Wentz-O-Meter: Week 2, 2022

[Theismann To HOF]

I like both good Heinicke and good Wentz.

Thing about Wentz, he gives you the potential to score in bunches. And with our D that apparently is going to be essential.

He also has the potential to throw INTs in bunches, which is worse. Wentz led the league in turnovers in 2020 with the Eagles. I have a feeling that will be the Wentz that we see for the rest of this season.

Wentz should have had 3 INTs on Sunday. Two INTs were dropped by Lions defenders, especially that long trick play pass in the first half. That pass ended up in a different zip code from the Washington WR.

 

[Theismann To HOF]

6 for me. Overall, Wentz played better this game than last game. It just doesn't seem like it, because the Lions pass rush was so much better than the Jaguars pass rush. Wentz is not a quick enough decision maker to handle a strong pass rush, and that's going to become painfully more obvious as the season goes on.

He didn't almost lose the game for his team with two disastrous INTs in the 4th quarter, like he did against the Jaguars. He was also more accurate on his longer throws against the Lions, except for the INT and the long throw on that trick play.

Still, he should have had 3 INTs on Sunday. Two INTs were dropped by the Lions defenders. I don't think he's going to last much longer.

 

[Boone]

Lol. Well I’m not shocked you’d take that stance

 

[Boone]

He also has the potential to throw INTs in bunches, which is worse. Wentz led the league in turnovers in 2020 with the Eagles. I have a feeling that will be the Wentz that we see for the rest of this season.

Wentz should have had 3 INTs on Sunday. Two INTs were dropped by Lions defenders, especially that long trick play pass in the first half. That pass ended up in a different zip code from the Washington WR.

Wentz has one of the lowest career INT rates of any current NFL starters. But way to cherry pick his worst season. All QBs have ‘that should have been picked’ throws. Every QB, every game. I get it You love Heinicke. So do the rest of us. But you’re really making some exaggerated claims regarding both guys.

 

[Primus Porcus]

Here's another one in the failed call design imho. 1st drive of the 2nd quarter. At this point Wentz has already been dealin with a ton of pressure. This is A LOOOONG developing play. The first picture is the time of the snap (also, see Hutchison is already over the LOS). In the second picture, Wentz has hit his drop and NONE of the routes are even close to being 'ready.' This play DESIGNED him to stand back there an extra second after he finished his drop. You'll see Hutchison now has outside leverage on Cosmi with a direct path to Wentz with nowhere to throw the ball. The third picture, you see Cosmi is able to 'deflect' Hutchisen and somewhat carry him to the outside. Wentz has stepped up, the problem is there are two recievers in the same area at the top, and the WR at the bottom (I BELIEVE it's Terry) has now broken free... problem is the pocket is collapsing as you see in the fourth picture. He tries to escape toward the top of the screen and Hutchison gets him from behind. For a split second it looks like he could have gone forward and broken open but i think the DT coming back down would have stopped him. I don't know how Wentz makes a 'better' play out of this call.. MAYBE throw it away? Hard to ask him to do that when the WR haven't even executed their routes.

 

[Primus Porcus]

Here is the play that completely boggled my mind.... John bates is isolated 1 on 1 with Hutchinson. Not sure what they expected to happen. Bates actually does an amazing job of doing whatever he can to carry Hutchinson outside enough for Wentz to step up and evade. You can see where Wentz gets to the top of his drop and again... the routes are still progressing.

Again... 3 receivers in the same area, bringing multiple defenders into that area. Dotson breaks free and appears to be open but at that point the swarm is already there. Carson attempts to get outside but is immediately caught from behind, he tries to throw it away but it results in a grounding penalty.

 

[Theismann To HOF]

Wentz has one of the lowest career INT rates of any current NFL starters. But way to cherry pick his worst season. All QBs have ‘that should have been picked’ throws. Every QB, every game. I get it You love Heinicke. So do the rest of us. But you’re really making some exaggerated claims regarding both guys.

If you say so. That long throw on the trick play looked like a popup in centerfield. Thank goodness most defensive backs have sorry hands.

You do realize that the Lions were playing mostly a prevent defense in the second half? That's the main reason that Wentz had a better second half. Next week against the Eagles might be even uglier than Wentz's first half against the Lions.

 

[Kel Varnsen]

Here's another one in the failed call design imho. 1st drive of the 2nd quarter. At this point Wentz has already been dealin with a ton of pressure. This is A LOOOONG developing play. The first picture is the time of the snap (also, see Hutchison is already over the LOS). In the second picture, Wentz has hit his drop and NONE of the routes are even close to being 'ready.' This play DESIGNED him to stand back there an extra second after he finished his drop. You'll see Hutchison now has outside leverage on Cosmi with a direct path to Wentz with nowhere to throw the ball. The third picture, you see Cosmi is able to 'deflect' Hutchisen and somewhat carry him to the outside. Wentz has stepped up, the problem is there are two recievers in the same area at the top, and the WR at the bottom (I BELIEVE it's Terry) has now broken free... problem is the pocket is collapsing as you see in the fourth picture. He tries to escape toward the top of the screen and Hutchison gets him from behind. For a split second it looks like he could have gone forward and broken open but i think the DT coming back down would have stopped him. I don't know how Wentz makes a 'better' play out of this call.. MAYBE throw it away? Hard to ask him to do that when the WR haven't even executed their routes.


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I'm not a football genius, and I'll assume it's an option route by the RB. But shouldn't he have broken to the right? You can see from the last picture, the DB on the far side broke off to cover the RB as well as the LB chasing him. If the RB goes right, either he or one of the WR will be open. The CB has to either come up or go deep with the WR. There is much less traffic on the near side letting the WR beat the CB. I'm pretty sure he's expecting help over the top, but that leaves the RB much more open than going left. Maybe the CB on the near side does the same thing, but it looks like he's trying to keep up with the WR. I know these were long developing routes with a collapsing pocket, but a potentially wrong read by the RB or a bad play design made this play even more difficult.

 

[Theismann To HOF]

Here is the play that completely boggled my mind.... John bates is isolated 1 on 1 with Hutchinson. Not sure what they expected to happen. Bates actually does an amazing job of doing whatever he can to carry Hutchinson outside enough for Wentz to step up and evade. You can see where Wentz gets to the top of his drop and again... the routes are still progressing.

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Again... 3 receivers in the same area, bringing multiple defenders into that area. Dotson breaks free and appears to be open but at that point the swarm is already there. Carson attempts to get outside but is immediately caught from behind, he tries to throw it away but it results in a grounding penalty.

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What Wentz could have done is looped the pass toward the right sideline and allowed Dotson to try to run under it. That would be a pretty safe throw, with no defenders near by. Those are the type of improvised passes QBs need to make sometimes when they are under pressure.

Plus, the Lions are playing man-to-man on the pass routes. They are not watching Wentz, which makes a looped, high arching throw toward the right sideline less risky.

 

[Theismann To HOF]

Here's another one in the failed call design imho. 1st drive of the 2nd quarter. At this point Wentz has already been dealin with a ton of pressure. This is A LOOOONG developing play. The first picture is the time of the snap (also, see Hutchison is already over the LOS). In the second picture, Wentz has hit his drop and NONE of the routes are even close to being 'ready.' This play DESIGNED him to stand back there an extra second after he finished his drop. You'll see Hutchison now has outside leverage on Cosmi with a direct path to Wentz with nowhere to throw the ball. The third picture, you see Cosmi is able to 'deflect' Hutchisen and somewhat carry him to the outside. Wentz has stepped up, the problem is there are two recievers in the same area at the top, and the WR at the bottom (I BELIEVE it's Terry) has now broken free... problem is the pocket is collapsing as you see in the fourth picture. He tries to escape toward the top of the screen and Hutchison gets him from behind. For a split second it looks like he could have gone forward and broken open but i think the DT coming back down would have stopped him. I don't know how Wentz makes a 'better' play out of this call.. MAYBE throw it away? Hard to ask him to do that when the WR haven't even executed their routes.


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I don't buy this, either. Wentz could throw a high arching ball toward the left sideline at the top of the picture and allow his WR to run under it. He doesn't need to wait an extra second like you're saying. It's better than taking a sack.

 

[SirClintonPortis]

Here's another one in the failed call design imho. 1st drive of the 2nd quarter. At this point Wentz has already been dealin with a ton of pressure. This is A LOOOONG developing play. The first picture is the time of the snap (also, see Hutchison is already over the LOS). In the second picture, Wentz has hit his drop and NONE of the routes are even close to being 'ready.' This play DESIGNED him to stand back there an extra second after he finished his drop. You'll see Hutchison now has outside leverage on Cosmi with a direct path to Wentz with nowhere to throw the ball. The third picture, you see Cosmi is able to 'deflect' Hutchisen and somewhat carry him to the outside. Wentz has stepped up, the problem is there are two recievers in the same area at the top, and the WR at the bottom (I BELIEVE it's Terry) has now broken free... problem is the pocket is collapsing as you see in the fourth picture. He tries to escape toward the top of the screen and Hutchison gets him from behind. For a split second it looks like he could have gone forward and broken open but i think the DT coming back down would have stopped him. I don't know how Wentz makes a 'better' play out of this call.. MAYBE throw it away? Hard to ask him to do that when the WR haven't even executed their routes.


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Well, it could be possible that the play is catered to Wentz's uncoachable habits of not taking a checkdown and always delaying to hit the big strike. If he isn't going to checkdown anyway, then you might as well send another deep one to strain the secondary.

 

[Primus Porcus]

What Wentz could have done is looped the pass toward the right sideline and allowed Dotson to try to run under it. That would be a pretty safe throw, with no defenders near by. Those are the type of improvised passes QBs need to make sometimes when they are under pressure.

Plus, the Lions are playing man-to-man on the pass routes. They are not watching Wentz, which makes a looped, high arching throw toward the right sideline less risky.

There is a safety over the top... a loopy pass is quite possibly defended or intercepted... it wouldn't have been that safe...

 

[Primus Porcus]

Well, it could be possible that the play is catered to Wentz's uncoachable habits of not taking a checkdown and always delaying to hit the big strike. If he isn't going to checkdown anyway, then you might as well send another deep one to strain the secondary.

Even if a coach was stupid enough to say 'well he's not gonna check it down so change the playbook to remove them,' the plays where all WRs aren't even making their breaks til 1 to 2 seconds after Wentz is at the top of his drop is bad. Under the pressure we felt... call slants, digs, drags, outs.. routes that CAN get the ball out quick.


Wentz also has no problem checking down. Critics so far this year have had no problem pointing out how the majority of his completions against Jax were around the line of scrimmage.

 

[Boone]

If you say so. That long throw on the trick play looked like a popup in centerfield. Thank goodness most defensive backs have sorry hands.

You do realize that the Lions were playing mostly a prevent defense in the second half? That's the main reason that Wentz had a better second half. Next week against the Eagles might be even uglier than Wentz's first half against the Lions.

I think in all NFL comebacks there is an element of that. Teams relax, DCs get more conservative, OCs get bolder. If Wentz hadn’t lead a big comeback you’d be beating on him for that, lol.

The Eagles have had a good start but the NFL is also a week to week league. I wouldn’t be surprised if we get thumped but neither would I be shocked if we win. We traditionally struggle with mobile QBs so containing Hurts will probably be job one.

Carson Wentz is the least of our problems right now. I think most of us believe that.

 

[Primus Porcus]

I'm not a football genius, and I'll assume it's an option route by the RB. But shouldn't he have broken to the right? You can see from the last picture, the DB on the far side broke off to cover the RB as well as the LB chasing him. If the RB goes right, either he or one of the WR will be open. The CB has to either come up or go deep with the WR. There is much less traffic on the near side letting the WR beat the CB. I'm pretty sure he's expecting help over the top, but that leaves the RB much more open than going left. Maybe the CB on the near side does the same thing, but it looks like he's trying to keep up with the WR. I know these were long developing routes with a collapsing pocket, but a potentially wrong read by the RB or a bad play design made this play even more difficult.

I think you're talking about the one where Wentz tries to escape to his left and Hutchinsen got him.

IMHO it didn't matter because there was an LB in Gibbys pocket.

 

[Lovin Cousins]

I don't think he's going to last much longer.

I just hope the coaches perform an extraction on him, before his play count results in losing an extra 3rd Round Pick

 

[Neophyte]

Wentz has one of the lowest career INT rates of any current NFL starters. But way to cherry pick his worst season. All QBs have ‘that should have been picked’ throws. Every QB, every game. I get it You love Heinicke. So do the rest of us. But you’re really making some exaggerated claims regarding both guys.

First, I came here to say this.

Second, just to emphasize the point about all QB's having balls that should have been picked in every game, St Juste dropped what absolutely should have been a pick of Goff in the first half on what ended up being a scoring drive for the Lions. If he had hung on, we would have had great field position with a chance to put points on the board.

Third, if you really believe Wentz leaves the lineup for anything short of an injury, you really need to share whatever it is you're smoking because it's rude not to.

 

[Neophyte]

I don't buy this, either. Wentz could throw a high arching ball toward the left sideline at the top of the picture and allow his WR to run under it. He doesn't need to wait an extra second like you're saying. It's better than taking a sack.

Take another look at those pictures. There is a S sitting on the hash at the 40 waiting on that.

 

[Theismann To HOF]

There is a safety over the top... a loopy pass is quite possibly defended or intercepted... it wouldn't have been that safe...

That's a lot of ground for the safety to cover. Not impossible, but unlikely.

If Wentz throws a good enough pass, Dotson has a better chance of fighting for the ball than the safety. Sometimes you have to give your best athletes like Dotson and opportunity to battle and make a play.

If the safety was a great playmaker and ball catcher, then he would be on offense, not defense.

 

[Theismann To HOF]

First, I came here to say this.

Second, just to emphasize the point about all QB's having balls that should have been picked in every game, St Juste dropped what absolutely should have been a pick of Goff in the first half on what ended up being a scoring drive for the Lions. If he had hung on, we would have had great field position with a chance to put points on the board.

Third, if you really believe Wentz leaves the lineup for anything short of an injury, you really need to share whatever it is you're smoking because it's rude not to.

The St. Juste drop was on a hard thrown pass by Goff. That would have been a great, difficult catch by St. Juste.

On the other hand, that deep duck of a pass on the trick play that Wentz popped up in centerfield should have been a gimme INT for the Lions. The dude just flat out dropped it.