsin the second time around instead of the first then all would be well?

Maybe Clemson could double Young and beat the defense because they have better overall talent and one player wasn't enough to make up the difference.

I don't watch as much college football live as some others do but if you look at the record of the SEC against the Big Ten it's obvious which teams go 2-3 deep at most positions.
 

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Re: Burner's Burning Questions: Free Agency, Mocks, Camps, OTAs, Roster Predictions,

 

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Re: Burner's Burning Questions: Free Agency, Mocks, Camps, OTAs, Roster Predictions,

Really? We are going to judge a kid's future on 3 games? 😆

So, if he had the multi-sack game against Wisconsin the second time around instead of the first then all would be well?

Maybe Clemson could double Young and beat the defense because they have better overall talent and one player wasn't enough to make up the difference.

I don't watch as much college football live as some others do but if you look at the record of the SEC against the Big Ten it's obvious which teams go 2-3 deep at most positions.
1. The exchanges covered options...not ultimatums.

2. The number 2 overall pick in the draft? Not quite the same criteria as, say, number 12 or 22.

In the event, appears to be a done deal.
 

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Re: Burner's Burning Questions: Free Agency, Mocks, Camps, OTAs, Roster Predictions,

I think our defense will improve dramatically under Del Rio and Rivera. Because of that, I'm hoping we trade down and fill multiple needs instead of adding Chase Young. In the long run, I think the team would receive a greater benefit from drafting multiple players than if we use that pick on him.
 

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Re: Burner's Burning Questions: Free Agency, Mocks, Camps, OTAs, Roster Predictions,

Really? We are going to judge a kid's future on 3 games? ������
Who judged him on only 3 games?


I don't watch as much college football live as some others do but if you look at the record of the SEC against the Big Ten it's obvious which teams go 2-3 deep at most positions.
Chase Young never faced an SEC team.
 
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CounterTrey

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Re: Burner's Burning Questions: Free Agency, Mocks, Camps, OTAs, Roster Predictions,

In his first 8 games of the season he had 13.5 sacks against the lesser talented teams, but did have a 4 sack game against a very good Wisconsin team.

He was suspend for 2 games, then had another monster day against a good Penn State defense with 3 sacks.

Then?

The last 3 games of the season he had 0 sacks.

Michigan was blown out and he didn't play much of the 2nd half, so I guess we can give him a pass.

In the 2nd game against Wisconsin I did not see a tremendous amount of double teams against him, but they held him to 0 sacks in the Big 10 Championship when he had 4 against them in their 1st meeting.

Then in their loss to Clemson in the playoff it looked like he was double teamed more often than the Wisconsin game...again, held to 0 sacks.

Look, it's more than fair to say this kid is special...7 sacks in 2 games against 2 of the best teams in the Big 10 is proof enough. If we draft him, I will not be upset at all. But what happened down the stretch of the last 3 games? Was it scheme? Was it fatigue? Why was he unable to perform at the level he'd shown he could?

So I am ok, with a trade down...or what Isaiah Simmons offers in comparison, the more I research that kid, the more I like. Clemson had him playing slot CB, Safety, and LB...and he was dominant in all 3 facets of the game. That is Sean Taylor type of play from a player who likely would be a weak side LB/S. He can cover WR's, TE's, rush the QB, and crowd the line against the run. What do we get from Young? Pass rush and run stop.

The link I am attaching is not very substantive, but shows the general consensus on Simmons. He too, will be special in the NFL.

https://redskinswire.usatoday.com/2020/01/15/simmons-could-be-better-fit-for-redskins-at-no-2/
What changed? Double teams, the rest of the season for some crazy reason (stubbornness?) other teams tried to play him without any help for their TE or T and he ate them alive. Single him with any consistency at all and he will absolutely kill it. His ability to bend and adjust mid attack is freaky and his strength on a bull rush for ex is also off the charts. While not getting any sacks he still was very disruptive to the QB, in the Clemson game the only thing that kept him off the sack sheet was Trevor Lawrence had a career game running. I disagree with your assessment of the 2nd Wisconsin game, they doubled him quite a bit actually and he was still disruptive.

I have an extreme bias here, I am an OSU fan and I think this kid is a freak, as in better than rookie of the year Nick Bosa. He's the best I've ever seen at OSU in my 49 years. Put him with a coach like Del Rio and it's sky's the limit. I think if we do anything but pick this once a generation player we are going to come to regret passing on a great like we have so many times in the past.
 

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Re: Burner's Burning Questions: Free Agency, Mocks, Camps, OTAs, Roster Predictions,

What changed? Double teams, the rest of the season for some crazy reason (stubbornness?) other teams tried to play him without any help for their TE or T and he ate them alive.


Were they better teams toward the end of the year? Sure, but CT...he was not nearly as productive as the first 8 games of the season and it wasn't because team were all of a sudden double teaming him, I watched a lot of their games, he was double teamed all season long.
 

Om

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Re: Burner's Burning Questions: Free Agency, Mocks, Camps, OTAs, Roster Predictions,

To me this one is a no-brainer ... if the consensus amount the football people in the Redskins building is that Young is in fact a true blue-chip prospect, at a game-changing position we have had precious little crunch-time production from in many years, you take him and never look back.

Been so long since we've had a reliable 4th-quarter pass rush in those final game-deciding possessions when you absolutely, positively have to have one, we simply can't pass up an opportunity like this. Hopefully it'll be along time before we're drafting this high again in a year where the guy most every talent scout puts at the top of the draft charts at a position of need like pass-rushing DE just happens to be there for the taking.

Long time between now and draft day, though, so we'll see how the combine, interviews, etc., go.
 

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Re: Burner's Burning Questions: Free Agency, Mocks, Camps, OTAs, Roster Predictions,

To me this one is a no-brainer ... if the consensus amount the football people in the Redskins building is that Young is in fact a true blue-chip prospect, at a game-changing position we have had precious little crunch-time production from in many years, you take him and never look back.

Been so long since we've had a reliable 4th-quarter pass rush in those final game-deciding possessions when you absolutely, positively have to have one, we simply can't pass up an opportunity like this. Hopefully it'll be along time before we're drafting this high again in a year where the guy most every talent scout puts at the top of the draft charts at a position of need like pass-rushing DE just happens to be there for the taking.

Long time between now and draft day, though, so we'll see how the combine, interviews, etc., go.


Its absolutely an interesting conversation to have. I will be the first person to say that if you can add a game changer, you do it. Figure out the rest as you go, because they are not easy to come by.

That said.... This draft is REALLY good in the top 5-7 picks. You could go into MOST drafts and Burrow, Young, or Tua (obviously depending on injury reports) could be no. 1 overall. In fact, Tua was pretty much the consensus no. 1 coming into this season. If we can get an insane amount of value and still have the no. 5 pick while ADDING 2 first round picks, it has to be seriously considered.

The way it was presented to me that really hit home was.... Would you have been ok with trading 3 first round picks for Khalil Mack? Even if Young ends up being Khalil Mack 2.0.... would you trade 3 first round picks to get him? That is essentially what were doing if we pass on that type of a trade.

This is all early speculation, and the 3 first round picks is an extreme scenario that I don't really think has any sort of likelyhood, but it is a fun convo to have....
 

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Re: Burner's Burning Questions: Free Agency, Mocks, Camps, OTAs, Roster Predictions,

Its absolutely an interesting conversation to have. I will be the first person to say that if you can add a game changer, you do it. Figure out the rest as you go, because they are not easy to come by.

That said.... This draft is REALLY good in the top 5-7 picks. You could go into MOST drafts and Burrow, Young, or Tua (obviously depending on injury reports) could be no. 1 overall. In fact, Tua was pretty much the consensus no. 1 coming into this season. If we can get an insane amount of value and still have the no. 5 pick while ADDING 2 first round picks, it has to be seriously considered.

The way it was presented to me that really hit home was.... Would you have been ok with trading 3 first round picks for Khalil Mack? Even if Young ends up being Khalil Mack 2.0.... would you trade 3 first round picks to get him? That is essentially what were doing if we pass on that type of a trade.

This is all early speculation, and the 3 first round picks is an extreme scenario that I don't really think has any sort of likelyhood, but it is a fun convo to have....
This is where I have been all along...especially since you mentioned Simmons and made me look into it a little more. That kid is special, too...although I doubt he'd make it past the Lions. There is Okudah who is a solid top 5, and if we did slip down to 6, there is a much needed OT, Andrew Thomas.

Add on another 1st round pick at least, probably another 2nd and a late rounder, I doubt we'd get 3 firsts.

However, as Om said...I would not be upset if we took Young. The kid is special, I just have some reservations on the whole generational talent idea if he can't perform like he had all year, during the 3 biggest games of the season.
 

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Re: Burner's Burning Questions: Free Agency, Mocks, Camps, OTAs, Roster Predictions,

This is where I have been all along...especially since you mentioned Simmons and made me look into it a little more. That kid is special, too...although I doubt he'd make it past the Lions. There is Okudah who is a solid top 5, and if we did slip down to 6, there is a much needed OT, Andrew Thomas.

Add on another 1st round pick at least, probably another 2nd and a late rounder, I doubt we'd get 3 firsts.

However, as Om said...I would not be upset if we took Young. The kid is special, I just have some reservations on the whole generational talent idea if he can't perform like he had all year, during the 3 biggest games of the season.

If we trade out of #2 , the only player someone would want to go that high for would be Tua, which means when Detroit is on the clock, Young is still on the board. They likely either take him, or trade back with someone else who wants him. Young at 3 could be an insane value because nobody expected him to be there. The only way I even consider trading away from Young is if we end up at 5, and are guaranteed to end up with Simmons, Okudah, or Young (who wouldn't fall that far). 1 of those 3 would end up a Redskin, and I would be ok with it, given the additional return of draft picks makes it that way.

I'm with you, I'm not saying Young is a bad pick.. I'd be 100% fine with us taking him... there's actually little REAL speculation that we don't keep 2 and draft him, so a lot of this is just message board conversation to occupy the next 3 months.

You mentioned looked into Simmons and seem to have gotten more interested. What about him got your attention? I know I have my own opinions, just like multiple eyes and seeing what they see.
 

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Burner's Burning Questions: Free Agency, Mocks, Camps, OTAs, Roster Predictions, 2020

JLC saying he expects Rivera to obtain Derek Carr as his QB1
Not to say it can't happen (anything is possible) but I don't see how that would make sense for us?

Here's the blurb. It's absolute speculation (he also has the Raiders replacing him with Jameis Winston):

Washington Redskins – Derek Carr. Owner Dan Snyder loves first round pick Dwayne Haskins, but new coach Ron Rivera, who has extensive power, has already publicly hedged his bets. Rivera's first hire, defensive coordinator Jack Del Rio, is a champion of Carr's and they went to the playoffs together with Carr an MVP candidate. Yes, Alex Smith is still costing $19M, but Snyder could restructure Carr's deal easily to bring his 2020 cap hit down to like $7M and it's a long shot Smith ever plays again. Carr's contract is cheap enough to flip again down the road if need be.



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Re: Burner's Burning Questions: Free Agency, Mocks, Camps, OTAs, Roster Predictions,

JLC saying he expects Rivera to obtain Derek Carr as his QB1
Well, it's JLC, so that means it actually has a .0000000000000000000000003% chance of happening.
 

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Re: Burner's Burning Questions: Free Agency, Mocks, Camps, OTAs, Roster Predictions,

I'll say one thing for JLC ... he still knows how to stir it up in Redskins land.
 

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Re: Burner's Burning Questions: Free Agency, Mocks, Camps, OTAs, Roster Predictions,

(he also has the Raiders replacing him with Jameis Winston):
Maybe teams are trying to copy the Ryan Tannehill experiment and success ;
Take a disappointing QB from a Florida team, and see if you can revive his career in a new environment.
I mean, it is a copycat league.
 

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Re: Burner's Burning Questions: Free Agency, Mocks, Camps, OTAs, Roster Predictions,

What the Redskins need more than anything else is more foundation players - A list performers who can change games and have to be accounted for by opposing coaches.

At #2 overall we have a rare chance to do that, optimistically believing that Rivera could get this team to around 7-9 even without major upgrades.

So this may be our one chance to draft in the top 5 and in this case quality is more valuable than quantity.

If Kyle Smith and Rivera are left alone we should be able to pick up solid contributors in the balance of rounds and free agency.
 

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Re: Burner's Burning Questions: Free Agency, Mocks, Camps, OTAs, Roster Predictions,

Whats weally suspicious and interesting is that you see Haskins campaigning often for his OSU ex-teammates, but you never see him campaign for Joe Burrow, who's also a former teammate at OSU !


Hmmm !
 

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Re: Burner's Burning Questions: Free Agency, Mocks, Camps, OTAs, Roster Predictions,

Is that really strange? 🤪🤪🤪
 

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