The 2025 Free Agency Thread

[Primus Porcus]

Payne has been average except for a very short period of time when he was playing for a mega contract. He's a poor man's Albert Haynesworth.

I'm not sure i'd say Haynesworth. That dude never would have cared enough to get in Allen's face.

Dana Stubblefield or Dan Wilkinson maybe.

 

[RexTomb]

Payne has been average except for a very short period of time when he was playing for a mega contract. He's a poor man's Albert Haynesworth.

 

[Darrell Green Fan]

Oh Payne has not been Albert Haynesworth, Wilkerson or Stubblefield. But I never believed Jon Allen was very good other than one season.

As for Lattimore I was estatic at that trade. Everyone knows he was a top corner in his prime, I was willing to take the injury risk for a top player at a need position. But he is giving me Josh Norman vibes already and as I said previously he may be the most important player on the team going into 2025.

 

[SkinsNumberOne]

Although the length and investment in Kinlaw was surprising to me…I am more skeptical of the trade for Lattimore. I am not one of those expecting him to have a Lazarus-like return to his previous form. Hope I’m wrong.

I think the thing about the Kinlaw trade is, nothing visible in the situation maps to what happened, except perhaps some kind of nascent favor Kinlaw gained by being drafted by the 9ers with Peters. That's not great. Personally, I cannot map the deal he got with anything else, really.

I may be wrong, but I really thought he shouldn't have commanded what he did. As with *any* signing, there is risk, so we shouldn't have overpaid on a "maybe" like that in my mind.

As for Lattimore, that's not the same. I know more or less exactly what they thought:
- whoa, JD may lead us to the Super Bowl if we can get a bit better on D... what's out there
- OK, if if if, if Lattimore works out... we may make the Super Bowl
- we will also have him next year
- yes there is risk but the situation dictates it is well worth it

I can clearly see the logic there. I agree it hasn't worked out to the extent they probably hoped. I think the worst moments for me about it were:
- hearing Lattimore kind of demanded to be 1-on-1 with Evans in many ways, and then eventually seeing him off. Although I was glad these coaches made sure they made the change. <- from memory, no time to check
- against Eagles, Brown goaded him a lot. Lattimore got fired up and took the bait, and the refs also took the bait. Quinn did not seem pleased about that. I agreed with Quinn.

In this league, emotion properly channeled is an asset. Improperly channeled it can be a big liability. I would hope someone brings that out of Jalen Carter, but the refs have to hold him accountable.

 

[HTTR]

Yeah, Kinlaw did well on his contract. I would chalk it up to him having a good agent, and also peters having identified him as a guy he had to have. AP wanted to get that one done ASAP so he could move onto his other pursuits. I don’t think the extra million or millions we are spending is going to matter much in the long run. Still have plenty of cap space, and if Kinlaw works out it’s still going to look like a bargain. And if it doesn’t work out, it’s going to look like a bad signing, even if we had paid him a little less. It’s free agency, so you have to step up past your comfort zone to get the guy you want. As to why AP wanted him so bad? I have no idea either lol, but hopefully we’re going to find out!

 

[Boone]

You guys say that you 'trust' Adam Peters but do you? I have to suspect that Adam Peters knows a hell of a lot more about what Kinlaw can and can't do, how they intend to use him on this roster, and whether or not the cost to get him was exhorbitant or worth it than any of us do. The whole point of this site is to talk all-things-Commanders, so certainly nothing wrong with questioning moves. I roll my eyes less regarding questioning Peters on Lattimore - because he DOES have a pretty consistent history over multiple seasons of missing time due to injury. I have concerns myself although I'm hoping the team can figure out how to keep him on the field. But Kinlaw hasn't played a down here and he was brought in by the GM who knows him better than anyone. I think that warrants a little patience and faith.

None of that is to squelch the conversation. I just say - if you think any of Peters moves were stupid or wrong, just say it Own it.

We will all find out as the next couple seasons progress.

 

[Chris]

I don’t think that either of the moves were ‘stupid or wrong’ per se, but like Sgt. Schultz…I know nothing. I also don’t think that Peters is going to be the first human on the planet not to miscalculate. My personal concerns regarding Lattimore specifically are based on the perhaps foolhardy exercise of trying to predict future results based on past history. For me this is leveraged by the fact that not only has he been oft-injured for several years but he was traded for while injured. I believe that his acquisition was a ‘roll of the dice’ based significantly on the hope that he somehow overcomes his now chronic health issues and becomes a key contributor.

As previously stated…we’ll see and I hope that he does. (There goes that ‘hope’ word again. 🙂)

 

[Boone]

Yeah, as I said, the concerns on Lattimore are well-founded. But even there, Peters (who clearly is well-aware of Lattimore’s previous health issues) still felt it was a worthwhile (if high risk) move.

I just don’t think the ‘of course I trust Peters’ is necessary because what we really mean is ‘I trust him except when he makes moves I can’t see the logic in’

And to be fair, what GM deserves to have absolute trust? As you and others have correctly stated, even the best GM is going to pull some boner moves. It’s inevitable. Comes with the territory.

 

[Chris]

Trust but verify. 😉

 

[burgold]

You guys say that you 'trust' Adam Peters but do you? I have to suspect that Adam Peters knows a hell of a lot more about what Kinlaw can and can't do, how they intend to use him on this roster, and whether or not the cost to get him was exhorbitant or worth it than any of us do. The whole point of this site is to talk all-things-Commanders, so certainly nothing wrong with questioning moves. I roll my eyes less regarding questioning Peters on Lattimore - because he DOES have a pretty consistent history over multiple seasons of missing time due to injury. I have concerns myself although I'm hoping the team can figure out how to keep him on the field. But Kinlaw hasn't played a down here and he was brought in by the GM who knows him better than anyone. I think that warrants a little patience and faith.

None of that is to squelch the conversation. I just say - if you think any of Peters moves were stupid or wrong, just say it Own it.

We will all find out as the next couple seasons progress.

The interesting thing about Kinlaw when he was with the 49ers and Peters was at the point (I think) the 49ers had a really dominant line. It was a machine that had been together for years. So, the Kinlaw Peters' may know may be more about the guy on the practice field. Who knows? He might have been given really limited snaps on game day because that line was so good and entrenched and as a result was trying too hard to make splash plays and earn more playing time which led to mistakes.

Still, he was good enough for another team to snag him in free agency and then improved enough that Peters decided he wanted Kinlaw long term.

 

[Hail Raiser]

Kinlaw has sucked his entire time in the NFL. 49ers tanked their roster trading Buckner. Set them back a couple years. Us signing kinlaw is going to keep us out of the Clowney race, too.

Peter's is definitely going to have his misses. I don't trust him completely, but it's a good situation that we have. Took Howie years of sitting behind a bad FO. Peter's sat behind winners.

 

[Riggo44]

I believe that his acquisition was a ‘roll of the dice’ based significantly on the hope that he somehow overcomes his now chronic health issues and becomes a key contributor.

It could just come down to strength and conditioning…

 

[Riggo44]

The thing that worries me about Kinlaw is he went to the Jets, under Salah, and still wasn’t good. Salah was his DC in SF, so safe to say he knew him well too.

Now it’s entirely possible that our staff has a different idea in mind for him and have the key to unlock his potential, but it’s worrisome

 

[Boone]

I finally figured out what my point is. Whether or not a GM is great, good, or terrible isn’t dependent on how a couple of players work out (with the possible exception of QB which our guy already knocked out of the park). It’s the body of work and how that translates to success on the field that determines it. We have to trust Peters generally knows what he’s doing in most cases and expect some hiccups and WTF’s along the way.

 

[DWinzit]

The thing that worries me about Kinlaw is he went to the Jets, under Salah, and still wasn’t good. Salah was his DC in SF, so safe to say he knew him well too.

Now it’s entirely possible that our staff has a different idea in mind for him and have the key to unlock his potential, but it’s worrisome

It's interesting because Salah should have known him much better than Peters, went out of his way to recruit Kinlaw and entice him with that contract.

 

[burgold]

I thought I read Kinlaw was actually quite last year even though the rest of defense was awful.

 

[HTTR]

I’m so happy to finally have a legitimate GM in place, I’ll trust anybody! Especially AP with the fantastic job he’s done so far. As an Orioles fan, though, two years ago I had full blind trust in Mike Elias. He could do no wrong for me at that point. Now look at it. Nothing to do with AP of course, but it’s just a reminder there should always be some room for skepticism.

 

[burgold]

It's probably a contrarian take, but I think one of the most interesting things about Peters first two years is that in both years he rejected popular sentiment.

Year One: We need a left tackle. Our line sucks. Do everything we can to solve this problem.
(Result: The o-line overachieved and did much better than expected, but did require a significant overhaul in year two. Were we right or was Peters? Who knows? Tunsil is probably better than who we could have signed in free agency, Coleman is pretty good clay, and spending big on mediocre is no way to get great. So, I'm not sure if the masses were right or if Peters was. Peters certainly did hit the o line hard this year.)

Year Two: We need pass rushers! We need an edge!
(Result: Again, Peters seemed to disagree with us. He did not sell the farm for Garrett or Henderson. He did not even draft a pass rusher at all and let our best pass rusher walk. Instead, he invested heavily in stopping the run. Who's right? Time will tell.)

 

[bird_1972]

It's probably a contrarian take, but I think one of the most interesting things about Peters first two years is that in both years he rejected popular sentiment.

Year One: We need a left tackle. Our line sucks. Do everything we can to solve this problem.
(Result: The o-line overachieved and did much better than expected, but did require a significant overhaul in year two. Were we right or was Peters? Who knows? Tunsil is probably better than who we could have signed in free agency, Coleman is pretty good clay, and spending big on mediocre is no way to get great. So, I'm not sure if the masses were right or if Peters was. Peters certainly did hit the o line hard this year.)

Year Two: We need pass rushers! We need an edge!
(Result: Again, Peters seemed to disagree with us. He did not sell the farm for Garrett or Henderson. He did not even draft a pass rusher at all and let our best pass rusher walk. Instead, he invested heavily in stopping the run. Who's right? Time will tell.)

Good points, all.

Regarding "Year Two", I think the biggest weakness of our D last year was stopping the run. It's possible the FO is simply tuning out the noise and focusing on what they also viewed as most urgent. We are fortunate that we may have also improved our secondary significantly provided Amos can prove he's a serviceable starter. Will be a huge upgrade from St. Juste.

 

[HTTR]

It's probably a contrarian take, but I think one of the most interesting things about Peters first two years is that in both years he rejected popular sentiment.

Year One: We need a left tackle. Our line sucks. Do everything we can to solve this problem.
(Result: The o-line overachieved and did much better than expected, but did require a significant overhaul in year two. Were we right or was Peters? Who knows? Tunsil is probably better than who we could have signed in free agency, Coleman is pretty good clay, and spending big on mediocre is no way to get great. So, I'm not sure if the masses were right or if Peters was. Peters certainly did hit the o line hard this year.)

Year Two: We need pass rushers! We need an edge!
(Result: Again, Peters seemed to disagree with us. He did not sell the farm for Garrett or Henderson. He did not even draft a pass rusher at all and let our best pass rusher walk. Instead, he invested heavily in stopping the run. Who's right? Time will tell.)

I don’t really think AP disagreed with us as much as it was just a matter of opportunity. He didn’t want to overpay or over reach to address a perceived primary need, when there are always plenty of places where we can upgrade. It’s funny how we all sing about ‘best player available’ being the best draft strategy, and then we all get upset when they don’t draft for need.
If the right opportunity to acquire an edge rusher he liked didn’t come along this year, so be it. Improve the team in other areas where you get better value, and then you can get by for now without that star edge rusher. Maybe next year a great one falls in our lap. Kind of feel like that happened this year at OT with Connerly. Instead of reaching for one the year before who wouldn’t have been as good. Honestly, Coleman probably gave us just as much as whoever we passed up in the early second round last year would have.