• Welcome to BGO! We know you will have questions as you become familiar with the software. Please take a moment to read our New BGO User Guide which will give you a great start. If you have questions, post them in the Feedback and Tech Support Forum, or feel free to message any available Staff Member.

Beck vs. Grossman

The NFL is a QB driven league. Problem is neither of ours qualify for a leaners permit.
 
Neophyte said:
While I can't argue that Beck is better than Rex, I need to point out that Rex had 5 starters that Beck hasn't had (Hightower, Moss, Cooley, Williams and Lichtenstieger). The line has been in a constant state of flux since he came in and frankly, I can't see how Rex could have been better but he easily could have been worse.
Click to expand...

Cooley hasn't really started all season. Hightower wasn't exactly a worldbeater back there when he was in. Williams was in yesterday. Pass protection was not bad yesterday.

Missing Moss hurts, but as we've seen guys are getting open. Beck's just not seeing them, and when he does he can't get it to them.

Yes, our depth is a problem, but that's not why Beck is a bad QB. He just is one.
 
fansince62 said:
me thinks you exaggerate! the reality is that...like Beck...Rex's only good games were during pre-season. he managed a somewhat credible effort against a wounded Gints team. otherwise.....the offense's performace was just as anemic under Rex as with Beck. At this point...i don't much care which of these incredible mediocrities are under center. I do think some are giving rex more credit than he is due. the offense didn't do squat under his leadsership either. the only difference then...was the litanany of "it's o-line/receivers" fault excuses we had to endure whilke Butterball had his belly under center.
Click to expand...

I don't think anyone excused Rex for being a lousy QB when he was being a lousy QB for us. He's not a starting-quality QB, which is why the front office's obsession with him last year and this offseason were so baffling. However, when his head in on straight, which is maybe half the time, he is a better QB than Beck.

That's not saying much because Beck is downright terrible. But there have at least been moments when Grossman has played like a real QB. Beck has not. Not once since he's been given the reigns as the starter.
 
With Grossman on the field the Redskins have a CHANCE to beat Miami, Seattle and perhaps the Vikings.

With Beck on the field you can go ahead and write off the balance of the season.

Seriously, I think it's that bad.

The schedule going forward is much more difficult than it has been and tougher defenses for Beck to face than Carolina and Buffalo.

Yesterday, it looked for 55 minutes as if that 59 yard field goal by Gano was going to be the only points the Redskins put on the board, after a 0-23 game against Buffalo and a less than stellar afternoon against Carolina.

The 8 points in garbage time to me aren't even worth talking about.

The other thing besides wins is the development of the younger receivers and backs.

These guys aren't going to develop with a third string quarterback starting these games.

Beck just doesn't have NFL talent.

If Shanahan and Son wanted to go with Grossman for one year before drafting a franchise qb in 2012, I could see that.

The mistake was in not bringing in a capable #2 to challenge Rex a bit and give the team a realistic option if and when Rex showed he could not change his penchant for interceptions and negative plays.
 
Elephant said:
Were they completions over 20 yards after the catch? I did not watch last week's game so I cannot say, but I have yet to see Beck actually throw it over 20 yards in the air that I can recall, today there was not one that went over 15 yards in the air.
Click to expand...

El, according to how ESPN does their splits the distances are how far the ball is thrown-they have a separate column for example the longest total yardage for each throwing range. Here are a couple of screencaps of how they show both Beck and Grossman's stats on length of throws. You can see in the Lng column the longest completed pass play for each throwing range.

First is John Beck this season:

p71VaKRd19M_6QzwF5vQ6JhZQsHf85fC5FX-1FmF1ucjo86n4_QwmXDS4pdVimSm7BFk5xEmxX4Aux4m1TYFT5Kcc2chZpGTJW3vFKoPfEuEOhNdLss


Next is Rex Grossman this season:

Nl4iTxBPckEWEnkVrQs_Lbmyj83a96o_wG1wITiLuxakmaorBXvgxtHDva4WlCuy4EWWCxc8EgIcmoSJj_omCEidTKmblPQ5f-e_VcaXPv1T7mr67K8


Link to all ESPN player passing splits for John Beck this season:

http://espn.go.com/nfl/player/splits/_/id/10484/john-beck

Link to all ESPN player passing splits for Rex Grossman this season:

http://espn.go.com/nfl/player/splits/_/id/4480/rex-grossman




ESPN, by the way, gets these stats from Elias Sports Bureau the service used by the NFL, NHL, MLB, NBA, MLS and WNBA for stat compilations
 
I still think it is amusing that back in September Sonny Jurgensen said that Jonathan Crompton threw the best ball of the 3 quarterbacks in the organization :)

I wonder if we are looking at another Trent Green situation where Trent was the #3 for 2 years while Heath and Gus were given all the snaps under Norv, who supposedly was a great qb guru.

Sonny said the same thing then about Green. Yet it took injuries to everyone else for Norv to finally start Green in 1998 and the team responded by going 6-2 down the stretch.

Then they lost him in free agency.

So, looking back at the non-Gibbs Redskins' history in the past 20 years one can ask how guys thought of as quarterback experts in Norv Turner and Mike Shanahan ended up choosing and playing some of the worst starters in the NFL at the time?

This reminds me of Billick going to Baltimore to build an offense and then simply riding the defense to a Super Bowl and another 7-8 years on the job.

Until he was exited from the organization they never did find that young quarterback or playmakers on the outside.
 
I'm not excusing Gibbs either, BD. He too has a rep as a QB genius and a more deserved one than either Norv or Shanahan as he won three trophies with three different guys, none of whom had a HoF career.

And Gibbs passed on Aaron Rogers...
 
Neophyte said:
And Gibbs passed on Aaron Rogers...
Click to expand...

To be fair, a lot of coaches passed on Aaron Rodgers, not just Gibbs. And also to be fair, had we taken him with the 9th overall pick, he may have struggled just as much as Jason did.
 
Actually, Aaron Rodgers was the #24 pick. Campbell was drafted next at #25. His original pick at #9 NO ONE had Rodgers on their board at that point even the supposed genius GMs out there.

What is objectionable here is that Mike and Kyle CHOSE to avoid taking a quarterback in either 2010 or 2011 drafts in ANY round and picked up veterans that they then couldn't work with.
 
Lanky Livingston said:
To be fair, a lot of coaches passed on Aaron Rodgers, not just Gibbs. And also to be fair, had we taken him with the 9th overall pick, he may have struggled just as much as Jason did.
Click to expand...

Sure, all possible. However, that was the second year in a year to drop a Top 10 pick on a DB when the team had a clear need at QB. Everyone, and I do mean everyone, thought Rogers the better player when compared to Campbell.

*shrug*

Maybe he would have struggled but Gibbs would not have thrown him to the wolves. He didn't do it with Jason either. And Rogers has a faster release which is what got Jason in a lot of early trouble. Somehow, I think Aaron would have been OK playing for Gibbs and maybe Gibbs would have enjoyed the rest of his second go around a bit more.

Granted, it is all hindsight but I don't remember a lot of fans being thrilled with the Campbell pick at the time. Nor Carlos Rodgers either, as I recall.
 
Thanks for posting that.

I thought I was the only person out there that question taking a cornerback #9 in 2005 and a safety #6 in 2007 when we had already spent a #4 pick in 2004 on Sean Taylor.

There are OTHER areas of the football team such as OL, DL, QB and WR that are critical to one's success.

The Redskins, like Matt Millen with all these wide receivers in Detroit, seem to have forgotten that.
 
Uhh, every Redskins fan on the planet has questioned Vinny's use of draft picks EVERYWHERE. Where have you been?
 
not at the time my friend :)

when Landry was drafted a lot of folks were ga-ga over what a Taylor/Landry combo at safety would do for the defense.

meanwhile, we had zippo for the defensive line.
 
Bulldog's Twin said:
Thanks for posting that.

I thought I was the only person out there that question taking a cornerback #9 in 2005 and a safety #6 in 2007 when we had already spent a #4 pick in 2004 on Sean Taylor.

There are OTHER areas of the football team such as OL, DL, QB and WR that are critical to one's success.

The Redskins, like Matt Millen with all these wide receivers in Detroit, seem to have forgotten that.
Click to expand...

I thought the Taylor pick in 2004 a no brainer. Seemed pretty obvious to me.

In 2005 I was hoping for a QB or a difference making pass rusher at #9 so we didn't have to live and die by the blitz. In fact, I would have a totally different view of that draft had we taken Rogers at 9 and a DB at 25, even had Rogers never worked out under center here in DC. But taking a CB, even one as well thought of by everyone as 'Los was, really bothered me.

And lets not even talk about how pissed I was over the Landry pick in 06.

To be honest, taking Carlos at #9 in 05 is where I started to loose faith that Gibbs was going to turn it around. That and drafting Campbell. It was then that I realized that the questions about his personnel decisions from late in the first go around were real and that maybe without a Bobby Beathard type he would be in trouble. The 06 draft just confirmed it for me.
 
But we had all-world talker Clinton Portis on the roster who we gave up Champ Bailey and a #2 pick for. Really think a move for Peterson would have looked solid at the time given the investment in Portis?
 
Besides, in that scheme and with the other players we had at the time, I doubt Petersen would have gotten anymore yards than Porits and he still isn't the blocker today Portis ever was. No, a RB at that point would have pissed me off even more than taking another S did.
 
I actually liked the landry pick, but then I thought we would sign some free agents in the front seven who would actually play well lol. if the Taylor tragedy hadnt happened we would have had the best safety tandem in history. given the style of defence we played at the time, it would have been solid.
 
This conversation has gone off on a weird tangent, but I will add that if Taylor hadn't been murdered the Landry pick might be looking a lot smarter right now.

EDIT: or what Ryman said. :)
 
fansince62 said:
me thinks you exaggerate!
Click to expand...

Well, I was exaggerating, but not that much when you look at those numbers posted by Serv. beck has only completed 2 passes longer than 20 yards lol. It's the shrinky dink offense with Beck in there. I'll take the chubby gunslinger...
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Total: 1, Members: 0, Guests: 1)

Help Users
We are all excited to experience the announcement of draft selections IN REAL TIME TOGETHER. If you feel the need to be the first to 'blurt out' the team's picks you are better off staying out of chat and sticking to Twitter. Please refrain from announcing/discussing our picks until the official announcement has been made at the podium. Thanks!

You haven't joined any rooms.

    You haven't joined any rooms.
    Top