Bears @ Commanders - Day After Thread

[Hazel-Ra]

We lost the turnover battle 0-3 and that was the game. You can't survive 3 turnovers and your defense is not doing it's job if they do not take the ball away and this defense simply does not do this for whatever reason. I questioned the Joe Whitt hire at the time and I feel more strongly about that now. He just never gets the most out of his players.

Agree. Being -3 in turnovers, we actually made it look better than it was losing by 1. It's only 1 less than the -4 we had in the Conference Championship game w/ Philly and I don't know if I'll ever be over that game,

 

[method man]

It looked like they went into this game assuming this and not being strategic on how to adjust to what the Bears might throw at them.

I think they need to tackle better than be so overly concerned with takeaways at this point.


This team doesn't seem to be prepared to start with a lead. It wins with JDs heroics later on improvisation.


Yes, it felt worse than a blow out game. Even with all the turnovers, mistakes, missed tackles and poor coaching we could have won and lost with no time left.


It sounds like defensively the aren't fast enough or able to get to get where they need to be in time whether in coverage or getting at the QB. Speedier LBs and better Edge play.

Offensively the receivers can't separate. It was evident Deebo wasn't 100%. Why didn't they make an effort to get Lane more involved, he needs more touches? And honestly I expected Sinnott would be involved in the pass game at least a little instead of Ekler, Bates too.

Good breakdown. Another core issue is we don’t have a starting caliber safety currently on the roster. We’ve had our chances to get one - Peppers after he was let go by the Patriots & CJGJ after he was let go by the Texans. Savage stinks

 

[AngryChuckT]

I am still pretty ticked this morning. A lot od football left, but this game smacked me in the face that I probably will need the Jim Mora meme sooner rather than later.

 

[Porkskins]

This doesn't help with content but after watching a season and a half of him calling defense, I'm beginning to understand why his name is Whitt versus Wit. Our DC doesn't have a Whitt of sense.

I typically post on a couple of other 'Skins/Commanders forums but often come over to read. I said it since midway through the 2024 season re: Whitt isn't cut out for the job.

Have any of you been in a situation or witnessed a situation where you "just know," whether good, bad, or indifferent? That was me (bad) after the first half in our 2023 season opener re: Eric Bieniemy. I knew deep down Bieniemy was gonna stink if he didn't change his way of play calling. I told a couple friends who watched that game with me. Unfortunately, for our sakes, I was right.

Midway through last season, after giving Whitt numerous weeks, I felt he was in over his head. Initially, I kept telling myself it's the lack of personnel (which had serious merit) and things could turn with better talent. Then I realized it's Whitt. He has no feel for the moment. I'm really starting to surmise he has no feeling for not only the moment, but the game itself (I'm sure he knows the game, but I think he lacks feel for it). He doesn't know when to blitz or go zone, and frankly his scheme seems as if it's outdated (his blitzes also lack creativity IMO).

I can give two examples (although there's more) that speaks volumes: one from last season and one from last night. Last season, we just score and go up on the Steelers, 24-14. The Steelers has a decent drive going on the ensuing possession. Armstrong or Fowler gets a sack and our fans can now smell blood in the water as it's 2nd and 19. Why not bring pressure as the fans are loud and momentum is on our side, right? Nope. Not Joe Whitt, Jr. He goes into a very soft coverage, and George Pickens picks up 30 yards, and the Steelers end up scoring a TD; sways momentum; and eventually wins the game.

Last night, it's 3rd and 6, and one more first down by the Bears basically ends the game (as long as they make the FG, which they end up doing). Maybe blitz to possibly force a quick and errant pass as we have nothing to lose at that point, right? Nope. Not Joe Whitt, Jr. Let's go into this soft arse weak zone that has more holes than a honeycomb, and holes the size of a large bagel. Easy completion. Ballgame.

IMO, Quinn needs to take over the defense as I've seen (more than) enough of Whitt.

 

[ExoDus84]

It sucks to lose a game we should have won against a mediocre team, but this is the NFL, and it happens.

The slow starts are an enormous issue. How many games are you going to win when you come out and spot your opponents 10-14 points in the first quarter? They routinely show up looking unprepared, with the "defense" looking like they couldn't stop UCLA. That's on coaching, and has to change immediately.

Jayden had a very uncharacteristic game with two turnovers, but the bright side being they were both book ended with excellent play otherwise. He was sharp, accurate, and gave us a chance to win, and did so with the most mediocre supporting cast of his young career. The fumble at the end is absolutely killer, but isn't something that's going to happen very frequently. I'm not worried about him. He's still real, real good.

Not a fan of not going for the two point conversion when the TD put us up by 7. Make it a 9 point game there. We had momentum, and we're still up by a full TD if we fail.

Defense can't make a play when we need them the most. I'm basically over Whitt at this stage.

Our kicker still sucks. Those three points probably give us the W, despite losing the turnover battle 0-3.

Lastly, we need our star players back. Getting Terry, Noah, and Cosmi back would be huge going into Dallas. We are shorthanded badly on offense right now.

 

[method man]

I typically post on a couple of other 'Skins/Commanders forums but often come over to read. I said it since midway through the 2024 season re: Whitt isn't cut out for the job.

Have any of you been in a situation or witnessed a situation where you "just know," whether good, bad, or indifferent? That was me (bad) after the first half on our 2023 season opener re: Eric Bieniemy. I knew deep down Bieniemy was gonna stink if he didn't change his way of play calling. I told a couple friends who watched that game with me. Unfortunately, for our sakes, I was right.

Midway through last season, after giving Whitt numerous weeks, I felt he was in over his head. Initially, I kept telling myself it's the lack of personnel (which had serious merit) and things could turn with better talent. Then I realized it's Whitt. He has no feel for the moment. I'm really starting to surmise he has no feeling for not only the moment, but the game itself (I'm sure he knows the game, but I think he lacks feel for it). He doesn't know when to blitz or go zone, and frankly his scheme seems as if it's outdated (his blitzes also lack creativity IMO).

I can give two examples (although there's more) that speaks volumes: one from last season and one from last night. Last season, we just score and go up on the Steelers, 24-14. The Steelers has a decent drive going on the ensuing possession. Armstrong or Fowler gets a sack and our fans can now smell blood in the water as it's 2nd and 19. Why not bring pressure as the fans are loud and momentum is on our side, right? Nope. Not Joe Whitt, Jr. He does into a very soft coverage, and George Pickens picks up 30 yards, and the Steelers end up scoring a TD; sways momentum; and eventually wins the game.

Last night, it's 3rd and 6, and one more first down by the Bears basically ends the game (as long as they make the FG, which they end up doing). Maybe blitz to possibly force a quick and errant pass as we have nothing to lose at that point, right? Nope. Not Joe Whitt, Jr. Let's go into this soft arse weak zone that has more holes than a honeycomb, and holes the size of a large bagel. Easy completion. Ballgame.

IMO, Quinn needs to take over the defense as I've seen (more than) enough of Whitt.

It’s a bad look for ownership to step so AP needs to step in. Otherwise, DQ will carry water for his guy out of loyalty. As I said in another thread, Ulbrich, his LB coach during his entire ATL tenure, was out there and he could’ve had him but he passed on him to keep Whitt.

Probably fair to say JDR was a better DC than him. He at least gave us 2020 and 2022 and he made the adjustments in 2021 to get us on that win streak before COVID wrecked the team

 

[Porkskins]

Good breakdown. Another core issue is we don’t have a starting caliber safety currently on the roster. We’ve had our chances to get one - Peppers after he was let go by the Patriots & CJGJ after he was let go by the Texans. Savage stinks

CJGJ is supposedly a bad locker room guy around league circles. Our biggest issue is Whitt.

 

[NoCalSkins]

So the obvious which has already been stated is that 0-3 in the turnover battle usually makes it a tough game to try and win and that ended up being true last night.

However, I am also going to say that it is really frustrating to watch our team go up against a team that didn't really showcase much on offense other than what was 100% expected. Swift was the captain and Caleb Williams was more or less a screen merchant the entire game and it actually worked. Why did it work? Well for starters this defense remains terrible at tackling. Every defense will give up receptions, but you have to complete tackles when your arms are wrapped around the player. I can't figure out if Whitt was simple out-coached or all he cared about was stopping any potential Caleb Williams hospital balls downfield because Ben Johnson was clearly calling a scheme to protect Caleb from having to do much in the passing game and Whitt's response to that was to oblige by giving space off the line every single time.

On offense, things were sloppy to start the game AGAIN. The interception when Deebo was wide open was disappointing. I am not sure if JD5 didn't see the safety so he threw more of a line drive ball through the traffic instead of lofting the throw over it, but 99/100 times if a WR is that open it is easy pitch & catch TD. The running game was disappointing last night. The stats by the end of the game might look okay, but through the course of the game it never seemed to be reliable when needed and/or lacked consistency.

At 6 games in, and tough next three weeks, I am losing hope of being able to win games this season outside of the offense having a major re-awakening and running track meets worth of points because this defense isn't really showing anything that suggests they are turning a corner or improving in any consistent kind of way.

 

[Porkskins]

It’s a bad look for ownership to step so AP needs to step in. Otherwise, DQ will carry water for his guy out of loyalty. As I said in another thread, Ulbrich, his LB coach during his entire ATL tenure, was out there and he could’ve had him but he passed on him to keep Whitt.

Probably fair to say JDR was a better DC than him. He at least gave us 2020 and 2022 and he made the adjustments in 2021 to get us on that win streak before COVID wrecked the team

That's quite telling if you believe Del Rio is a better coordinator than Whitt. Frankly, I thought Del Rio was done as a solid NFL defensive coordinator around 2022. You have a good point re: Del Rio's adjustments in '21 before Covid wrecked the team.

I, too, thought Peters may want to intervene, but Peters could be buying his time for now. At some point, even if it's the off-season, I feel Peters will step in re: Quinn making a change.

 

[Faithful Fan]

You guys have said most of it, but here are my notes from yesterday.

Good:

Jayden had a few great runs including his longest of the year, looks like he still has his speed even with the injury and knee brace. He also completed 73% of his passes and threw three touchdowns.

Luke McCaffery has scored a touchdown in three out of the last four games and continues to excel returning kicks.

Sainristil made some plays, including a pass break up to prevent a touchdown in the red zone and a clutch play to break up the 2-point attempt and preserve the lead.

McNichols looks like a decent third-down back. He had a few catches and does great in pass protection.

Payne blocked a kick and continues to look good this season.

Luvu, Reaves, Miller, and Armstrong got sacks.

Ertz continues to be a reliable target.

Chris Moore had his best game of the year, that TD catch was beautiful.

We did a good job moving the chains, 22 first downs, converted a 4th down, and won the time of possession. Really we played well enough to win this if not for the turnovers.

Bad:

Turnovers are the most important stat in football. Losing the turnover battle 3-0 is unacceptable.

JCM is a gifted runner with amazing speed, agility, and vision, but if he cannot improve his ball security then he won’t make it. That’s two lost fumbles in two week plus partial credit for the botched handoff that cost us the game.

Jayden gets the benefit of the doubt because he has not shown this tendency before, but he threw a bad pick in the red zone and put the ball on the ground twice with zero contact, including the fumble that lost the game. He needs to focus in on ball security, especially with all the fancy ball handling this offense requires.

Gay missed another field goal, and it appears he has continued his habit of being 50-50 from 50+. It would be nice to have a good kicker, but we don’t.

We’re really missing McLaurin and Brown. We didn’t have a receiver go over 50 yards yesterday.

Somehow we need to stop spotting teams two scores in the first quarter. Seems we have to dig ourselves out of a hole every week.

Ugly:

Those black uniforms are hideous, and I’m sure our record in them is bad.

The refs bailed us out multiple times, including a highly suspicious illegal formation penalty that negated a Bears score, but we still lost.

We are now 3-3 through the easy part of our schedule, and predicting anything better than 9-8 seems foolishly optimistic at this point. Either we have regressed or last year was a fluke, or maybe both.

 

[RedWolf]

Disgusting game. I hate the days after a loss

 

[Conn]

People are doing a really good and thorough job of hitting the negatives (and I did as well last night in the game thread), so I’ll hit some small positives:

McCaffrey: He’s still not earning enough targets to feel truly good about, but the catches he’s making are impactful. A couple more great returns (with another called back by dumb penalty unrelated to the return). He’s slowly but surely breaking out, but I want to see more. Considering we’re running Chris Moore out there (great TD catch, first since 2022, but come on), he needs to be getting more snaps and targets if he’s going to be the real deal.

Lane: flash! That catch down the sideline was a great route and a great hands catch. He and McCaffrey are both plucking balls out of the air better than anyone we’ve had recently (even prime McLaurin is more of a body catcher, though he’s good in contested situations).

JCM: the fumbles sucked, the last one more Jayden’s fault than Bill’s, but despite less push from the OL he still willed his way to some nice runs. He’s for real, and I’m glad they keep going back to him despite the fumbles. But he’s gotta keep rewarding them for doing so.

Amos: some good reps, he continues to look like the real deal and plays with confidence but not arrogance.

Jayden: aside from the two dumb turnovers (one of which might have been his worst throw as a pro to be honest), he’s getting his groove back. Quickly pressured on many snaps, but he mostly executed. There are still times where he needs to throw the ball away rather than running out of bounds for a loss, that’s a pet peeve of mine, but he’s generally a very smart and situationally aware player so I don’t let it bug me too much. He’s a stud, he hasn’t looked right so far this year but he dropped some dimes last night and you can feel him rounding into form.

McNichols: I’m glad he’s the smaller part of the RBBC we’re running, but he’s valuable on passing downs and he willed himself to a couple of very important first downs yesterday after the catch. Good signing and I think Ekeler was a bit of a crutch for Kliff and we’re better off now, tbh. He had his moments but this rotation we have now is better. Once JCM improves his pass protection and receiving skills we’ll be in much better shape, in terms of run/pass disguise.

That’s all I’ve got for now. The FG block was sweet and Payne + Kinlaw deserve major props for that, but they got their asses so whomped in run defense that I don’t even want to think about them.

 

[CommanderSkins]

We essentially overcame:

Two starting WR injuries
Yet another slow start
A missed, long 50-yard field goal attempt which bounced off the upright
And 3 turnovers

And still could have won the game, EXCEPT that our defense cannot get its collective butt off the field until the other team scores. Yes, the last turnover was horrible, but if we stopped them on 4 straight plays and get a turnover on downs, we win that game. Nope: we let them run all over and through us, and then allowed them to pass on us when needed. If the defense doesn’t drastically improve, we’re done.

 

[Riggotoni]

Honestly, I think this is a poor team with a great QB. We will probably need to invest quite a bit in the defense over the off-season. Wagner reminds me of London Fletcher's last year - invaluable as a field general but no longer quick enough to play well.

 

[Voice_of_Reason]

JCM: the fumbles sucked, the last one more Jayden’s fault than Bill’s, but despite less push from the OL he still willed his way to some nice runs. He’s for real, and I’m glad they keep going back to him despite the fumbles. But he’s gotta keep rewarding them for doing so.

Read into it what you will, but this was Daniel's quote after the game on that last fumble:

He's putting the whole fumble on himself, and I appreciate he did that.

Bill gets credit for the first one, he is owning the second one, and obviously the INT.

Thank God for accountability.

 

[Voice_of_Reason]

Honestly, I think this is a poor team with a great QB. We will probably need to invest quite a bit in the defense over the off-season. Wagner reminds me of London Fletcher's last year - invaluable as a field general but no longer quick enough to play well.

I don't think it's a poor team. I think it's an average team with a great QB.

That said, I think there are some circumstances which we should note:

• Not having McLaurin and Brown in camp set the entire offense back in terms of developing chemistry and preparation. We're still feeling this.
• I still think the McLaurin hold-in completely destroyed the good juju around the team. Disrupted preparation, then he was back and they had to work him in, then he's hurt and out again. The whole thing stinks.
• McLaurin and Brown being out is really hurting the offense in general, and Deebo is banged up, which doesn't help.
• They are missing 2 guys on a thin defense which they were really counting on to make significant impacts in Will Harris and Deatrich Wise Jr. Wise was supposed to be the run-stuffing DE which set the edge, and Harris the starting safety. Davonte Jean-Baptiste is also on IR, and Goldman didn't play because of illness. So, a group that was somewhat thin is now REALLY thin.
• Rookies will make rookie mistakes. You just have to live with them. Bill has to stop fumbling.
• Ron left the cupboard so bare, it's a miracle we're not in some ridiculous 3 year "trust the process" plan. I think overall Peters has done an outstanding job bringing in vets to go along with draft picks to be competitive right away.

The roster is not complete by a long shot. They need to keep drafting and getting younger. That's going to take some time. When you only have like 8 players from all the Ron drafts on the roster at all, when they should be the core of the team, that's bad.

Last year was a magic carpet ride. Anybody who expected this year to be the same was kidding themselves. Not because the schedule is super hard (it's not looking anywhere near as daunting now as it did in August), but because that kind of thing doesn't happen every year to a rebuilding team. They caught lightening in a bottle.

This year is probably more what last year should have been.

 

[Kel Varnsen]

Not a fan of not going for the two point conversion when the TD put us up by 7. Make it a 9 point game there. We had momentum, and we're still up by a full TD if we fail.

I love these types of discussions and very few people (including coaches it seems) don’t think of it this way. In last night's game, I thought it was the correct call to kick. It was too early in the 4th quarter for that two pointer to matter. In fact, the Bears got the ball 3 more times after that TD. So 1 or 2 score game after the Ertz TD, the Bears had a chance to overcome it. And by missing the 2 point conversion after their TD, they were in the exact same spot had Quinn gone for 2 and got it and gone up 9. The Bears would have kicked the extra point and made it a 2 point game after the Swift TD. Now, had the offense moved the ball and scored or just run the clock out on the last drive, they limit the possessions anyway. But that didn’t happen.

In general, that strategy works best when you are under 5 minutes left. When you know you can limit the possessions of the other team. A 1 score game with the ball and 5 minutes, you have hope. A two score game and that little time, you are more desperate. But I certainly wish more coaches would go for two more in that spot. Just last night was too much time left.

Quinn made some mistakes in coaching last night, but on this one, I agree with him.

 

[Single-Bar Facemask]

Gay's FG% is 71.4. Worst in the NFL. Unacceptable for a team that wants to contend for a Super Bowl.

 

[Petey hodge]

I just can't believe we were driving to ice the game, only to have that bar of soap slip out of our hands, leading to a game-winning FG. Such a disappointing ending.

We "dropped our soap"

 

[Voice_of_Reason]

Gay's FG% is 71.4. Worst in the NFL. Unacceptable for a team that wants to contend for a Super Bowl.

Yeah, there aren't a lot of guys out there which would be a lot better at this point though, if any.

Also, while the game might have been different if he hits the kick, the same could be said for not turning the ball over 3 times.

The fact this was a 1 point loss when you commit 3 turnovers is a statistical anomaly. Typically if you turn the ball over 3 times, you get blown out.