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Goaldeje said:
Blah. If Scot decides, on average, to take two OLinemen and two DLinemen every year for the next five years, I'm good with that. Some of that falls into the BPA debate, and some of it is that we just haven't had the talent evaluators here to hit the right combination of talent and schematic fit that we need to be successful. Fingers crossed here that Scot will help get it right for us. I'd like for him to start on both lines, and work out from there.
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Interesting you should wonder about such things. I checked his previous drafts with Seattle and San Fransisco and found the following selections.


Seattle

2014-2 OL, 2 DL

2013- 2 OL, 3 DL

2012-1 OL, 3 DL

2011-2 OL, 1 DL


San Fransisco

2010-2 OL

2009-1 DL

2008-2 OL, 1 DL

2007-1 OL, 3 DL

2006-1 DL

This is, of course, not to say what he will do in April but at least gives an indication of a willingness to add to the "big uglies" inventory fairly consistently.
 
We need to make a trade with the Eagles before they give away everyone of value on the roster :laugh:
 
Thanks Serv, pretty interesting indications there. Hopefully that trend continues, as I really like the idea of continually restocking along both lines.
 
Goaldeje said:
I agree and disagree with you. Gun to my head, outside of QB, if you asked me to identify what position grouping on the team would give the Skins the best chance for long term success (ie, 5-8 years), I would identify the OLine, and if given a second choice, the DLine. I am OK with allocating a lot of resources there accordingly. As I said, we have seen how far a top 5 unit of WRs gets us. It turns my stomach to say it, but I was envious of the Dallas OLine this year, and am hoping we emulate them.

(taking a shower, brb)

OK, and toweling off...

Blah. If Scot decides, on average, to take two OLinemen and two DLinemen every year for the next five years, I'm good with that. Some of that falls into the BPA debate, and some of it is that we just haven't had the talent evaluators here to hit the right combination of talent and schematic fit that we need to be successful. Fingers crossed here that Scot will help get it right for us. I'd like for him to start on both lines, and work out from there.
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why you son of a........Redskin fan :)

multiple paths to the top. if this one works...good by me!
 
Goaldeje said:
Thanks Serv, pretty interesting indications there. Hopefully that trend continues, as I really like the idea of continually restocking along both lines.
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don't forget: by position count and current practices of rotation...5 o-line + abt 6 d-line (to maintain rotation) = close to half of starting 22 (yea...I know I should add two more to that). point being by numbers alone (everything else constant) teams are bound to draft more linemen.
 
True, of course. fan however the 26 OL+DL combined Scot M. drafted in the years listed is a somewhat better figure than the 18 the Redskins did in those same years when combined.

Not to mention the fact that just about the entire Seahawks starting OL are players drafted by Scot M.-along with 3 OL starters (Alex Boone, Joe Staley and Mike Iupati) for the 49ers.

Gives me a bit more confidence going into this draft to be honest.
 
Man I do like McL's seacrow drafts regarding linemen. No more Lerib's or Jenkins' (in Smeagle voice). Not sure what to do with a GM that drafts us quality guys.
 
Win4us said:
Man I do like McL's seacrow drafts regarding linemen. No more Lerib's or Jenkins' (in Smeagle voice). Not sure what to do with a GM that drafts us quality guys.
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Worship him? Cannonize him? Not sure where the line is, but if he produces for us like he did in SF and SEA, I'll find it.

And probably cross it. :)
 
Oh I'll be right there with ya! I'd say at minimum put him in the ring of fame.
 
Good GMs take OL and DL in the mid rounds to develop cheap depth.

These are the positions that are most likely to have surprise careers, guys drafted late that become pro bowlers and solid contributors. With the escalation in the pay of OT, OG and DEs its also a wise strategy vis a vis the cap.

The Packers drafted Bulaga and got 4 years out of him on the OL at a bargain rate.

The 49ers did the same thing with Mike Iupati.

Now these guys are set to make major dollars in free agency or as franchise players.

The Redskins have spent a lot of free agent dollars on skill players at wide receiver and draft investments in quarterback, Griffin and Cousins.

Less money and fewer high picks have been spent on the OL and DL.

The history shows that going back to the early 1990's.

It's time to change that trend and I think if Scot is left alone he will do just that.
 
the colts actually had a very decent pass pro line when they got manning as I recall they just didnt run the ball well. my point is how many "excellent qbs, have we seen drafted by teams without lines to protect them, and then we watch them get pounded and go gunshy. its axiomatic that you build from the front and in the middle out, there is a reason for that. the skins have done it backwards for over 20 years, and we are one of the most pathetic teams in that time period. when manning joined the colts they had glenn and meadows and were a solid line just not great
 
I am amused when I read comments about top quarterbacks like Elway and Manning not needing great lines to be successful.

That may be true, but we don't have this type of HOF quarterback!

And the odds are even if we become contenders we will likely have a very good qb but not a HOFer.

Which makes building a line still an important goal.

Chester needs to go.

Lauvao needs to go.

RT is a gaping hole.
 
Rymanofthenorth said:
the colts actually had a very decent pass pro line when they got manning as I recall they just didnt run the ball well. my point is how many "excellent qbs, have we seen drafted by teams without lines to protect them, and then we watch them get pounded and go gunshy. its axiomatic that you build from the front and in the middle out, there is a reason for that. the skins have done it backwards for over 20 years, and we are one of the most pathetic teams in that time period. when manning joined the colts they had glenn and meadows and were a solid line just not great
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no they didn't. I remember his first 2-3 seasons well. he was getting sacked viciously and often.

the notion that a capable o-line is needed belabors the obvious. no one is arguing that. the issue is whether or not you go for the excellent QB when the chance is there - YES without reservation IMO. I also hasten to point out that there are teams, let's say the Pats, for example, that have won 10 games+ even when their o-line was weak comparatively speaking. The Skins issues have only been partially about the o-line...as all of us have argued ad nauseam. does our o-line need some refurbishing? yes. does it need to be populated by first and second round draftees? not so sure on that one from many perspectives - especially from a cap management pov.

Once FA signings are in the doc we'll have a better idea of where the Skins are going to place emphasis in the draft. If one thinks deeply enough about it - the real roster mismanagement has been on defense from over-reliance on FAs to poor assessment of talent to draft. What we saw on offense last season was the product of many causes: a line physically incompatible with scheme, poor QB play, recurring injuries, continued bleeding at the RT position, age at the RG position. We have our anchor at LT - that is key. We have a capable, if undersized, center. The jury is out on our two draftees from last season. It's not at all clear to me that we have to go all in on o-line in the draft. IMO, that's not where greatest value added IRT this team's most glaring weaknesses fall. The o-line certainly needs to be upgraded to meet Gruden's schematic direction. But there are many paths to that end....and not all those paths require dumping all high round draft picks on o-line. This, again IMO, is McL's challenge: strengthen the o-line while reserving the high value draft chips for defense where the most pressing weaknesses demand immediate attention.
 
actually Manning has a quick release and while he got hit some good ones in his rookie year Tarik Glenn was a very underrated LT who had the misfortune of playing during an era when guys like Ogden and Pace and Walter Jones were playing. Adam Meadows was a very good guard, and eventually the Colts got Jeff saturday who was decent.

I can name guys who should have been franchise qbs who got pounded and never developed, thats why teams like the ravens won a superbowl with dilfer ffs
 
Rymanofthenorth said:
actually Manning has a quick release and while he got hit some good ones in his rookie year Tarik Glenn was a very underrated LT who had the misfortune of playing during an era when guys like Ogden and Pace and Walter Jones were playing. Adam Meadows was a very good guard, and eventually the Colts got Jeff saturday who was decent.

I can name guys who should have been franchise qbs who got pounded and never developed, thats why teams like the ravens won a superbowl with dilfer ffs
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"guys who should have been franchise QBs" - that, of course, is impossible to prove.

not worth getting sidetracked on this. You can look at the stats...his QB rating started to jump in his 6th yr when sacks dropped below 20+ a season. again, not worth getting excited over.

I can recall great QBs who played behind average to weak lines - Sonny J or Favre (during many seasons) anyone?

manning does have a quick release and he is a great QB...no doubt about it.
 
Right, so did Dan Marino. 2 or 3 Dolphins made the pro bowl because Marino was only sacked 18 or 19 times, but that was because of his release not because his linemen were dominating up front.
 
One of the knocks on Griffin is that he holds onto the ball too long. If we attribute that to a weakness in reading secondaries, then new linemen won't help. Better coverage in the back end gives the rushers more time to beat any lineman. I don't see that changing. The only way I see Griffin improving is improving the running game. Pass blocking is important, but hey, let's get our priorities in order.
 
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