Tell the Truth Monday- 2024 End of Season Edition

[mistertim]

Not sure it’s been talked about and I hate to do it since the kid has almost single handedly restored our franchise to a proud one once again. For all intents and purposes, he does everything right.

But I couldn’t believe it when Jayden danced after the score while we were getting our asses kicked. Seemed so out of character.

All I could think was he was trying to send a signal to the team that it wasn’t over.

Yeah that left a weird taste in my mouth too. I was like "um...y tho? we're getting our asses handed to us"

But I agree with burgold and give him the benefit of the doubt.

 

[SkinsNumberOne]

A truth unrelated to this team is that I think Jalen Hurts is the real deal, and I think he and Jayden are going to be rivals for best QB in the NFC. I've seen a lot of ragging on Hurts for not being able to throw as well as most star QBs, but if he was injured, he didn't show it. Barkley won't last forever, but as long as they have him, Jalen it's going be an uphill fight dealing with 2 playmakers at once.. I hope that we can find and develop the same sort of support for Jayden in our offense.

Jalen isn't a bad QB, no. However, does Jayden appear to be better? Yes.

Jayden is working with remarkably - REMARKABLY - less. It is such a huge advantage to have a strong OL. Getting hung up on the final score doesn't tell the tale. There's a lot more to it than that. I think Jayden is actually still a lot better than Jalen. If our talent around him increases and we don't see the tides shift, sure, then we can revisit, but from what I see -- Jalen has a ton of advantages around him, and in particular they don't ask him to do much. I'm not saying he is a bad QB by any stretch, but I think it's very possible Jayden is elite. Jalen is not at that level, in my eyes.

That said, with Howie... yes Jalen will be a force; he will always have a very strong supporting cast.

 

[SkinsNumberOne]

Not sure it’s been talked about and I hate to do it since the kid has almost single handedly restored our franchise to a proud one once again. For all intents and purposes, he does everything right.

But I couldn’t believe it when Jayden danced after the score while we were getting our asses kicked. Seemed so out of character.

All I could think was he was trying to send a signal to the team that it wasn’t over.

That's on brand. He stays EVEN by always looking at this as a game. He's consistent.

Throw 4-picks. Throw 0-picks. Throw 300 yards. Throw 100 yards. Same Jayden. It's part of his superpower, so yeah, score a TD down 20 or whatever, he's going to be happy and have fun. I was totally cool with it, because he's not gloating or any jerk move, and it's not some overly scripted garbage which honestly... to me, that is tired. It just looks like he's having fun without trying too hard. The stuff where dudes have clearly rehearsed it a lot, that is off to me. Anyway just my opinion.

 

[Chris]

Truth- I seriously underestimated the Philly coaching staff. Better talent to work with? Without any doubt. But that talent was so well prepared in every way. Even though I still view him as a putz…Siriani deserves credit, even if Fangio & Moore did the lion’s share of the heavy lifting.

 

[SkinsNumberOne]

Truth- I seriously underestimated the Philly coaching staff. Better talent to work with? Without any doubt. But that talent was so well prepared in every way. Even though I still view him as a putz…Siriani deserves credit, even if Fangio & Moore did lion’s share of the heavy lifting.

I think Philly analytics helps a lot too. We are not so far behind, but we are clearly behind. The tendencies in particular - we still have them in our third meeting. They actually used theirs against us. I think I suggested, pre-game, that *we* do that to *them* --- oh well.

 

[CuredFromBatteredFanSyndrome]

A truth unrelated to this team is that I think Jalen Hurts is the real deal, and I think he and Jayden are going to be rivals for best QB in the NFC. I've seen a lot of ragging on Hurts for not being able to throw as well as most star QBs, but if he was injured, he didn't show it. Barkley won't last forever, but as long as they have him, Jalen it's going be an uphill fight dealing with 2 playmakers at once.. I hope that we can find and develop the same sort of support for Jayden in our offense.

Hurts is a good player.

But the real MVP is Howie Roseman. It’s unbelievable the collection of talent he’s put together under a salary cap. When you think about both lines, elite RB, elite WR coupled with a very good 1B, and drafting 2 rookie corners that have played like they have- it’s unreal.

I will never understand how they can pay all these guys including Hurts and not ever face cap hell, almost like it’s a myth.

You put JD5 on the Eagles and they go 17-0 and win by 3 scores every week. Put Jalen on this team and we maybe win 8 games.

 

[Commander Wraith]

I think Dan Quinn blew it when he told the players they weren't playing with House money and that they earned it and should play like their rent was on the line. I liked it in the moment, but it turns out that this moment was too big for many of our players. They played tighter and made mistakes.

There's a fine line between believing in yourself and putting too much pressure on yourself. Honestly, I thinking I'm picking nits here and looking for fault where there's little, but all season the team fought well when it was "Why not us?" I think they needed to keep that loose, underdog mentality.

In general, this team went further than it had any right to. They gave us memories and it was the first fun season probably since RGIII's rookie year. I think this fan base really needed that. I think we were as broken as the team. Still, I am disappointed. We should have done better in this last game. After a season of overperforming, we chose the worst game to underperform.

We are better than that.

I had the same feeling about Quinn’s messaging. Felt like it was just asking for the players to play tight (as you said). I’m not mad though - what a damn impressive showing in his first year… and not just record-wise.

 

[SkinsNumberOne]

The team messaging was pretty consistent from Wagner and JD5, arguably the two biggest leaders on the team along with McLaurin.
The messaging was: "Just another game. Don't make it bigger than that."

I didn't think they looked too tight. I thought JD5 looked a bit tight. The turnovers were mostly just random mistakes (esp. McNichols) or really good work by Eagles D (esp Ekeler). The penalties were mostly ticky-tack garbage in a big game that also helped ice it. So, a lot went wrong that was sort of out of their hands. Personally I didn't think they looked tight.

 

[Commander Wraith]

When I do my Next Day Thread (which may end up being Tuesday) I'm going to touch on this more. But I really think we set the tone for ourselves. Go for it in far worse situations on that drive and then when we're close we take three points instead of continuing to ride the pony that got us to the show and going for it. Of course, I see the argument that there is no guarantee you get it and coming away with no points may be equally detrimental (couldn't have been worse, given what ended up happening). And I do agree to some extent. But this team overachieved its talent because it went for the jugular at all times. Yesterday, on the tone setting drive, we said, "ya, we're nervous. We need three."

I didn’t mind it too much given he couldn’t have known our D would be an absolute sieve and we’d hand over balls on O like we wanted autographs. Expecting us to convert 3 for 3 on 4th in one drive is a tall ask as well. But I also get the other side of the argument for sure. Certainly possible it set the tone for the day too.


On a separate note, 2 of the top 3 things I didn’t want to see happen yesterday happened - we lost (specifically vs the Eagles) and we got embarrassed. On the bright side, my number one was that I wanted Daniels to get through the game healthy, and my number 4 was that Daniels would look like his normal, far beyond his years, self. So there’s that at least.

 

[KDawg]

I didn’t mind it too much given he couldn’t have known our D would be an absolute sieve and we’d hand over balls on O like we wanted autographs. Expecting us to convert 3 for 3 on 4th in one drive is a tall ask as well. But I also get the other side of the argument for sure. Certainly possible it set the tone for the day too.


On a separate note, 2 of the top 3 things I didn’t want to see happen yesterday happened - we lost (specifically vs the Eagles) and we got embarrassed. On the bright side, my number one was that I wanted Daniels to get through the game healthy, and my number 4 was that Daniels would look like his normal, far beyond his years, self. So there’s that at least.

See, your first sentence is why I WOULD have kept going for it. We went for it on 4th and ~5 near the 50 - why not go for it on 4th and 5 closer to the goal? The strategy didn't make a whole lot of sense to me.

That certainly doesn't put blame on him for the loss. Our defense IS a sieve. And that is talent based. And our OL is lacking.

I just kind of feel like we took our foot off the gas and it didn't let us overcome the comical talent gap.

 

[CuredFromBatteredFanSyndrome]

At the time, I understood taking the points. But thinking about it more, that felt like a huge win for the Eagles D to concede 3. 18 plays, 8 minutes - you have to just go down throwing.

 

[the evil genius]

Schadenfreude will be seeing the Eagles getting cheated out of a win by the refs in the SB. 😅

 

[KDawg]

At the time, I understood taking the points. But thinking about it more, that felt like a huge win for the Eagles D to concede 3. 18 plays, 8 minutes - you have to just go down throwing.

I was pretty upset with it the moment it happened. It felt like the opposite of what we’ve done. Many brought up why you take the points, and as VoR said, “reasonable people can disagree” - and that is such a good point. And the other side may be right, or maybe I am. Who knows.

I just know what I would have done given what we’ve done week after week. It felt like we lost our stones a bit in that moment and with that we lost the “cornered animals will do anything” mentality, and thus made us look like less than… just my opinion.

 

[CuredFromBatteredFanSyndrome]

I was pretty upset with it the moment it happened. It felt like the opposite of what we’ve done. Many brought up why you take the points, and as VoR said, “reasonable people can disagree” - and that is such a good point. And the other side may be right, or maybe I am. Who knows.

I just know what I would have done given what we’ve done week after week. It felt like we lost our stones a bit in that moment and with that we lost the “cornered animals will do anything” mentality, and thus made us look like less than… just my opinion.

💯

I must admit it’s likely all the goodwill that Dan Quinn’s built up that had me being okay with kicking the FG. My actual emotions were like “Whaaa…WTF?”. Felt very blue ball-ish.

 

[the evil genius]

Fwiw there should be no shame in this loss to a clearly superior team. 34 🤬'ing years we've been trash. Almost 2/3 of my life. Outside of RG3's rookie season, I haven't been this hopeful. Nothing will take that away.

 

[Kel Varnsen]

That first FG, I felt there was no wrong way to go there. Either kicking or going, I felt was a good choice. However, I was definitely surprised when he did kick. Especially after going for it so much not only on that drive, but also the previous two games. I wonder if the failed 4th downs early in those two games played into it.

 

[Neophyte]

Draft picks from Rounds 1 through 3 since 2020 that played for Philadelphia yesterday:
- Quinyon Mitchell - 1st (2024)
- Cooper DeJean - 2nd (2024)
- Jalyx Hunt - 3rd (2024)
- Jalen Carter - 1st (2023)
- Nolan Smith - 1st (2023)
- Tyler Steen - 3rd (2023)
- Sydney Brown - 3rd (2023)
- Jordan Davis - 1st (2022)
- Cam Jurgens - 2nd (2022)
- DeVonta Smith - 1st (2021)
- Landon Dickerson - 2nd (2021)
- Milton Williams - 3rd (2021)
- Jalen Hurts - 2nd (2020)

Draft picks from Rounds 1 through 3 since 2020 that played for Washington yesterday:
- Jayden Daniels - 1st (2024)
- Jer'Zhan Newton - 2nd (2024)
- Mike Sainristil - 2nd (2024)
- Ben Sinnott - 2nd (2024)
- Brandon Coleman - 3rd (2024)
- Luke McCaffrey - 3rd (2024)
- Quan Martin - 2nd (2023)
- Brian Robinson - 3rd (2022)
- Benjamin St-Juste - 3rd (2021)
- Dyami Brown - 3rd (2021)

I think this provides real insight into the final score. It serves as both an indictment of what went on here with previous leadership and a cause for excitement going forward.

 

[method man]

Jalen isn't a bad QB, no. However, does Jayden appear to be better? Yes.

Jayden is working with remarkably - REMARKABLY - less. It is such a huge advantage to have a strong OL. Getting hung up on the final score doesn't tell the tale. There's a lot more to it than that. I think Jayden is actually still a lot better than Jalen. If our talent around him increases and we don't see the tides shift, sure, then we can revisit, but from what I see -- Jalen has a ton of advantages around him, and in particular they don't ask him to do much. I'm not saying he is a bad QB by any stretch, but I think it's very possible Jayden is elite. Jalen is not at that level, in my eyes.

That said, with Howie... yes Jalen will be a force; he will always have a very strong supporting cast.

I was going to say this. As Logan pointed out, he is incredibly deleveraged

 

[method man]

Hurts is a good player.

But the real MVP is Howie Roseman. It’s unbelievable the collection of talent he’s put together under a salary cap. When you think about both lines, elite RB, elite WR coupled with a very good 1B, and drafting 2 rookie corners that have played like they have- it’s unreal.

I will never understand how they can pay all these guys including Hurts and not ever face cap hell, almost like it’s a myth.

You put JD5 on the Eagles and they go 17-0 and win by 3 scores every week. Put Jalen on this team and we maybe win 8 games.

Look at the Hurts contract on Spotrac. It really is a work of art

 

[ExoDus84]

A truth unrelated to this team is that I think Jalen Hurts is the real deal, and I think he and Jayden are going to be rivals for best QB in the NFC.

I have to disagree. Hurts isn't terrible; he's a mid-tier QB overall. In my opinion, he's being carried by what's the best roster in the NFL. Their lines are absolutely elite on both sides, the best scoring defense in the NFL this season, an MVP caliber running back to make his life easy, etc. If Hurts has to carry a team, he'd be exposed immediately.

The last six games we've had virtually zero running game, and the defense couldn't stop UCLA. Despite this, Jayden put this franchise on his back and willed this team to the NFCCG. I doubt Hurts could ever pull that off with a mid (at best) roster.