Random Commanders Thoughts

I saw that interview. Rak was getting himself worked up about it too. I also heard Polumalu on Cowherd today and he said he's never been hazed and would never put up with that either. I have to admit I'm shocked to hear so many players say hazing and whatnot is so uncommon. I just assumed it went on in every locker room and that this Incognito guy just crossed some line or something.

there's like a weird divide when it comes to the hazing thing.

remember when lavar arrington hit taylor in the face with a lime shaving cream pie? that pissed off the whole U crowd in the locker room and they were planning on jumping him in the parking lot for it.

there are people coming out defending incognito - or writing it off as him just trying to toughen up a rookie.
 
oh yeah...players, students, people. its kind of odd but there is a certain part of me that thinks they make a point.

Blame the victim? Some players criticize Jonathan Martin

Well all of those guys are raised in the culture. They've lived in football locker rooms their whole life. To them it should have never left the locker room - dealt with internally.

It just breeds this 'toughness' mentality. It's why there's such strong negative feelings towards gay players, or why the concussion is looked at the way it is by many (including ex players). It's all about 'manning up' and other stuff.

If he was mad they made him shave his head, or carry some pads, or whatever I'd see their point.

But this is a whole different level of hazing. At least that's my opinion. I'm biased because I always thought Incognito was a douche bag.

I mean, this is the same league where players are openly complaining about mental issues leading to suicide or ruining their ability to have personal relationships or continue a meaningful life after football...
 
To me, its ridiculous that they're even calling it "bullying." Did Incognito cross a line with the racist stuff? Sure. But its not "bullying." Come on, these are grown ass men!
 
You know what I think is ridiculous? People saying that it's not bullying because they're adults. It doesn't matter if you're 8 or 80. Incognito preyed on the fact that martin was soft and emotional. I've heard of people killing themselves for less. You need to remember, it's not like it was a one time thing. Everyone says this went on for months, and Incognito never let up on him for 5 minutes. It's absolutely bullying. There was constant harassing, tormenting, mocking, humiliating, insulting, etc. What else would you call it?

I have a feeling if you had kids you'd have a different outlook on the matter.
 
You know what I think is ridiculous? People saying that it's not bullying because they're adults. It doesn't matter if you're 8 or 80. Incognito preyed on the fact that martin was soft and emotional. I've heard of people killing themselves for less. You need to remember, it's not like it was a one time thing. Everyone says this went on for months, and Incognito never let up on him for 5 minutes. It's absolutely bullying. There was constant harassing, tormenting, mocking, humiliating, insulting, etc. What else would you call it?

I have a feeling if you had kids you'd have a different outlook on the matter.

I think I worded my post poorly - I'm not saying its not bullying; but using the term implies Martin is some helpless victim. He's not. He's a G-D NFL player, for crying out loud!
 
To me, its ridiculous that they're even calling it "bullying." Did Incognito cross a line with the racist stuff? Sure. But its not "bullying." Come on, these are grown ass men!

How anyone can minimize this kind of unjustifiable shot after we find out Aaron Hernandez spent his spare time killing people is beyond me? I heard Mike Golic making these kinds of comments this morning, and you're both wrong. The guy was leaving crazy messages on his voicemail and sending threatening texts. In this day and age how disturbed or concerned about these kinds of statements you are is not a measure of your 'toughness' and what a great message we send to kids by implying it is. We don't know the victims history here either...maybe he had a childhood history of being abused or bullied...we don't know. It's astounding to me that some can make him the problem in this scenario.
 
So what was said in this telephone message?

Getting a bill for $15k I'd have to tell ole dude to eat a dick.
 
I remember when I was in college and I pledged at fraternity. We've all seen Animal House. We know there's hazing. I remember when I pledged I told the guys "I'll join your fraternity but I'm not putting up with any crap" and they all nodded and whatever. Well, I remember the first time we got called over to the Senior Hall and they started in on us pledges. After about a half an hour of that I walked out, went right to the room of the president and shoved my pin in his chest. I told him I don't take that crap and if that's the way it is they can find someone else to pledge their stupid fraternity. Turns out I did end up becoming a brother, but nobody ever tried to haze me again and nobody hazed anyone else in my presence.

Being willing to walk does not make one a coward. It doesn't make one less of a man.

Saying 'screw you, your money and your team if you can't control this crap' is standing up for one's self. I have no problem with what Martin did. The man had had enough. I'd have walked too.
 
How anyone can minimize this kind of unjustifiable shot after we find out Aaron Hernandez spent his spare time killing people is beyond me? I heard Mike Golic making these kinds of comments this morning, and you're both wrong. The guy was leaving crazy messages on his voicemail and sending threatening texts. In this day and age how disturbed or concerned about these kinds of statements you are is not a measure of your 'toughness' and what a great message we send to kids by implying it is. We don't know the victims history here either...maybe he had a childhood history of being abused or bullied...we don't know. It's astounding to me that some can make him the problem in this scenario.

Huh? I am missing the connection between Hernandez killing people and Incognito leaving nasty messages. And don't get me wrong, I think Incognito should be punished; I am just not in favor of calling Martin, a grown man, a helpless victim. Because he's, you know, not one. And I never implied it had anything to do with his "toughness;" I am the biggest advocate of turning the other cheek that you will find. I simply understand that as adults, we have lots of options to diffuse a situation like this that maybe kids in grade school don't have available to them.
 
I remember when I was in college and I pledged at fraternity. We've all seen Animal House. We know there's hazing. I remember when I pledged I told the guys "I'll join your fraternity but I'm not putting up with any crap" and they all nodded and whatever. Well, I remember the first time we got called over to the Senior Hall and they started in on us pledges. After about a half an hour of that I walked out, went right to the room of the president and shoved my pin in his chest. I told him I don't take that crap and if that's the way it is they can find someone else to pledge their stupid fraternity. Turns out I did end up becoming a brother, but nobody ever tried to haze me again and nobody hazed anyone else in my presence.

Being willing to walk does not make one a coward. It doesn't make one less of a man.

Saying 'screw you, your money and your team if you can't control this crap' is standing up for one's self. I have no problem with what Martin did. The man had had enough. I'd have walked too.

Can't agree with this post more. Well said!
 
Were those D. Hall's kids, or he did he just grab some random children and bring them onto the field?
 
Huh? I am missing the connection between Hernandez killing people and Incognito leaving nasty messages. And don't get me wrong, I think Incognito should be punished; I am just not in favor of calling Martin, a grown man, a helpless victim. Because he's, you know, not one. And I never implied it had anything to do with his "toughness;" I am the biggest advocate of turning the other cheek that you will find. I simply understand that as adults, we have lots of options to diffuse a situation like this that maybe kids in grade school don't have available to them.

He's telling him in harassing messages that he's going to 'kill him' and you don't see the connection? The point is you can't take threats as 'just words' any more. Whether or not he's helpless' is irrelevant. A kid is not technically helpless. How does the manner in which the victim here responds have any relevance whatsoever? Why do you bring it up? I'd love to see what you would do in this scenario ...he did exactly what we'd expect a non-primitive to do ...he's under no obligation to confront or physically respond to someone harassing him in a crazy way. Talking about the victim of this kind of BS is just misguided and counter- productive in my opinion.
 
There's obviously a disconnect here, because I don't know what you're talking about. I said I think Incognito should be punished, but I don't think Martin is some helpless victim (as he demonstrated).
 
Alright I'm going to ask the question we're all thinking about but are hesitant to ask.

Is Martin better than Leribus and if so 'should we'?
 
There's obviously a disconnect here, because I don't know what you're talking about. I said I think Incognito should be punished, but I don't think Martin is some helpless victim (as he demonstrated).
Why can't he be a helpless victim? is it because he's big? Big doesn't make somebody tough, it doesn't make them able to stand up for themselves, it doesn't make them violent, and it doesn't make them able to stand up to someone violent and aggressive like Incognito.
 
Why can't he be a helpless victim? is it because he's big? Big doesn't make somebody tough, it doesn't make them able to stand up for themselves, it doesn't make them violent, and it doesn't make them able to stand up to someone violent and aggressive like Incognito.

Because he's an adult with options. He can leave the team. He can change his phone number. He can do any number of things to remove himself from the situation (as he did), or remove Incognito from the situation. Children can't just leave school - they have to be there. Martin had options.
 
The Dolphins don't have any leaders and that starts with Philbin, a first-time head coach who doesn't seem to know what his players are doing or which ones to trust.

Incognito as a leader on the player council?

Give me a break . This guy was booted out of St. Louis for getting into a standoff with his COACHES.

Jeff Ireland the GM brought in a bad character guy and deserves some of the blame too.
 
Because he's an adult with options. He can leave the team.
He did leave the team. And people are mocking him for it.

He can change his phone number.
So he should have to change things in his life over a teammate being a dick? He did nothing wrong, so the problem should be dealt with.

He can do any number of things to remove himself from the situation (as he did), or remove Incognito from the situation. Children can't just leave school - they have to be there. Martin had options.
Most videos on the internet of kids being bullied or beat up are not filmed in school, it's outside.

I don't know if you plan on having kids or not, but you'll understand what I'm about to tell you if you ever decide to. Bullies are the most vile lowlife human beings on the planet. There is nothing worse than having your son, daughter, niece or nephew crying and being treated for depression and going to therapy because they are relentlessly bullied and nobody will do anything about it. It's a horrible feeling to feel so helpless and terrified that it could go too far one day. And trust me, there is nothing at all that can be done about a bully until the bully is removed from the situation. School preach all day about how anti-bullying they are, but they don't care one iota, it's all done for image. Unless the schools in this area are just ****.

My daughter is 12 years old. She has Asperger's, and she goes out of her way to be friends with everybody, and she judges nothing. She is a truly special kid, and loves everybody with no judgement or opinions. It might sound ridiculous to some people, but I wish I could be more like she is with people. The problem that arose, was since she is such a great people person, she even goes out of her way with Down's kids, amputees, and kids in wheelchairs at her school to be their friend. In her words, she said everyone deserves a friend, because everyone deserves to smile. But kids being the jerks they tend to be, she gets teased for it. People pick on her for being (in their words) friends with retards and cripples. At first, it was just teasing like that. Over the years, it progressed to people making fun of her clothes, her hair, etc. just because their venom over her choice in friends wasn't working. While the teasing about being friends with everyone didn't seem to bother her, the teasing over her looks, clothes, etc. really destroys her inside. I'm not being biased by saying she is a beautiful girl, I hear it all the time, and that's part of where the problem lies. Girls like to bully girls who are pretty and have a good sense of fashion. Nothing in life will ever change that, they've been that way for ages. But as thick skinned as she is, it gets to you eventually. The teasing eventually turned into threats, and evolved into girls throwing food at her, pulling her hair, etc. After trying in vain to get the school with the anti bullying zone signs everywhere to intervene with no success, we couldn't take it anymore. We found out where these kids lived, and I went around and confronted these parents face to face and let them know how it would be dealt with if they didn't control their kid. Most of it stopped, but some parents just don't care, they're as bad as their kids. What can you do? I can't just go kicking in doors and knocking people out because their kid is an asshole. But I'll tell you what, I'm on the verge of losing my **** over this asshole down the street. She's in therapy once a month and taking antidepressants, but she still has really bad days.

My sister is dealing with the same thing with her 13 year old daughter. The girl is gorgeous, wins everything, she's popular as hell, etc. As a result, she's relentlessly bullied. My sister lives in Chesapeake, so it isn't confined to one school system. She has been to the school numerous times to raise hell, confronted parents, etc. Nothing works. the schools do absolutely nothing about it. My sister dealt with this as best she could until her daughter tried to OD on pills to end the pain. My sister is now suing the school for doing nothing for the past 2 years while my sister has brought it to their attention dozens of times. The school never once contacted the parents of those involved, never suspended anyone, no detention, nothing. They instead called the kids into the office and told them to stop. Never anything more, by the admittance of staff.

My friend in NC has an 11 year old daughter who just went to a funeral a few weeks ago for her best friend that killed himself at 10 ****ing years old, because he liked to dance and sing, so kids relentlessly teased him and called him a fag until he couldn't take it anymore. That should never be something any parent or child ever has to deal with. Bullies are worthless, and they should be dealt with as harshly as possible until they get it through their thick skulls. And age and size should never matter.
 

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