The true Silver Lining of what we are seeing

[Boone]

Rivera will never jettison his coordinators because the owner tells him to do it - and it’s probably in his contract that coordinators are his decision to make.

If we win 3 games or less I could see them making a run at Sean Payton or Mike Tomlin if he gets let go. Not that either guy could be lured to this train wreck.

 

[Rymanofthenorth]

I don't buy Snyder wants this team to be mediocre for years yet and I don't buy it for a number of reasons.

1. Snyder is greedy and winning teams make more money. Not by a little bit either.
2. Somewhere in that Napoleonic, Ted Cruz bearded body is still the kid who wore a Redskins belt buckle to school every day and that kid hurts with every loss. No matter what kind of face the adult Snyder puts on it.
3. Snyder sees himself as a winner and 20-plus years of losing is eating him (and his pride) alive.
4. He has never given 2 shits about what others - like Riggo or the local media that crucifies him regularly - think.

This team isn't losing as sort of a long-term strategy on Snyder's part. It is losing because he is the core of the organization and the core is rotten.

I was always willing to give dan the benefit of the doubt because when push came to shove he was willing to spend money. but he never understood that he needed to spend money on the front office not just shiny free agents, that he needs to spend money on facilities to make free agents want to come here and spend money on coaches and scouts because thats how you build a team.

This team will never be good as long as you have someone making the decisions that doesn't know what they are doing. we need a good GM who can massage his ego and make him think that the good ideas are his while avoiding the bad ones. thats not gonna happen and this team will be garbage as long as dan is the man.

and yes he has ego and you would think that would push him to do whatever it takes to win but his form of ego is poison, he really does think his business smarts translate into football smarts.

honestly now that I am so much less invested in this team, it doesn't bother me so much I was mildly annoyed that we lost to the cowpies, in former days I would be crabby for days lol

HTTR I am not saying anything else because commanders is lame.

 

[Riggotoni]

For me the silver lining is on those rare occasions when the Commie game flashed on RedZone, it was unrecognizable. Who was that XFL minor league Steelers team on the field? And who knew how prescient Zorn was when he called our team colors red, yellow and black?
When Rivera gets fired after year 4 Mayhew will remain as GM and hire some unproven offensive coordinator or QB coach to take his place. It's what Snyder does.

 

[Henry]

When Rivera gets fired after year 4 Mayhew will remain as GM and hire some unproven offensive coordinator or QB coach to take his place. It's what Snyder does.

Yeah. He does like to alternate between established proven coaches and young new hotshots. That way he can say "It's DIFFERENT this time."

 

[SirClintonPortis]

It's either the first and only big payday or the very last payday when it comes to head coaches that land in Washington.

Zorn was not intentional. It was supposed be Fassel but ES revolted and that somehow influenced Snyder....

 

[SkinsNumberOne]

For me the silver lining is on those rare occasions when the Commie game flashed on RedZone, it was unrecognizable. Who was that XFL minor league Steelers team on the field? And who knew how prescient Zorn was when he called our team colors red, yellow and black?
When Rivera gets fired after year 4 Mayhew will remain as GM and hire some unproven offensive coordinator or QB coach to take his place. It's what Snyder does.

Actually, that is very true, the best thing about the uniforms was how it was very easy to see it as a different team playing the Cowboys. The only thing was, the drive chart was unmistakably Commanders 2022. 13 yards, -5, etc etc. Same drive chart for 3 weeks.

I know we've seen some bad teams over the past 25 years; I have been here for all of them. This one feels different to me. It is uniquely bad, unfortunately, for these reasons:
- Coach truly given the keys. Even with Gibbs, Snyder did NOT fully give the keys, or to put it another way, he was at least "in the room" a lot. He probably did more listening than with almost any other coach though. Cerrato was still there, and maybe I'm wrong, but I believe Gibbs knew that he was dealing with two guys who didn't really know what they were doing. I think they found a decent working relationship though, but it's all conjecture on my end.
- Following the above, made moves that significantly damaged this team. Very specific moves. + Marties, - Kyle (and he walked with others) from FO/scouting. - Carter for nothing. - Settle for nothing. Those guys are building block type players, and we had them. + Wentz meant we were going to lose so many players, it was a landmark decision that HAD to work or you were making a HUGE mistake. Here we are.
- Now for three weeks, have shown a crazy unwillingness to fully adapt away from what is failing. Some of that is due to the above, but some of the decision making is beyond stupid. Like, telegraphing they are going to force the ball to McLaurin. Throwing specific players under the bus in public. Some of that is stupid, and worse still, some of it is culture-DAMAGING. The one thing Rivera was supposed to be trying to do, he is making some major missteps when he calls players out. That is rule #1 for agents and players, don't go to a team that is going to tarnish you. This team has a rep for throwing players under the bus, and damaging careers. Rivera has actually not fixed that at all. Year 1 looked better but we have seen steady decline since.
- As bad as the OL is, and even with all of the above issues, this set of players has truly felt like it could play much better than what we've seen. Yet, what I have witnessed is truly miserable coaching. It's not just me, there are analysts, former football players, who are saying the same. I listen to Logan Paulsen on the radio sometimes, he has pretty much said it, and he is very reluctant to say negative things about coaching. We have heard it on the broadcast, the most vocal recently was Schlereth who was practically begging for running the ball to help the OL (and he would know).

It just seems to me, this team is actually getting severely damaged by all parties. I was considering last night at some point, how hard would it be for WAS to get another franchise? Ha. Maybe petition Leonsis.

By the way, all - don't get me wrong, I don't think Kyle Smith was some amazing person with any certainty. His track record wasn't bad though. He was young and up-and-coming, respected in league circles. That was a guy no respectable team that runs on merit, just lets go. That is what this team did (although I don't put that one all on Rivera necessarily, I just put the Marties on him).

* Also, to your last point: my bet is Mayhew is GONE, they clean house and let Jason Wright put a group together. I am not sure that would be totally bad, but Snyder will be involved, so it will not be good. I just don't think it has to end up worse than what we see here, but they have surprised me before. I am just ready to roll the dice at this point.

 

[Rymanofthenorth]

whoever they hire wont have a chance because snyder wont give them one. the one constant here in 25 years of crapulence is snyder. the goodwill he built up by spending money on free agents is long gone , the ill will he built up by destroying our winning culture is here to stay

 

[Henry]

I gotta say, this team doesn't look any different than any of the terrible teams we've see over the years.

Look at the first six games of 2020: 1-5. Four straight games where the defense gave up over 30 points. This was the year Chase Young was drafted, and the defense looked historically terrible. The offense couldn't break 20 points. Horrible.

Look at the first half of last year: 2-6. Again, the defense looked awful, giving up 29+ points in five straight games. The offense got progressively worse. By week 8 they were scoring ten points a game.

Both of those years they rallied. Put together a string of four wins later in the season to make things look respectable. I expect that will happen again. The only question is will that be enough to save Rivera's job. To me, this question is purely academic, as the coach and the system and the players it haven't really mattered in decades. But, for what it's worth, I suspect he'll get fired. So there's that.

 

[SkinsNumberOne]

Both of those years they rallied. Put together a string of four wins later in the season to make things look respectable. I expect that will happen again. The only question is will that be enough to save Rivera's job. To me, this question is purely academic, as the coach and the system and the players it haven't really mattered in decades. But, for what it's worth, I suspect he'll get fired. So there's that.

Looking back at the games for this team, literally going to pro football reference and hitting the "Previous game" button, and also going to the team and hitting "Previous season" -- yeah. It was unpleasant. I felt I owed it to you based on what you were saying, and you are definitely correct. From a game-to-game perspective, and a season-to-season perspective, there is a lot of similarity. I would still say, though, that maybe the most similarity is with Zorn.

When I look at other teams, I get the feeling we'll see a lot of pretty similar results. It's not easy to find "that" winning formula, just like people talk about "that QB" and things like that. It's less about that single ingredient, and more about getting the right mix, which is difficult. I think you're right though, our "chef" is ultimately Dan (he will always want/have input on GMs and coaches I believe), and that is always going to make it unlikely we succeed. What I know right now, though, is that Rivera just isn't able to lead this team. I think it's possible to be better than what we've seen. How much better? I don't think we can be a Super Bowl team with our owner, but I think we can be a team that sniffs playoffs. Think Cardinals.

In general this is maybe less about being “better” and more about not having guys making decisions who are obviously incompetent. Loyalty is a great trait but you don’t (and shouldn’t) go for loyalty over merit in evaluations. I believe Rivera has done that repeatedly, and we are watching the results. To be fair, I think NFL coaches do that a LOT, but Rivera has done it even more than most.

 

[Neophyte]

For his 12-year career as a HC, Rivera is 30-38-1 in the first 6 games of the season, which while not great isn't a complete dumpster fire.

However, those numbers are bolstered by one 6-0 start and three 4-2 starts. Without those, he is 12-32-1 in the first 6 games of the other 8 seasons, and that IS pretty much a complete dumpster fire.

 

[Henry]

You know SkinNumberOne, I had a whole thing written up to break your post but it doesn't matter. I hope Washington does something, ANYTHING, to justify your faith. You deserve it.

I'm done.

 

[SkinsNumberOne]

You know SkinNumberOne, I had a whole thing written up to break your post but it doesn't matter. I hope Washington does something, ANYTHING, to justify your faith. You deserve it.

I'm done.

For what it's worth, looking through the past seasons/games was a sad reminder of the futility under Snyder. I don't consider myself an optimist in general, nor an optimist about this team. I just think that when something is abjectly failing, you move on. It doesn't mean you get better as a guarantee (and to your point, it is more likely we do NOT get demonstrably better in particular in W/L, which I can accept), but I think accepting when "this" doesn't work is still something you need to do at some point. I get that the real "this" that doesn't work, ultimately, is Snyder. However, in this iteration of the show we all hate to watch, Rivera has left his fingerprints all over the crime scene. It's time to move on, regardless of what happens next. Looking at the past 20+ years of records/games, yes, I agree we can make a solid guess at what it will be. That doesn't mean Rivera should stay.

I know some of the posts I put into this thread indicate that I think we "can" find something that "sort of" works (as you said, which I liked, "tempered optimism"), but I will say that painful reminder on football reference definitely put the past into better perspective. I had forgotten just how bad so many of those seasons had gotten, which is surprising, but I think I have started trying to take more of a mental break from this team in the past couple of years. Maybe that's why. Anyway, I think they can be better than today, and even if that's not the case, Rivera doesn't appear to be building something that will work. There are (to me) too many bad signs of mistakes in hiring / evaluation, and a lot of favoritism it appears. I was willing to withhold judgement to see if they put a good product out, but at this point I think I'm done withholding.

 

[Henry]

Fair enough.

For the record, I meant “break DOWN your post,” not “break your post.” That sounds super-harsh.

 

[Boone]

For God’s sake, don’t feel you have to justify a little optimism. Not like we’re just brimming with it. There has to be someone who’s not on a hunger strike

 

[Boone]

Seeing our coaching staff, with one obvious exception, struggle and bumble their way to an unnecessary loss yesterday, pushed me across a line. The line being the contrasting beliefs 'the coaching staff can't win because of the talent they have to work with' vs. 'the team can't win because of the coaching staff'.

Yesterday - our coaching staff cost us a win that should've been ours. Even with seriously flawed QB play, the team did enough to win that game. Stupid and erratic playcalling, terrible game management, and a questionable game plan on offense, Rivera and Turner were awful. Let's be honest - even during this stretch where we moved briefly into .500 territory, the coaching has been suspect as hell.

Where my head is at today.... I hope the new owner cleans house from top to bottom. Get rid of all of them and start over.

 

[Neophyte]

Where my head is at today.... I hope the new owner cleans house from top to bottom. Get rid of all of them and start over.

I'm almost here. Almost.

I'd like to keep Paul's favorite, Matsco, and I'd like to keep the DL coaches who have managed to tap into something with that whole unit this year.

Otherwise...yeah, I wouldn't be hurt to see them all get shown the door at the end of the season.

My biggest concern is that we are going to be saddled with them for another whole season. Prime time to make changes to the on-the-sideline staff is January/February. Even if the sale is a wrap by the owner's meetings in March (26-29 in AZ), that is still nearly 3 months after the end of the season and 6 after the Super Bowl. I can't ever remember a team turning over their coaching staff that late in the year.

Now, having said that, we could still see movement in the front office but even that is unlikely to radically impact player personnel moves in the 2023 offseason. A shakeup would leave whoever is coming in just a few weeks to evaluate their idea of team needs ahead of the draft and the most active part of the free agency period would be over by that point.

So yeah...I'm excited about the possible sale of the team but if we are being honest, this is about the worst timing possible for this. One last middle finger from Snyder to all of us.

 

[Chris]

As excited as I am with the potential and possibilities of a fresh start for the franchise, I understand that real change will take some time because there are so many fundamental problems to be addressed and I am okay with that.

I am buoyed by the realization that I just might have to opportunity to once again experience a respected, successful, professionally operated franchise before my clock strikes midnight. Previously I had no such hope.

 

[burgold]

Loyalty is a good thing. Lacking an imagination is a bad thing. I think Rivera suffers more from lack of imagination. I mean look at his free agent signings.

 

[Boone]

This could be one of those deals where this has been in the works for months. The announcement of a new owner may be a formality already pre-determined. If that's the case, we may have a new GM, front office crew, and coaching staff by January. I hope so.

If not, unfortunately that probably means another season of this inept bunch.

 

[Neophyte]

It could be but I doubt it. I think this sort of thing is hard to hide. Mention it to just one person who wants to appear important to anyone in the media and it's out.

My guess is that is what happened with Forbes. Someone wanted to look important or "in-the-know" and leaked it to a reporter.

I think that someone would have spilled the beans on this having been in the works longer to a Jay Glazer or a Peter King in days since the news broke. They haven't. Glazer is reporting the hope is to have it completed by the league meetings in March.

If I were a betting man, I would be putting my money on this having been in the works about 2 weeks - basically, since Irsay went public in NY and Tanya got booed. That is also just enough time for someone to let Snyder know the news about the federal investigation was going to go public.