Random Commanders Thoughts

[SkinnedAussie]

If Kirk wants to be paid by Snyder next year, he has to start getting his shit together in the red zone. There is nothing worse than kicking field goals then the opposition drive downfield and easily score a TD. I know it's not all Kirk's fault, but that's who I point the finger at.

 

[TomE]

According to the local pundits and the coach, Kirk just played his best game of the season.

He was experiencing the most pressure he's seen behind this line yet his throws were still predominantly spot on and what looked bad to us were either miscommunications, drops, bad routes or busted plays.

Don't forget, he had just lead the team down the field for the go ahead score, the only possible 'complaint' might be that he was too efficient in getting there and left too much time on the clock for the Lions still holding 3 time outs.

Most agree that the worst throw was the first down dirt ball just after the final TD by Stafford, had that throw been 'on' most figure that getting into FG range could have been possible.

He threw 80% with no INT's, kept going on despite all of the crap, getting his butt hit hard and often and we were winning when he came off the field for the last time.

He might not be 'elite' by whatever standard.... but he's pretty damn scrappy and still learning the job.

Maybe the old adage, 'getting into midseason form' doesn't hold as true anymore but it's seven games in and Kirk is almost there IMO. Think we need to fill out the season before anything is settled on his 'worth' to the Redskins.

 

[SkinnedAussie]

One game doesn't make a season!

 

[Knightingale]

I think Kirk will get his money.

He's not Elite, and maybe he doesn't truly deserve a $20M+ deal, but the simply matter of fact is that there are nonElite QB's available and even good ones are in VERY short supply. Honestly as I look around the league right now I have to say the the current QB crop at the moment is pretty rough.

Kirk is good. And he's learning still. Keep him behind centre for a couple more years and I think he'"" be very good. He played really well this week. We moved the ball consistently and the fumbles weren't on him. Yeah he had a couple of ugly throws but then which QB doesn't?

To win in this league I think we need the three C's...

Continuity. Consistency. Kirk.

Ok two Cs and a K! Lol

Keep this staff and team together, stay on plan. The teams that win and win constantly in this league are the ones with continuity at key player and staff positions. We haven't had that in decades. Kirks good, maybe not great but good. Griden is good, !"not great, but good. They'll both learn over time. And now we have a good GM this team can now plot a course properly.

We should stick with it.

 

[TomE]

He threw 80% with no INT's, kept going on despite all of the crap, getting his butt hit hard and often and we were winning when he came off the field for the last time.

Let me correct the last part to ......

when he came off the field for what should have been the last time

Had he managed to pull off the final drive in those 16 seconds to tie and continued on to win we'd probably be talking about this in a different tone. Maybe that's the 'elite' we're looking for.

 

[Boone]

Kirk has played quite well since a rough start.


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[Henry]

I think Kirk will get his money.

He's not Elite, and maybe he doesn't truly deserve a $20M+ deal, but the simply matter of fact is that there are nonElite QB's available and even good ones are in VERY short supply. Honestly as I look around the league right now I have to say the the current QB crop at the moment is pretty rough.

Kirk is good. And he's learning still. Keep him behind centre for a couple more years and I think he'"" be very good. He played really well this week. We moved the ball consistently and the fumbles weren't on him. Yeah he had a couple of ugly throws but then which QB doesn't?

This is a good point here. Kirk is not Top Tier, but who is?

Brady, Roethelisberger, Rodgers, Brees ... all over 30. Over 35.

Matt Ryan is 31. Joe Flacco is 31. Eli Manning looks 12 but he's 35. Carson Palmer is 36.

Who are the 'Elite' QBs under 30? Newton ... Maybe Wilson, Maybe Luck ... Andy Dalton? Matt Stafford?

All these guys are less than perfect. Newton is a walking temper tantrum. Wilson is the best Bus Driver in NFL history. Luck's stock has dropped quite a bit over the past year and a half. Stafford suddenly looks great ... after eight years in the league.

Frankly, outside of maybe Newton none of them are really on the level of Rodgers or Brady. I don't see Cousins that much differently than Derek Carr or Tyrod Taylor or any other number of the Next Generation of QBs. He's flawed but capable. And even that is hard to find at the QB spot. Redskin fans, of all people, should know that.

I do think we should re-sign him. I HOPE he doesn't insist on top tier money. That will kill us like it killed the Ravens, and like it would have killed the Cowboys had the Magical Dak Prescott not fallen into their laps. But if we can get him for an Osweiller-type contract, we should do it.

 

[micks113]

Way I see it is Kirk is more in the vein of Cutler, Rivers, Bradford, Palmer. Supposedly great/excellent QB's who won nothing. Look good making stats. We need more than that.

As far as best game this season.....ok so what? I think he has sort of underperformed thus far, sort of stunk compared to what he is capable of. Sick and tired of seeing him unable to hit a long pass in stride. Didn't he overthrow 85 Tight end for a touchdown....again???? How many missed opportunities has he been responsible for overthrowing a wide open reciever with no one behind him??? Maybe I saw it wrong, maybe the TE was not open downfield.

Anyway, here is the killer for me. Experience heady QB's know to milk the clock on the final drive, as well as the coaches. We either couldn't do it, or forgot to do it, or didn't play out that way. But good grief, you just don't leave the other team with time to work with when you don't have to. Hard lesson for Gruden. And Kirk, at some point Kirk has to take charge of what's happening on the field despite what a coach may say. The great ones know what to do. Difference between winning and losing.

 

[Henry]

Anyway, here is the killer for me. Experience heady QB's know to milk the clock on the final drive, as well as the coaches. We either couldn't do it, or forgot to do it, or didn't play out that way. But good grief, you just don't leave the other team with time to work with when you don't have to. Hard lesson for Gruden. And Kirk, at some point Kirk has to take charge of what's happening on the field despite what a coach may say. The great ones know what to do. Difference between winning and losing.

Seriously? We scored on a QB sneak from 20 yards out. Do you honestly think that was a 'let's go for the score right now' play call?

 

[Knightingale]

I think it's way too early to brand Kirk in any real category yet. This is only his second year as a starter and it takes longer than that generally to learn all the nuances of the NFL. Quarterbacks always have a learning curve (unless you're Dak Prescott) and that curve is worse if the team around you isn't great.

The Redskins have not been great.

They've been far from it for many years, especially our lines. RGIII masked it somewhat in 2012 but generally until late last year when our O line started gelling our QBs have had a tough baptism by fire.

Also you can't just rate Kirk in a vacuum. The reality is that there are few good QBs and ALOT of really bad ones. Between injury and a shallow talent pool there's just nobody out there worth saying '**** Kirk, dump him and move on!'

Move on to what?

The draft is a lottery. Elite or even good QBs don't hit free agency.

Kirk is better than most even if he's not perfect. I honestly think we're pretty damn lucky to have him. After RGIII fell through this could have been so much worse.

As an addendum I'd also like to float out the notion that not all bad throws are necessarily on the QB.
Receivers run routes and often the QB throws to the spot the WR is supposed to be at. Especially on the long balls. I find it hard to tell if the ball is overthrown or the receiver a step slow.
Or you get times like that ugly almost interception where we had two receivers converge in the same space cause one (Grant?) blew his route. Not Kirks fault but the interception goes on his record.

 

[Goaldeje]

I think Kirk is perfectly sufficient to win a SB with, as long as he has the right team around him - but then again you can pretty much say that about EVERY QB in history. If we dump him in the off season, that is just one more piece to worry about, when we pretty clearly need to focus on the defense and get that taken care of.

I guess if he wants to be a top 3 paid QB in the NFL, you let him walk.

But he doesn't strike me as having that kind of hubris. He is better than Trent Dilfer was, unquestionably. He is better than Brad Johnson was, and they both won SBs. We have a better offensive team around our QB than those two guys did as well. We need to shore up the DLine, get some LB depth and not have to stress out about what the off season QB market will look like.

 

[Bulldog]

I agree with Rich Tandler's point in the CSN piece that given the competitiveness of the NFC East this year and the relatively light schedules ahead for Dallas and the Giants, the Redskins' loss to Detroit could very easily be the game we look back on that kept us out of a playoff spot based on wins or the tie-breakers.

That said, we lost the turnover battle against Detroit.

While Cousins was effective in spots and made some plays, it seems clear we can't suffer much adversity and still win.

Kirk is not coming up with those 3 touchdown games he had last season.

All the more reason to sit Matt Jones and give Kelley/Thompson a chance to be 1-2 the next couple of weeks.

 

[Shi no Tenshi]

I agree with Rich Tandler's point in the CSN piece that given the competitiveness of the NFC East this year and the relatively light schedules ahead for Dallas and the Giants, the Redskins' loss to Detroit could very easily be the game we look back on that kept us out of a playoff spot based on wins or the tie-breakers.

That said, we lost the turnover battle against Detroit.

While Cousins was effective in spots and made some plays, it seems clear we can't suffer much adversity and still win.

Kirk is not coming up with those 3 touchdown games he had last season.

All the more reason to sit Matt Jones and give Kelley/Thompson a chance to be 1-2 the next couple of weeks.

I don't care who is behind center, you lose the turnover battle like that and your chances of winning are bad. -2 in turnovers puts you under 20% chance of victory on average. Sure, it's nice when you do overcome it, but I can't say it should be a knock on Cousins that he didn't overcome that sort of adversity, as more than 80% of teams don't.

 

[Knightingale]

I agree with Rich Tandler's point in the CSN piece that given the competitiveness of the NFC East this year and the relatively light schedules ahead for Dallas and the Giants, the Redskins' loss to Detroit could very easily be the game we look back on that kept us out of a playoff spot based on wins or the tie-breakers.

That said, we lost the turnover battle against Detroit.

While Cousins was effective in spots and made some plays, it seems clear we can't suffer much adversity and still win.

Kirk is not coming up with those 3 touchdown games he had last season.

All the more reason to sit Matt Jones and give Kelley/Thompson a chance to be 1-2 the next couple of weeks.

To be fair if Jones hadn't fumbled that ball on the 2 yard line the very next play could have been a short TD pass or run and then we are talking about 3 TDs for the offense. And who knows what the other drives that were killed through turnovers and penalties would have yielded. Or the dropped passes. Can't put this on Kirk. The blame goes around on this one.

I do think this could be a game that they'll regret letting slip through their fingers though. No losing teams as yet in the East, something has got to give!

I also think we need to find a solution at RB. Unlike QBs good RBs do pop up in FA. LeSean McCoy anyone? deMarco Murray? Just a couple of RBs that have been on the trade block lately. I do prefer to grab a young stud in the draft but I'm also open to bringing in a good Veteran while we find him.

Maybe Jones is the answer, but his fumbling is an issue. Time will tell if it's solved, or if it's a fatal flaw in his makeup. Let's see if this week has dented his confidence. I'd also like to see more of Kelley and Thompson. This could be their audition year.

Is it really too late to bring Alfred back?

 

[Knightingale]

Oh and an addendum...

I've seen some bad turnover games but this game just seemed destined to get away from us. Weird stuff was happening.
I can't say I've ever seen a QB complete a pass by ricocheting it off the DB's helmet. I've never seen a kicker miss by hitting the TOP of the upright. Jones fumbling TWICE and that bizarre other fumble as long got pushed back into Cousins. Crowder dropping that pass, Grant fluffing up plays twice!
And who knew Roberts could catch?!

It was a bit like that Cowboys game where fate determined Morris would be the final knife wound to end us.

It really felt like we were playing against both the Lions AND predetermined fate on Sunday.

 

[micks113]

Seriously? We scored on a QB sneak from 20 yards out. Do you honestly think that was a 'let's go for the score right now' play call?

Yeah.....I know. I guess it was asking too much to have a milk the clock drive and score. We've never done it. Gruden himself said..."maybe we should have run the ball more on the last drive".

I like Kirk. IMO he's only lacking in the clutch play, and the come from behind 4th qtr drive. Otherwise, we can win with him, but like Shi No says....no QB will win with our turnovers. bottom line, if we don't play flawless ball from the supporting cast, Kirk can't put it on his back alone. The Lions may own us, but at least the Giants don't anymore. Every team's got that one team they can't seem to play well against, no matter what.

On to London, Kirk's got a great game in him, its coming. Hope its this Sun.

 

[Henry]

Well we havent done it this season, we did have two time-killing, game-winning drives last year (Philly and Tampa) so its not like weve NEVER done it.

I do admit that when Cousins scored I thought to myself "we scored too quickly" but its not our fault the Lions defense bit so hard on the fake, and if the score is there you take it. Tough to blame Gruden or Cousins for that one.

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[SkinnedAussie]

This 'debate' can be seen as two parties - one for the "A good QB makes for a good team' and 'A good team makes for a good QB'. TBH, we are neither a good team, nor do we have a good QB! Kirk does what the cattle allows him to do, whilst the cattle do what the QB allows them to do.

Any NFL team like we are will always be there-abouts, but we'll never be lights-out, thanks for coming.

 

[Boone]

I think you need to watch more games SkinnedAussie.

Keeping in mind that Cousins has had several very good weeks in a row after a slow start, here are some of his 2016 stats:

- Averaging 285 yds/game passing, good for 6th in the NFL so far
- 1996 passing yards, again good for 6th in the NFL
- 177 completions, 4th most in the NFL in 2016
- 7.5 yds/pass attempt, tied for 9th with Big Ben, Andrew Luck, and Russell Wilson
- 6.96 net yds/pass attempt, tied for 9th
- 25.3 passes completed/game, 4th most in the NFL
- 2 game winning drives, tied for 4th most in the NFL (and it should be 3)

Kirk and the Redskins need to get better in the red zone - that's probably the most legitimate criticism one can make. But the unfounded criticism like you just threw out there isn't supported by the stats.

 

[Boone]

Well we havent done it this season, we did have two time-killing, game-winning drives last year (Philly and Tampa) so its not like weve NEVER done it.

I do admit that when Cousins scored I thought to myself "we scored too quickly" but its not our fault the Lions defense bit so hard on the fake, and if the score is there you take it. Tough to blame Gruden or Cousins for that one.

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Cousins has lead the game winning drive twice this year. That's different from HAVING to score on the last drive in order to win which is what you are referencing. Had his drive been successful this past weekend, Cousins would have the 3rd most successful game winning drives in 2016.