PFT: Donovan McNabb is headed to the Washington Redskins

[servumtuum]

This may seem like a quaint notion, but ... I'm not going to judge the move until I see the rest of the offseason play out. The OL situation, the Campbell situation, both are still very much in flux and clearly not fully realized yet.

McNabb may or may not even be here come the regular season ... or he may be here strictly in 'hold the fort' mode until a young hotshot draftee is ready to play in a year or two ... or ... who knows.

Big mistake in my opinion to try to put The Trade in perspective until all the myriad related elements come into focus.

Well, gee-thank you, Om, you gave me somewhere to settle-for now at least. I'm still digging around reading perspectives here, other boards (not that one-it's a freakin' zoo when things are quiet-God only knows what it must be like now-I'll wait on a visit there.), sports media, "pundits". I'll probably check and see what other team's fans think, other regional media...etc. But from what I'm gathering so far, the trade looks pretty good even though it seems to have noticeable problems-losing pick #37 being the most glaring to me.

But, as has been stated, and what I think is a likely scenario, the trade/draft frenzy is just starting league-wide and I think the Redskins will be in the thick of things. I really can't join the doom-and-gloom camp nor the Omigod we're in the playoffs for sure folks either. There's, as you said, not enough evidence to draw any conclusions yet. Is McNabb going to makes us a better team next season? I believe so-and I can't help but wonder if one possible reason for this move might have been to placate fans who, if the Skins didn't at least get a wild-card spot next season, would knee-jerk into a "fire Shanny" mode. Trust me, they're out there.

Bottom line, so far I'm o.k. with the move-pending what I see happening over the next three weeks, followed by the next few months. The "proof of the pudding" for me won't be until the 2010 season officially starts.

 

[Terry]

One other point. A friend noted that by taking McNabb off the market ourselves, we may have increased the asking price for JC. If there was only one team interested in a trade, then perhaps not so, but the rumors I've seen are that there are at least 5 teams asking us about him. If the demand is there and we just reduced the supply, then expending that #37 might pay additional dividends.

 

[Jimbo]

I fully understand the move even though I can't stand McNabb. For all of you who think we may turn around and trade him away, fuhgeddaboutit! He flat out told the Iggs the ONLY team he would accept a trade to is the Skins. Sure, he didn't have a no-trade clause but he has plenty of money. He simply would have refused to report to the Raiders, Rams or Bills, essentially negating any trade. If he was leaving Philly, it would be on his terms. He wanted to play for Shanahan and he wanted a shot at the Eagles twice a year. Andy Reid wanted to give Kolb a shot and keeping Donovan around this year would have been a distraction he didn't want to deal with.

Now, with all that said, do you REALLY think we could turn around and deal Donovan to another team? Nope. Like it or not, he's our new QB now. It just remains to be seen whether or not we deal Jason Campbell alone, as part of a package deal or we simply cut him.

 

[Boone]

I agree Jimbo. You can also tell by the very nature of Shanahan's comments that, barring some unforeseen offer out of this world, he didn't make this deal in order to secure trade bait - he made it to upgrade our starting QB position.

I also think we all need to keep in mind, this is uncharted territory for McNabb. He's never been in a situation where he got the chance to start fresh, with an extremely sharp head coach, and a lot of incentive to prove he's got great things still in him. McNabb could make Shanahan and Allen look like geniuses. I think even those that don't like this move need to keep an open mind.

 

[riggins44]

Im not that opposed to it if we get something for Campbell. I would have rathered gone thru the draft but we upgrade instantly.

and to all the "older" folks on this board..what did you think an Allen would do? Like father like son...

I thought this same thing last night. Since then I've read and heard that Shanahan wanted McNabb. Allen just worked the details of the trade.

On the bright side...we gave up less then had Vinny been running things.

 

[Alaskan]

One other point. A friend noted that by taking McNabb off the market ourselves, we may have increased the asking price for JC. If there was only one team interested in a trade, then perhaps not so, but the rumors I've seen are that there are at least 5 teams asking us about him. If the demand is there and we just reduced the supply, then expending that #37 might pay additional dividends.

OR

We lowered the asking price by putting ourselves in the position where we have to get rid of him.

My guess is that Shanny thinks his running game will help McNabb just like it helped Elway. I also think it makes it less likely that we will draft a QB.

The more I think about this the more I’m warming up to it. McNabb holds the QB position together for 2-3 years, throwing to our 2 pass catching TE’s, a field stretching Moss, Parker in the Westbrook role and whatever we can get out of Thomas/Kelly. The rest of our Space Cowboy backfield gives us a decent running game. That buys us enough time to rebuild the line and fill the holes on the defense, and see if Colt has any potential. Then when a have the other pieces in place to support a rookie quarterback, we use a 1st round draft choice on one.

One the other hand, maybe I’m wrong. Maybe Danny just stomped his feet and threatened to hold his breath until he turned blue, unless he got McNabb on his fantasy team.

 

[aREDSKIN]

I really cannot understand the negative responses here. Given the just PUTRID performance of jason campbell over the past few years how can anyone complain about getting a 6 time pro bowler QB to run our O. Jason Campbell behind a line of first rounders is still horrific. This is a great move by the new admin and we will trade down to obtain more picks imo. Let it play out and see.

 

[Terry]

Alaskan, we only lowered the price we can ask IF there is no real market for Campbell, which I really don't know exists or not. But if there are 5 teams asking for him and two or more are serious, then it doesn't matter whether we have to dump him or not.

 

[Destino]

McNabb may or may not even be here come the regular season ...

Considering the reason he is in Washington to begin with is that he threatened retirement if the eagles tried to trade him somewhere else I very much doubt the skins will be packaging him as part of a trade. He's Elways 2.0 and he's here to stay.

The price we paid is enormous for a team in need of some many players. The man hasn't started 16 games often and we have an Oline group that looks like a special teams roster. The question remaining is who else is traded, what other picks are traded, and what does the starting Oline look like when the dust settles.

If we can put together a decent Oline by the start of the season (that is a huge if) than this move might pay off in the short run.

 

[McD5]

Some interesting comments from Pat Kirwin, in a live NFL chat right now. It pretty much supports what I believe--that this is the single best personnel move since Snyder took over:


Sam, I'd be disappointed if there are a lot of Redskins fans who are disappointed. This is one of the best moves the Redskins have made since Dan Snyder took over the team. Tell your friends: There are only six active QBs that have won a Super Bowl. McNabb comes in right after that. He will make your young underachieving receivers better, and you will be able to hide more subpar linemen than ever before.

Final note: I have an awful lot of Giants fans in my family that are depressed that McNabb makes the Redskins better.

http://chat.nfl.com/front/index/846

 

[McD5]

And one other note from Kirwan, in the same chat:

Albert Haynesworth was offered in the McNabb deal, but the size of his contract probably prevents it from happening. The depth of quality DTs in the draft -- Suh, McCoy, Dan Williams, Jared Odrick and Brian Price are all first-rounders -- takes away any demand for Haynseworth. Sorry Albert, but you'll be playing the nose in Washington's new 3-4 this year.

So how long before Albert throws a hissy fit, when he hears he was trade bait?

I would put the over/under at 5 pm today. He can't be happy about this. I hope he acts like a pro, and doesn't use this as motivation to simply quit on us, or to ask for a trade.

 

[Boone]

Except that one of the many players we desperately needed was a starting QB Destino - and that need is now filled for the foreseeable future (assuming we give McNabb an extension). It's true that we gave up two picks to get him. But short of operating on the assumption we were fine with Jason Campbell (and I don't hear anyone arguing that?) we were going to have to spend a first or second round pick to find a QB. So we arguably only spent a 3rd or 4th rounder getting a starter via trade vs. the draft. McNabb is also a known quantity - there would be no guarantees about a drafted QB. That counts for something.

I'd have preferred we went out and drafted a young promising stud but I can't really agree that McNabb was an expensive option. In fact, I think it's potentially a steal.

 

[Om]

Considering the reason he is in Washington to begin with is that he threatened retirement if the eagles tried to trade him somewhere else I very much doubt the skins will be packaging him as part of a trade. He's Elways 2.0 and he's here to stay.

The price we paid is enormous for a team in need of some many players. The man hasn't started 16 games often and we have an Oline group that looks like a special teams roster.

We hear what McNabb, the Eagles and Redskins want us to hear. End of the day though, money and other factors you and I don't know about determine where a player lands. Yeah Donovan will probably be here for the next 2-3 years, but we don't know that. Not today. Yesterday the idea of him being here at all was kinda silly too remember.

As to the rest, it's worth a quick look at his career stats before suggesting he's not been a horse ....

In ten seasons as starter, the man started 16 games four times, 15 games once, 14 games twice, 10 games twice and 9 games once. Haven't done the comparisons but I suspect those numbers stack up pretty well against the rest of the league's top QBs. And it's not like all the multiple-start years were early ... he's coming off three consecutive 3300+ yards seasons with 14, 16 and 14 starts respectively.

And as to the OL ... as I said previously, the team isn't done brother. The starting OL for September is not all on the roster yet. To the extent we can as fans, I really think we oughta wait and see what the overall plan is before rendering final thumbs up OR thumbs down judgment on The Trade.

 

[Alaskan]

Alaskan, we only lowered the price we can ask IF there is no real market for Campbell, which I really don't know exists or not. But if there are 5 teams asking for him and two or more are serious, then it doesn't matter whether we have to dump him or not.

I dunno It seems to me that if we were selling Campbell on EBay, we just gave up our ability to slap a minimum bid on him. Everyone knows that we are going to dump him regardless. While we did take a QB off the market (McNabb) we also took a potential buyer of Campbell's services off the market too (ourselves.)

I wouldn't be surprised if we ended up cutting him, getting nothing in return and then watch as someone signs him.

 

[servumtuum]

I started digging around other team fan forums to see what reaction there might be out there. First-this story has eclipsed everything out there-threads on it are close to this one in size 70-100 posts already, some with multiple threads. We definitely got people's attention with this.

I went to Broncos fan boards first because of their familiarity with Shanahan-three of 'em.

The general consensus among Broncos fans is-the Iggles were crazy and Shanahan's going to come out looking like a wizard-or sentiments close to that. The ratio of "this was a good move by the Skins" to "not so good" seems to be running about 5 or 6 to 1 with Broncos fans. I did hit a Vikings forum because of their supposed interest in McNabb and there it was more mixed-sour grapes perhaps. They are intrigued in the possible ramifications this could have on where the QBs may fall out in the draft since they seem very interested in a future replacement for the Ancient One. My friends at that the Packers forum seem to think the Redskins made a very sharp move-a couple of them hinted that the upcoming trip to FedEx might not be quite as much fun as they had thought.

Oh, something I've encountered everywhere. Nobody likes the Iggles.

Nobody. They don't like the FO and they think the Iggles fans are a bunch of a**holes. Denver, Minnesota, Green Bay-probably everywhere else I'm gonna look just can't stand the Iggles and especially their fans.

Can't blame 'em, actually

 

[Destino]

And as to the OL ... as I said previously, the team isn't done brother. The starting OL for September is not all on the roster yet. To the extent we can as fans, I really think we oughta wait and see what the overall plan is before rendering final thumbs up OR thumbs down judgment on The Trade.

Absolutely. It's why I qualify my statements on this trade with "if the Redskins can upgrade their OLine" or something along those lines. Shanahan isn't stupid, he knows his running game and McNabb are wasted behind an Oline that can't block well enough to work security at a Susan Boyle concert.

 

[Hog Fever]

I started digging around other team fan forums to see what reaction there might be out there. First-this story has eclipsed everything out there-threads on it are close to this one in size 70-100 posts already, some with multiple threads. We definitely got people's attention with this.

Thanks for making the rounds and saving me the trouble man. That's good intel. I was definitely curious how this was playing around the league.

I think in some cases we (as fans) might be too close to the situation to look at things objectively at first. We’ve been conditioned to hate this guy for years and it's hard to turn that off. I’m not saying that the folks who don’t like this move don’t have legitimate reasons not to like it. I just feel that with some distance the move makes more sense.

Remember last week when I was asking for more action around here? Well……

 

[Terry]

I dunno It seems to me that if we were selling Campbell on EBay, we just gave up our ability to slap a minimum bid on him. Everyone knows that we are going to dump him regardless. While we did take a QB off the market (McNabb) we also took a potential buyer of Campbell's services off the market too (ourselves.)

I wouldn't be surprised if we ended up cutting him, getting nothing in return and then watch as someone signs him.

I'd agree IF this were Ebay.

But it looks more like a game of chicken to me. Either those teams need a veteran starting QB or not. If they don't then we're hosed. But if a couple of them do, then all it takes is one team to make a move and we're good.

They can try to outbid each other by throwing cash at Campbell if we cut him, or for a 3rd, give themselves exclusive negotiating rights.

We'll see.

 

[Neophyte]

And as to the OL ... as I said previously, the team isn't done brother. The starting OL for September is not all on the roster yet. To the extent we can as fans, I really think we oughta wait and see what the overall plan is before rendering final thumbs up OR thumbs down judgment on The Trade.

Well said, brother. And I do understand all this.

My problem is that logically I don't see a legit way through the next 4 months to a point where we have two bonafide (to borrow from Boone), NFL caliber starting tackles on the line. Without them guys like Cole, Ware and Tuck are having wet dreams about two games against the Skins, regardless of whether it is McNabb or Campbell under center.

Now granted, I didn't see a way to have McNabb on the team a day ago either so lots of things are possible. Shanahan and Allen are paid big bucks to make the impossible possible. Maybe he sees more talent in some of the current guys then any of us. Maybe I am wrong in my long held belief that Buges got all there was to get out of these guys (and maybe a little more besides) and the new guys can get something going with them previously not thought possible. Maybe Hicks is more than just a career backup and we only need one T.

*shrug* I don't know.

What I do know is that there is only so much any QB can do without at least solid line play and I know I am not alone in wondering where the 5 guys are to give us that line play. I sure don't see them on our current roster and while I agree that "we aren't done yet", I see few paths through to the goal.

This is honestly more nerve racking than a close 4th qtr game. At least then you know, win, lose or draw, it will all be over before you go to bed. This is a 4 month 4th qtr.

 

[CounterTrey]

Well said, brother. And I do understand all this.

My problem is that logically I don't see a legit way through the next 4 months to a point where we have two bonafide (to borrow from Boone), NFL caliber starting tackles on the line. Without them guys like Cole, Ware and Tuck are having wet dreams about two games against the Skins, regardless of whether it is McNabb or Campbell under center.

Now granted, I didn't see a way to have McNabb on the team a day ago either so lots of things are possible. Shanahan and Allen are paid big bucks to make the impossible possible. Maybe he sees more talent in some of the current guys then any of us. Maybe I am wrong in my long held belief that Buges got all there was to get out of these guys (and maybe a little more besides) and the new guys can get something going with them previously not thought possible. Maybe Hicks is more than just a career backup and we only need one T.

*shrug* I don't know.

What I do know is that there is only so much any QB can do without at least solid line play and I know I am not alone in wondering where the 5 guys are to give us that line play. I sure don't see them on our current roster and while I agree that "we aren't done yet", I see few paths through to the goal.

This is honestly more nerve racking than a close 4th qtr game. At least then you know, win, lose or draw, it will all be over before you go to bed. This is a 4 month 4th qtr.

I'm so numb to things going into this that It's not nearly as intense as it was say 10 years ago. Couple that with the stunning nature of this move and I REALLY don't know what to make of it. I'm with ya on the line. My only problem is having been a fan of a dysfunctional, hapless franchise for so long I'm not sure I'd know a winner being built if I saw it. While on an individual basis many of these moves perplex me I can see they definitely have a plan. That alone seems an improvement. I'm going to be waiting until pre-season actually starts before I start making any conclusions at all, it's all so alien to me at this point.