So what is a success for this defence?

[Ax]

I think every young safety worth his salt wants film on himself crushing someone. Be it clean or dirty. Early, or late. Gives receivers something to think about.

But if he can't learn to control it, he'll owe half his salary to the NFL. He'll learn, or he'll be shown the door.

 

[Dead Money]

I think every young safety worth his salt wants film on himself crushing someone. Be it clean or dirty. Early, or late. Gives receivers something to think about.

But if he can't learn to control it, he'll owe half his salary to the NFL. He'll learn, or he'll be shown the door.

His signing bonus was $109k he's already lost $8k of that!

 

[Lanky Livingston]

If he plays tonight like he did last week he wont get many more chances...there is just no doubting that.

and yes, you did agree with me. you just added 2 or 3 years to your part of it.

No, I really didn't.

No DB in the entire NFL matches up well with Chris Johnson in space. Rambo gets a pass from me for that one, especially since the breakdown happened earlier in the play. His whiffed tackle on Dwyer tonight, not so much. But he's a rookie, it will come around. A total 180 in two preseason games is unrealistic expectations for a 6th round pick.

Maybe I misunderstood you, but the only similar thing we said was that Sean committed bonehead penalties.

 

[Lanky Livingston]

Lol

Or you didn't watch tonight's game either. But either way, I'm not going to go back and forth with you.

I'll let this go for now with you.

Huh? Not sure where this is coming from, but I'm disengaging now. Maybe you're not ready to be off ignore.

 

[Shi no Tenshi]

Lol..boy, i never want to engage with you. Ever. Remember that.

Why the need to be demeaning?

Rambo seemed to be okay, and he did force a turnover tonight. I didn't see him get a stupid penalty that I recall.....Tonight's game seemed pretty solid for our defense in the first half.

 

[Ax]

Lots of guys missed a bunch of tackles, and Gomes is horrid. So, Rambo did as well as some, and better than Gomes. Which isn't saying much, I know.
Hopefully he'll improve.

He's still better than Madoo Doo.

 

[fansince62]

Sean was easier to tolerate because the man was a football freak of nature. Rambo doesn't have the size and speed of Sean. We'll see what kind of mean streak he has. And whether he can control it.

But I do believe our own Brother Goaldy would provide better coverage than Madoo Poo Poo. So Rambo, as long as he can stand, and breath, is a 500% improvement, already.

It's only been two games...so who knows.

that said, there are some patterns that concern me, mostly by comparison. Amerson looks like he knows what he is doing. he looks like he fits in the scheme. he looks like he uses good technique.

Rambo looks lost out there to me. constant bad angles. always standing next to the play instead of in the mix. hasn't done anything on pass defense. it's the proverbial early so we'll see. funny vis your madieu comment - I was thinking well into the 2nd qtr last night that Rambo is going to be another williams - some good plays, but basically behind the power curve most of the time. let's hope he has the basic athletic talent - he was projected as a 2nd to 3rd rnd talent afterall (off-field stuff dropped him) - and that time will get him up to the speed of the game and dedicated study makes him a professional. to date: I'm not impressed....he's been a liability who makes doughty look better than he is.

maybe he's just not a gamer?

 

[Lanky Livingston]

It's only been two games...so who knows.

that said, there are some patterns that concern me, mostly by comparison. Amerson looks like he knows what he is doing. he looks like he fits in the scheme. he looks like he uses good technique.

Rambo looks lost out there to me. constant bad angles. always standing next to the play instead of in the mix. hasn't done anything on pass defense. it's the proverbial early so we'll see. funny vis your madieu comment - I was thinking well into the 2nd qtr last night that Rambo is going to be another williams - some good plays, but basically behind the power curve most of the time. let's hope he has the basic athletic talent - he was projected as a 2nd to 3rd rnd talent afterall (off-field stuff dropped him) - and that time will get him up to the speed of the game and dedicated study makes him a professional. to date: I'm not impressed....he's been a liability who makes doughty look better than he is.

maybe he's just not a gamer?

He's a rookie - the forced fumble makes up for a lot, IMO. Will he ever "get it?" Who knows - a lot of times NFL GMs get them wrong, but sometimes they get them right; maybe Rambo dropped to the 6th for reasons other than the off-field stuff.

 

[tshile]

I agree with al and mike on rambo, I can't put my finger on it but he looks bad out there; raw maybe. His mistakes appear to be mental ones, stupid ones at that. That can be good or bad, it depends on whether he is able to be coached to play smarter... maybe he fell to the 6th round because after interviews GM's decided the kid is just stupid... who knows. still early I suppose. bad angles and personal fouls are not a good way to make a team that desperately needs improved safety play...

 

[Shi no Tenshi]

I agree with al and mike on rambo, I can't put my finger on it but he looks bad out there; raw maybe. His mistakes appear to be mental ones, stupid ones at that. That can be good or bad, it depends on whether he is able to be coached to play smarter... maybe he fell to the 6th round because after interviews GM's decided the kid is just stupid... who knows. still early I suppose. bad angles and personal fouls are not a good way to make a team that desperately needs improved safety play...

That's the thing, I just think Rambo looks like a rookie. He is coachable, so I have hope he'll look like less of a rookie later.

I want to see him in the next couple games to see if he is learning from his mistakes. I'm fine with rookies making mistakes in pre-season; people have to make mistakes to learn sometimes. If he listens to the feedback and implements it though, he is at least showing promise that he could be solid for us.

Final thing with him: he doesn't seem to be letting the starter as a rookie thing go to his head. I think if he keeps his nose to the grindstone he'll help us significantly compared to what we had last year.

 

[Goaldeje]

I didn't see the game last night at all, but I am fully expecting some breakdowns and head-banging moments over the first half of the season, if not before. I've said it before, but we need an excellent performance from Rak and Kerrigan to overcome to youth in the secondary early in the season. Without that, it may be an incredibly painful year.

 

[Lanky Livingston]

Again, even Sean Taylor had breakdowns and stupid penalties in his rookie season, and the occasional bad angle. The difference between ST & Rambo, however, is as Ax mentioned Rambo is nowhere near the athlete that Sean was. Sean was an absolute freak of nature, so he could make up for his mistakes with a huge play later. Rambo forced a fumble, which I thought made up for a LOT of mistakes. But, he's going to be a rookie, and that means rookie mistakes. It will take some time, and he won't have the impact Sean did - I'm not sure anyone will ever again. Comparing him to #36 just isn't fair!

 

[tshile]

Again, even Sean Taylor had breakdowns and stupid penalties in his rookie season, and the occasional bad angle. The difference between ST & Rambo, however, is as Ax mentioned Rambo is nowhere near the athlete that Sean was. Sean was an absolute freak of nature, so he could make up for his mistakes with a huge play later. Rambo forced a fumble, which I thought made up for a LOT of mistakes. But, he's going to be a rookie, and that means rookie mistakes. It will take some time, and he won't have the impact Sean did - I'm not sure anyone will ever again. Comparing him to #36 just isn't fair!

Right, so lets stop writing off Rambo's play as "Sean did it too"

 

[Lanky Livingston]

Right, so lets stop writing off Rambo's play as "Sean did it too"

Writing it off? WTF are you talking about? I'm okay with Rambo's play because he is a rookie seeing his second game-action in the NFL, not because of anything Sean did.

What we have here is a failure to communicate, so I'm going to step away from this thread. Y'all have fun.

 

[tshile]

Just having some fun with you Lanky, no need to get all upset about it

You keep bringing up Taylor and mentioning he did the same things. We all agree Rambo is not Taylor, so how Taylor was able to overcome his early shortcomings with boneheaded plays is completely irrelevant to whether or not Rambo will be a reliable starter for us in the near future. That's all I meant by it.

It's 2 preseason games... he's a rookie... plenty of time for him to reign it in. If he's hitting people 3 steps out of bounds in week 6 we have a problem. An intelligence problem that, at the point, would not appear to be fixable...

 

[Lanky Livingston]

Just having some fun with you Lanky, no need to get all upset about it

You keep bringing up Taylor and mentioning he did the same things. We all agree Rambo is not Taylor, so how Taylor was able to overcome his early shortcomings with boneheaded plays is completely irrelevant to whether or not Rambo will be a reliable starter for us in the near future. That's all I meant by it.

It's 2 preseason games... he's a rookie... plenty of time for him to reign it in. If he's hitting people 3 steps out of bounds in week 6 we have a problem. An intelligence problem that, at the point, would not appear to be fixable...

My point was that *EVEN* Sean Taylor made rookie mistakes, and it took him far longer than one preseason game to correct them (even with his immense talent & athleticism). Everyone makes rookie mistakes is the point - to expect a 180-degree turnaround in play after one preseason game is totally unrealistic.

 

[tshile]

Just my opinion, but I don't think late hits and unsportsmanlike conduct adjustments are unrealistic.

I just don't think anything Taylor did is relevant to observing Rambo's play. If Rambo starts getting DUI's and shooting houses up with guns I won't be thinking "But Taylor..." either. Taylor's maturity issues (on and off the field) were a real problem, a problem overcome by physical talents we all know Rambo doesn't have. So it's irrelevant.

 

[Lanky Livingston]

Just my opinion, but I don't think late hits and unsportsmanlike conduct adjustments are unrealistic.

I just don't think anything Taylor did is relevant to observing Rambo's play. If Rambo starts getting DUI's and shooting houses up with guns I won't be thinking "But Taylor..." either. Taylor's maturity issues (on and off the field) were a real problem, a problem overcome by physical talents we all know Rambo doesn't have. So it's irrelevant.

I don't really understand what you are arguing here - if you think Sean's actions are irrelevant, then replace "Sean Taylor" with "Every Rookie Ever."

 

[tshile]

I don't really understand what you are arguing here - if you think Sean's actions are irrelevant, then replace "Sean Taylor" with "Every Rookie Ever."

Except that not every rookie ever shows mental issues like unsportsmanlike conduct penalties and bad angles. That's the criticism of him right now, through 2 NFL games.

Personally I don't think being a rookie excuses the penalties part, we have plenty of other rookies not doing it. Morgan getting a dumb penalty cost us a game last year; a real game.

Those issues tend to be caused by something mental. Showing them at this level is a problem because one would think they have been told not to do this their whole football career - did they never listen and learn or are they trying to prove something now at the next level and getting carried away, or did they never get caught at the other levels?

I'm someone who thinks playing smart matters a lot, so it's something that bothers me. There are plenty of people that don't agree with that and that's fine. It's 2 preseason games. If he does it in week 3 that's a problem, one that suggests he's going to be doing it all year. We're not talking about complicated rules here, we're talking about not getting into shoving matches and hitting people late...

I can deal with bad angles through a year of being a rookie, though Landry still haunts me...

 

[Burgundy Burner]

Just going off of my own experience of playing free in HS...

Rambo is not necessarily taking the wrong angles - at least initially. Whenever a RB or WR breaks into the secondary, the free needs to keep the player coming at him from making that cut. In other words, you need to continue to force them to the outside and square your hips in that direction. Yes, you give up another eight to ten yards or so, but you don't allow the cut to happen and have the offensive player taking it to the house.

Rambo will learn that lesson and he will be fine. Every free learns it at some point.