PFT: Washington may be in the Mariota business

Ax said:
Take a deep breath brother. By the end of this coming season we'll definitively know if Griffin is the guy.
And, if Gruden will finish out his contract.

It's all good.
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Ha ha! Same as it ever was.
 
Bulldog's Twin said:
Gruden may have made some rookie coaching mistakes but he managed to pull a nice contract out of the Redskins so I don't think he is stupid. With the talent here or lack thereof Jay and his brother Jon knew this was not a 1-2 year fix.

Now that the team has a GM there is another voice in the building for sane and reasonable evaluations.

That is evaluations and not infatuations which is what we ended up with when Sanders, Arrington, Portis, Orakpo and Griffin came aboard.
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IMHO, Clinton Portis doesn't belong in that grouping.
 
Ax said:
Take a deep breath brother. By the end of this coming season we'll definitively know if Griffin is the guy.
And, if Gruden will finish out his contract.

It's all good.
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All's good Sir Ax!

It's when I stop to think abt all the incongruities and the evident stupidity or deception that the blood pressure rises a bit! right now...the only one I trust is McL.
 
RG3 won't be on the opening day roster.
We gonna draft Mariota, keep him, and then trade RG3 shortly thereafter.
Then an open competition between Mariota and Cousins for the 2015 opener
 
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You think he'll make it past Tennessee? I'm starting to think we'll take him if there though.

Idk who the titans qb is without googling, lol
 
If we draft Mariotta and keep him I want Bruce and jay fired unless we make the playoffs and mariotta wins rookie of the year. because frankly RG3 has shown his potential and if a coach cant help him be successful he isnt much of a coach and if a GM gives up what Bruce gave up for RG3 and then cant make it work, he doesnt deserve his job
 
Anybody watch Mariota's proday workout on NFLN yesterday? Color me firmly against Mariota as a first round draft pick for any team let alone our thirsty franchise.

He was like watching a 15 year old take out the trash or mowing the lawn. Didn't like his tempo, body language, accuracy, demeanor or any of his physical looks. I was seriously disappointed since I expected to see a lot more "it" instead I saw none at all. Just bleh.

Plenty could be said about being deadpan or emotionless like a Joe Flacco being a positive but to me, he was just too far in that camp.
 
That's consistent with what I heard Golic saying on ESPN this morning--that the performance elicited a "meh" reaction all around.

Not what Mariota was hoping for certainly. And not what I'd hoped to hear either. Not because I want us to draft him (I don't, but was at least allowing for the possibility that McCluvin might see things I don't), but because I wanted his draft value to soar to help fire interest in teams we might find willing trade partners on draft day.
 
Ryman, at some point we need to move on.

I admit I am torn a bit about bringing Griffin back in 2015 or letting him go now and transitioning to Plan B.

Scot and Jay were not here in 2012 when Griffin was drafted and if they both agree we need to move on, I think that's ultimately what we should do.

The Colts gave up a #1 pick for Trent Richardson but realized he was a bust and after 2 years moved on to Frank Gore.

In the Colts case it was even more embarrassing in a way because Grigson was the GM that made the trade and he is still on the job.

Here in 2015 it's a new era with a new front office executive.

I don't want to keep reliving past errors because people are too proud to admit a mistake.
 
I agree the workout wasn’t impressive and didn’t show us anything we hadn’t seen before. People have questioned his accuracy and we saw that. He was never thought to have a great arm, we saw that too. What we couldn’t see were the intangibles that seem to be what separates him from a lot of the other prospects. How much is that worth to an NFL team? I’m not sure.

I can’t speak for the experts and how they judge QBs but I can’t see how he’d fit into most NFL offenses, ours especially. He’s never run a pro-style offense, doesn’t know how to read a progression tree (or at least hasn’t been asked to do so in college)and doesn’t have a great arm. On the plus side he has good size, good attitude, played in a successful college program and can throw on the run. What is it here that we should be in love with at #5?

Winston is obviously a better prospect but it’s not much of a point talking about him. Garrett Grayson from Colorado State has a lot of skills that would work in a pro offense. I also like Sean Mannion from Oregon State. Both of these guys have the size, arm strength and have run a pro-style offense. Both need work too of course or they’d be projected to go higher in the draft.

I think we definitely take a QB in this draft. I highly doubt Mariota is our guy though. This is a smokescreen.
 
Cutting Griffen brings us a 6.1 million dollar cap hit
trading him lowers it to. 3.3 million
 
You won't get much for Griffin in a trade.

Bradford has been consistently injured and that paved his way out of STL.

But he has shown that he can read coverages and deliver the ball from the pocket when on the field.

So, while both players have documented medical histories, they are not otherwise equivalent.
 
Dik Shuttle said:
This is much more than conjecture, apparently. I asked Keim to do a little debunk and he outright declined, citing Clayton's expansive and reliable references. I figured someone who's focus is the team would probably know better.

It seems nuts to me. And if they do pick him, it'll push me that much closer to the edge with this team.
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Here's my thinking on this. IF we actually draft Mariotta, he most likely will not be a starter. This will more greatly impact Cousins than Griffin. Mariotta would probably be on clipboard duty to start off behind Griffin &, if Griffin goes down in season like he has been known to do so far, we have a back-up who can seamlessly take over for him without having to change the offense much to accommodate his talent. After this coming season, we'll know where Griffin is, whether he fits our team concept anymore or not.

Which leads to another reason behind drafting him. Pressure on Griffin to perform at his highest level. He'll know that he doesn't just have a back-up behind him waiting in the wings. He's got a Heisman winner standing there waiting for his opportunity at any given moment & most likely capable of taking the job & running away with it.

I'm not sure what all this means. Whether the rumors are truth or fairy tale. Or whether they are simply trying to gain value on that Draft pick. But, I don't think drafting Mariotta would necessarily be a bad thing. It may not be what we think should happen, but SM is a smart guy & has proven that. So, I'm gonna trust that he knows what he's doing & that Snyder & Allen are going simply sit back & let him work.
 
Om said:
That's consistent with what I heard Golic saying on ESPN this morning--that the performance elicited a "meh" reaction all around.

Not what Mariota was hoping for certainly. And not what I'd hoped to hear either. Not because I want us to draft him (I don't, but was at least allowing for the possibility that McCluvin might see things I don't), but because I wanted his draft value to soar to help fire interest in teams we might find willing trade partners on draft day.
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Exactly. I wasn't hoping to draft him, I was just hoping and unfortunately with all the hype- expecting him to look great for the trade back scenario. I think that's off the table after this workout. Still a chance someone will reach for him, but what are the chances they reach our way? I don't see the Jets taking him either after this last effort, they already have a failed 1st rounder like us. Why can't anything just go our way?! :dot:
 
We've already got a black Robert Griffin.

Do we need a white one too?
 
He didn't have a terrible pro day, he had a so-so pro day. Anyone thinking of drafting him top 10 is likely still thinking of drafting him top 10. NFL scouts aren't putting the weight on a single pro day performance that fans and mediots do :)
 
I found an interesting article on various notable NFL QBs and comments-both good and bad-about their Pro-Day performances.

NFL Pro Days; Do They Matter?

By: Nolan Vasan

"Very average at best" - Mike Mayock. "Big disappointment in Bridgewater workout" - Tony Pauline. Teddy Bridgewater Pro Day"Overall control of the ball was troublesome" - Albert Breer. " He struggled with accuracy, he struggled with velocity on the deep throw and the sideline throws" - Ron Jaworski

Must have been a bad game for Teddy! However, those comments were not relayed after a poor performance in a game by Louisville QB Teddy Bridgewater, but instead after his pro day which was held on a Monday morning in March, in gym short, in a practice facility. It would seem pretty hard to disappoint under those circumstances and like Mike Mayock said "Most quarterbacks have good pro days", but should we be jumping off the Teddy Bridgewater band wagon? What does this mean for his draft stock? What do NFL pro days actually matter?

We've taken some quotes from high profile quarterbacks concerning their pro days, good and bad to see what the media said and if there's anything we can learn from history.


The Bad Pro Days!

It is true that most quarterbacks do have good pro days and it was actually pretty hard to dig and find reports on quarterbacks who reportedly struggled in these glorified games of catch. However, here are a few high profile guys who didn't 'wow' anybody, but still managed to achieve success

Nick Foles; "Foles was terrible. He couldn't throw a spiral. Obviously, the weather conditions played a part in that but in reality, it only accentuated that he couldn't throw a spiral." "Nick Foles fails to impress at Arizona pro day". "He was average .... he didn't drive the ball like you'd expect a quarterback of his size to and he has only average accuracy once you get past 15 yards, so I can't imagine that anyone is raising his grade based on what they saw Monday"

Pretty harsh words for Foles after his Arizona pro day to say the least. However, I didn't think Foles' spiral looked that bad this year when he threw 27 TDs and 2 INTs.

Cam Newton; Results were "mixed" after Cam Newton completed only 50 out of 60 attempted passes at his pro day. It was noted as being "solid but not spectacular". "There wasn't anything from the pro day that really stood out from Newton"

If you take it back to Newton's performance at the NFL Combine where he reportedly struggled in throwing drills, it gets even more interesting. Newton completed only 11 out of 21 and "struggled with his accuracy in the throwing drills, frequently overthrowing receivers" CBS' Rob Rang gave it a "D" grade.

Cam Newton Pro DayI was not a Cam Newton supporter going into the 2012 NFL Draft, but it had less than nothing to do with his pro day or his performance at the NFL Combine. Cam Newton has had two out of three really good NFL seasons, and it's safe to say that his poor performances pre-draft did not hurt his draft stock either.

Drew Brees; These quotes were from Drew Brees' performance throwing at the NFL Scouting Combine

"Of Brees’s 20 balls, 11 were solid throws and nine were poor. He one-hopped a simple out-cut and overthrew another. His long throws — the post-corner and the streak — were wobbly, setting off alarms throughout the league."

From Mel Kiper "Purdue's Drew Brees, may have lost some ground. While he was solid in the shorter areas, he struggled some throwing the ball down the field"

Drew Brees has always been an exception to the 'rule', but obviously we can see that his struggles throwing the football in practice meant absolutely nothing when it came to translating to NFL success.


The Good Pro Days!

Jamarcus Russell; From ESPN's Todd McShay “I can’t remember being in such awe of a quarterback in my decade of attending combines and pro days. Russell’s passing session was the most impressive of all the pro days I’ve been to."

Jon Gruden "The workout Russell had was Star Wars. It was unbelievable"

Lane Kiffin "We were very impressed. He had a great day. He seems very first class, very easy to get along with. No doubt he was a great leader here. That's why everybody wants him now"Jamarcus Russell Pro Day

Mike Mayock "The best pro day I ever saw was Jamarcus Russell" (Mayock quantified that statement and was never a big Russell supporter. This was just a comment on the pro day itself.)

This is the gold standard for pro days, and yet Jamarcus Russell may be the biggest bust of a number one pick of all time!

Blaine Gabbert; Blaine Gabbert turns heads at Pro Day. Mike Mayock said "The kid confirmed everything you want to see in a franchise quarterback. I thought he did as good as he could have. His footwork was real clean. His arm was real accurate, and his arm strength was great."

One AFC Scout "I didn't see anything I didn't like"

"Blaine Gabbert definitely gave the Panthers something to think about with the number one pick"

Sam Bradford; After completing 49 out of 50 passes long time NFL scout said "Best workout I've seen since Troy Aikman"

"The guy was fantastic. The guy threw every route. He did not throw one bad pass"

Mike Holmgren "I don’t think he made a mistake." Pete Carroll - "He hit every ball. He was dead on. He looked great."

Brandon Weeden; Mike Mayock - "He made every throw you can make .... The ones I wanted to see were outside the numbers. I know he can drive it inside the numbers, I know he can throw the seam, the deep in cuts — he showed me that in the game. What I saw today was the ability to drive it outside the numbers. . . . He showed every throw, he made every throw, and it was really impressive."

Geno Smith; Geno Smith impresses at pro day after completing 60 out of 64 passes at pro day with two drops.

Eagles Senior Advisor Tom Donahue "Geno was outstanding. He's got great velocity on the ball. He's very accurate and he can make all the throws"

"Once considered a late first rounder, Smith's stock rose perhaps as high as into the top five in what could be his tipping-point pro day." - USA Today

Chris Weinke ""If you walk away from this and don't think he's a top pick, I don't know what else Geno can do"Jake Locker Pro dAY

Jake Locker; "Locker nearly flawless at UW Pro Day"

ESPN's Brock Huard "Locker aced the test .... as good as I've ever seen him throw"

After completing 38 out of 40 passes at Huskies Pro Day "Jake Locker has shown significant improvement in terms of his footwork, in terms of his accuracy, the whole package"

Colin Kaepernick; Pro Football Talk "Kaepernick hit 36 of his 38 throws on campus, not including a couple of drops."

Walter Football "Colin Kaepernick had a superb Pro Day, completing 36-of-38 passes in front of the Panthers and Jaguars."


What Do We Learn?

Nothing! There is absolutely zero correlation between what these quarterbacks have done at their pro days and how they've done in the NFL. We've seen Cam Newton, Drew Brees and Nick Foles disappoint in their workouts but look stellar with the lights on. For the guys who 'blew us away', you have guys like Jamarcus Russell that have completely bombed and then guys like Andrew Luck, RG3 and Colin Kaepernick who have done well at both.

The end of the matter is; don't read much into these pro days. More often than not, the quarterback you see on film when the bullets are flying in real games is the one you'll see on the NFL gridiron.
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Article link: NFL Draft Pro Days; Do They Matter?


Basically, like Boone said, it's not very likely that a go/no go decision on a QB hinges all that much on a Pro-Day performance-at least it probably shouldn't.
 
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