Joe Barry Report Card

[Shi no Tenshi]

I honestly don't see any of this as a critique of Breeland. Every corner gets beat on occasion. Every player has an off night on occasion. Breeland has been excellent for us, and will continue to be, in all likelyhood.

It's on the coaches to identify when their player is either in a bad matchup for them, or having a bad night, and adjust. To give help over the top, or to change up the look or method. Bizzaro world is looking at a scheme that has continued to not work and say it isn't a problem. Of all the players on the defense, I think we have the most faith(and rightfully so) in our corners. But if they are having issues right then, and it's continuing to happen over and over during a game, I would expect that an adjustment to the calls would be in order.

I don't think there is any problem with the players, but I can't say you watch that game and can honestly say something didn't need to be done. It's possible that no corner in existence can do what was being asked of Breeland, and if that is the case, once again I question why he is being put in a position to fail. I have read/heard several times how great those throws/plays were, and maybe that's the case. I just find it hard to believe that there is absolutely nothing to be done about it.

I'm completely open to the idea that it was a complete lack of pass rush, but if that is the case...why weren't they scheming about that, instead of just hoping Breeland would be okay 1v1 against one of the best WRs playing currently, with a QB he's in sync with throwing to him?

I would hope all of us realize Breeland isn't the problem. I haven't really seen anybody bashing on him, however.

 

[Henry]

I think the criticism of Breeland is borderline ridiculous. Breeland has looked frequently like a top 5 corner. He had a bad game against probably the best QB/WR combo in the league. It happens.

Who is criticising Breeland? We all like Breeland. This isnt about Breeland. It's about paying a guy like a shut-down corner and not using him like one.

I'm not even sure I buy that Josh Norman is the superior corner. And I seriously doubt Norman does a bit better given some of the ridiculous passes Roethlisberger threw. I mean, Big Ben is scooping low snaps off the turf, and throwing perfect blind strikes downfield. It was a ridiculous performance. Breeland is one of the top 3 most talented players on this team. Period. He'll be back.

If Norman isnt any better than Breeland we spent way too much on him. Maybe Brown would have torched Norman, but we should have made their best guy beat our best guy. I dont understand how thats complicated.

Im not worried about Breeland at all. He's still the same young guy full of potential that he was two days ago. But he's our second best corner. He should be on their second best guy. If not all of the time and darn near most of the time.

No one here was more pissed about that game than I was. I left chat because I can't do the group pain thing. But lets get a grip people. We were never going to win 16 straight. This team will rebound. Have a little faith.

I had this game chalked up as a loss all along. I assume we'll rebound. However, I am concerned that we made some guy the highest paid corner in the entire league and we cant scheme the defense so that his primary job is to shut down the other team's best WR. If that truly is the case, its a collosal waste of money. In my opinion.

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[Henry]

2RBs rushed for 100 yards this weekend. The lowest total since 1993.

Guess how many WRs went for 100 this weekend? How about 150 yards?

And yet, the Redskins STILL managed to run the ball fewer times than any other team in the entire league, for fewer yards than 29 other teams.

Even within the context of the new pass-happy NFL, we are terrible at running the ball. That would be ok if it were just this game. However, given that this performance is an extention of last year's running attack it is at the very least worrysome.

Blame anyone you like. But Breeland? The same guy that shut Dez down twice? Our number 1 corner last season that stopped OBJ and others? Come on.

I dont think anyone is blaming Breeland.


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[Boone]

Who is criticising Breeland? We all like Breeland. This isnt about Breeland. It's about paying a guy like a shut-down corner and not using him like one.



If Norman isnt any better than Breeland we spent way too much on him. Maybe Brown would have torched Norman, but we should have made their best guy beat our best guy. I dont understand how thats complicated.

Im not worried about Breeland at all. He's still the same young guy full of potential that he was two days ago. But he's our second best corner. He should be on their second best guy. If not all of the time and darn near most of the time.



I had this game chalked up as a loss all along. I assume we'll rebound. However, I am concerned that we made some guy the highest paid corner in the entire league and we cant scheme the defense so that his primary job is to shut down the other team's best WR. If that truly is the case, its a collosal waste of money. In my opinion.

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Sorry - that was poorly worded. I wasn't referring to posts here - I was referring to what I heard on Sports Talk radio all day Tuesday and today. I don't necessarily agree with the logic that because we paid a ton for Norman, that means he's the #1 or even best CB on this team. We paid what it took to find a bookend to Breeland. Breelands a 3rd year player. If he were a free agent on another team, we'd likely have paid the same kind of price for him. I get what you're saying and am not totally discounting it - but price for a player doesn't always equate to talent. I think part of the decision (beyond what others have hinted at) may also have been Breeland being more familiar with Barry's defensive scheme. Norman literally just got here.

Anyway, where I do agree is that when it became clear that, at least Monday night Breeland would struggle covering the Steeler's best guy, they needed to make an adjustment and they didn't. I am highly skeptical it would've mattered what we threw at Roethlisberger - he was on fire and everything he wanted to do, he was able to do.

 

[Henry]

I think part of the decision (beyond what others have hinted at) may also have been Breeland being more familiar with Barry's defensive scheme. Norman literally just got here.

Boone, that actually makes sense.

I guess I figured when you pay that much for a corner, you do so with the idea that he takes away the other team's best WR. Do teams really spent $75 million for a cog? No, thats the price of a difference-maker. Norman isnt going to make a difference covering Beasley next week.

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[Boone]

Not a cog - he's a perfect bookend to Breeland (whether he's a superior, equal, or slightly less talented player). I think we paid what we paid for Norman because he's damn good...but we paid what it took to snatch him up when he suddenly (and surprisingly) became available, knowing we wouldn't get a 2nd chance at nabbing him.

I do get your point though.

 

[Miles Monroe]

Or better !

But just to feed off all the other stuff stirring in the pot right now, what kind of defense would Wade Phillips field, with the personnel we have right now ?!?!

LOL... Hard to say. I think Wade is a very different type of coach from Williams, but either would easily get a gobs more out of the current group. Wade has the years and resume that's hard to beat, but I think Williams is a touch more aggressive in almost every way. He gives me the impression that the players love to play for him, but fear him. It's a healthy fear. This group needs that. There are very few on this D that don't need a hard assed prick of a taskmaster as their coach IMO, and I think Williams fits that role. I never gotten the impression players feared Wade quite so much.... but I would, having seen some of the fits he's blown over the years.

Wade has it over Williams when it comes to the actual game plan, yet it would be a tough choice if I had to make it.

 

[Fear The Spear]

But no-one fears Joe, is what you're sayin ?

 

[Miles Monroe]

But no-one fears Joe, is what you're sayin ?

Couldn't say to be honest, don't have enough film on him I know one thing for sure, both Phillips and Williams are better at game planning and adjusting during the game. That alone would account for a few more defensive stops per game, and greatly increasing our chances for a win.

 

[McD5]

Miles, I love your takes. I'm not trying to argue.

Don't get me started on Gregg Williams.

They lost 28-0 this weekend. He has 5 first rounders in his front 7. How many do we have?

He was okay here (Sean Taylor) he was trash in Jacksonville, he cost New Orleans draft picks, and he's been a dumpster fire in St. Louis/LA.

I know he's a great guy personally, and I know that Skins fans are fond of him. But professionally?

 

[Om]

Actually, the Skins (after Joe left anyway) didn't like Gregg at all. Too much ego there. It's why he was never seriously considered to succeed Gibbs.

 

[Bulldog]

The trouble is that an inexperienced HC in Gruden went out on his own and hired Barry because he was 'high energy'.

But what he didn't have was any track record of success.

This defense needs a veteran DC who can mold an identity for the unit and force feed some fundamentals.

No way a veteran DC rolls into the season with this DL.

 

[Om]

Well, no one here was excited about the Barry selection last year. The general reaction was wtf. But the truth is, he did a more than credible job last year with a roster that was shaky to begin with even before losing practically his entire secondary to injury and starting guys off the street.

The hope here is that MNF was just a bad night all around, and he'll start to tighten things up starting Sunday. If he doesn't and we end up looking like that most of the year?

Yeah, he's gone. And his replacement won't be another unproven dude.

 

[Bulldog]

It just rankles me that we had picks and cap room to improve the DL and took a pass

 

[Boone]

I generally agree Bulldog - but to me that's a criticism of McCloughan, not Barry. Do we not believe that Barry is aggressively campaigning for more high picks to be spent on defense? I have to believe he has. And how do we think DCs get to be experienced, successful DCs? As Mark said, I didn't even know who the hell this Barry guy was when we brought him on board. Then after I saw his previous record of success, I was even more pissed. But he exceeded my expectations last season. I think it's way too early to say he's not part of a long-term solution and that he can't be a great DC.

And I'll also add that we always assume it's about the Redskins not bringing in a guy. It's quite possible we wooed a number of DCs with proven track records and none of them wanted the Skins job, or weren't willing to accept what we were willing to pay them. I know Elephant will chime in with certainty that Wade Phillips wanted to be here. That may be true, who really knows for sure? But it's also possible we wanted more than to rent an old coach for a handful of seasons.

 

[Neophyte]

Henry, that's exactly the same way that Seattle used Richard Sherman for years. He just shutdown one side of the field. That's not a waste of money.

Last year they began to let him cover more than just one side in Seattle.

News flash McD5...I wouldn't pay Sherman $75 million. He is the product of that system and he won't be great anywhere else. He needs to play exactly like he does in Seattle...namely with a great pass rush and jammed up against the receiver at the LoS. How well did he do last year when Seattle's pass rush fell off?

 

[Fear The Spear]

So these "experts" shouldn't be rating Sherman #1 every year, then

 

[Neophyte]

So these "experts" shouldn't be rating Sherman #1 every year, then

I watched several Seattle games last year, Fear. As the pass rush goes, so goes the Seattle secondary. Those guys are all big and hit people hard but if the QB has time that secondary stops being the best in the league and slides back toward the middle of the pack, Sherman included.

He is a sexy pick by the so called "experts" because he is a Stanford grad who is high profile, talks trash and had some serious success for a couple seasons. He gives great face and great sound bites. He is not a guy like Sanders, Green or Revis who can line up on a top WR and simply erase his existence play after play, regardless of what other 10 guys on the defense are doing.

 

[Shi no Tenshi]

So these "experts" shouldn't be rating Sherman #1 every year, then

Truth.

 

[Om]

There are no "shutdown corners" on teams without a pass rush. What there are, are corners who excel to elite levels when there IS.

And they get top dollar, as the current market dictates.