Random Commanders Thoughts

Thats what Finlay seemed to imply on the 980 report.

Gruden thought the team needed pass rush help and drooled over Sweat's measurables and speed and thought he could be a difference maker.

And he could turn out to be one.

My point there is in a season where he has to win now we can start Sweat raw as he is and play Jimmy Moreland quite a bit but it would be a severe setback if Haskins had to play?

If Gruden wanted a proven rusher they should by their logic traded the pick for a veteran to go all in for 2019.

Gruden talked about the protection calls at the line of scrimmage being a potential issue for Haskins.

Ok, but last year Sean McVay had John Sullivan make the line calls to help Jared Goff early in the season.

There are ways to overcome these issues and bring the talent out if you are creative.

Gruden seems to want to be handed a capable offensive unit so that he only needs to worry about matchups and play calling.

The development of the players seems to be someone else's responsibility.

It seems clear to me that McVay was major in the development of Cousins into a starting qb.

I was happy with the Sweat pick, still am but if any rookies succeed this year it's gonna be in spite of current coaching.

Stevie Wonder could see how bad our coaching is at the moment

There is a colossal difference from being able to start right away for a QB vs DE/LB.

Bulldog said:

There are ways to overcome these issues and bring the talent out if you are creative.

Gruden seems to want to be handed a capable offensive unit so that he only needs to worry about matchups and play calling.

The development of the players seems to be someone else's responsibility.

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Bingo! It's all about the system with Gruden. Everyone on the planet but him, is too stupid to run it, that's all.

Ax said:

This is a spot we part ways on.

You know I'm not a Gruden fan. Been one of the one's calling for his head for 3+ seasons. And damn doubtful about him since his rookie year.

But in this instance, he is 100% correct. The season isn't over. And as long as he's the head coach, he should say that.
Even if he doesn't act like it on gameday.




BTW, I'm not saying your wrong, but I don't recall any reporting on this. Is this your opinion, or did you hear it said/reported somewhere?

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Let's put it this way. The competitive part of the season is over. People are playing now for roster spots and trying to look good on trade tape for next year

Sarge said:

Let's put it this way. The competitive part of the season is over. People are playing now for roster spots and trying to look good on trade tape for next year

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Statistically, our chance of making the playoffs this year is something like 5%. But I can't agree the competitive part of the season is over. I'm not giving up on an NFL season 3 games in.


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Bulldog said:

Gruden thought the team needed pass rush help and drooled over Sweat's measurables and speed and thought he could be a difference maker.

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The thought of Gruden drooling over Sweat's measureables made me giggle like a 5th grader...

I have a different perspective which obviously is at variance with the one that Dan, Bruce and Jay have.

With a team at 0-3 rather than hoping a badly outplayed and overmatched team is going to rise like Lazarus and become a contender based on hope, I would rather put the season in the hands of folks that are going to develop Haskins, Sweat, Harmon, Moreland, Quinn, Wes Martin.

I can't help it, but at heart I am a realist. You look at a situation without rose-colored glasses or in this case cloudy glasses and come to a rational and reasonable path forward to achieve your ultimate goal.

Does that mean a mid-season change for Gruden and Manusky?

Yes, and that is only part their fault. They failed to get 100% out of the players in their charge and they failed to bring younger players to the fore quickly enough in past seasons.

But in the end Dan has to admit the entire group made a mistake about 2019 being a season of contending but rather one that requires rebuilding.

Bruce in his comments was mistaken in his belief that a team finishing 7-9 with injuries in 2018 was just a few breaks here and there from being a 10-6 or 11-5 division winner.

That whole thought process has to go before there can be any real progress.

Looking at the schedule the Redskins seem outclassed by clubs like Dallas and Philly (already illustrated) as well as teams like New England and Green Bay.

Minnesota and the Buffalo Bills are teams that are better than they were last year and likely headed to winning records in 2019, if not actually being in the playoffs.

We have the Giants, Jets, Dolphins as games the Redskins can win but also can lose.

Giving the team credit for an upset along the way and beating some of the bad teams on their schedule, I see this team putting up 5 wins. And that is assuming current players remain active and on the field and don't fall to the spate of injuries we are used to seeing.

If Scherff, Roullier, McLaurin, Richardson go down this offense is done. I don't care who the qb is.

I don't see any way that the Redskins are NOT going to be picking in the top 10, even top 6.

And maybe that's not such a bad thing after all - to quote Chris Cooley - we just don't have enough 'A' level performers to be a contender right now.

And that's a member of the paid Washington Redskins broadcasts on Sunday.

Everyone from Shawn Springs to Brian Mitchell to writers following the team locally and nationally ALL see this team out of the playoffs in 2019 and having to rebuild.

As a result of some good moves in the 2019 draft and in 2018 as well perhaps this is a partial rebuild instead of the 100% rebuild we were looking at after the first 7-9 season in 2017.

But it's still a LOT of work to be done.

And the longer we ignore it and bury our head in the sand the longer it will be till we get to where we want to go.

I don't want to prove a point and win 5 games. No one remembers that.

I am willing to go 1-15 or 2-14 as Jimmy Johnson did to then have the chance to go 13-3 and win the Super Bowl.

Because once you do that the record in earlier building seasons is forgotten.

The worst thing teams do is tread water. They sit at 7-9 or 8-8 year after year like the Lions and never really advance into the top echelon.

I'm not going to come in here and gloat, looks like most are coming to the undeniable conclusion that this team is in shambles...that Gruden and Allen being fired are the only acts that will display some shift in Dan Snyder's current thought process. That by tearing down the current leadership, Snyder might see the light.

Before I posted anything after my absence, I've been lingering to see where everyone was. I have followed Bulldog's take on this team over the last couple weeks. He is absolutely correct! For the sake of the younger players, the ones who have only glimpses of the absolute cluster**k this organization has become, fire Gruden and Manusky now! Give the reigns to Callahan, let him give the play calling duties to O'Connell. On the defensive side, give Tomsula the DC role, and let him run that defense.

By doing this, players like McLaurin, and the many other young players Bulldog has mentioned, can see something other than the current pissing match between Gruden and everyone in the FO that is so poisonous. Maybe...just maybe, players like Scherff might be willing to play harder and not leave at the soonest opportunity.

The only thing I believe Bulldog has gotten wrong is the idea that Haskins can be anything other than an average at best QB in this league. What would you guys do if we ended up with the #1 pick? Rely on Haskins or draft Tua? Go with Haskins next year because realistically we won't have a shot at Tua, and hope there is a way to end up with Trevor? Over the course of the next 2 seasons, better QB's than Haskins will be entering the draft. Do we go after one of them, or rely on Haskins? ...a QB who had 3 good games in his college career, all the other wins coming against High School teams. I'm making the prediction...Dewayne Haskins is going to hold this team back for another 3 years before it becomes obvious he is not the future under center in DC.

Everything else...I refer you to Bulldog's take on the current status of this team.

Elephant said:

I'm not going to come in here and gloat, looks like most are coming to the undeniable conclusion that this team is in shambles...that Gruden and Allen being fired are the only acts that will display some shift in Dan Snyder's current thought process. That by tearing down the current leadership, Snyder might see the light.

Before I posted anything after my absence, I've been lingering to see where everyone was. I have followed Bulldog's take on this team over the last couple weeks. He is absolutely correct! For the sake of the younger players, the ones who have only glimpses of the absolute cluster**k this organization has become, fire Gruden and Manusky now! Give the reigns to Callahan, let him give the play calling duties to O'Connell. On the defensive side, give Tomsula the DC role, and let him run that defense.

By doing this, players like McLaurin, and the many other young players Bulldog has mentioned, can see something other than the current pissing match between Gruden and everyone in the FO that is so poisonous. Maybe...just maybe, players like Scherff might be willing to play harder and not leave at the soonest opportunity.

The only thing I believe Bulldog has gotten wrong is the idea that Haskins can be anything other than an average at best QB in this league. What would you guys do if we ended up with the #1 pick? Rely on Haskins or draft Tua? Go with Haskins next year because realistically we won't have a shot at Tua, and hope there is a way to end up with Trevor? Over the course of the next 2 seasons, better QB's than Haskins will be entering the draft. Do we go after one of them, or rely on Haskins? ...a QB who had 3 good games in his college career, all the other wins coming against High School teams. I'm making the prediction...Dewayne Haskins is going to hold this team back for another 3 years before it becomes obvious he is not the future under center in DC.

Everything else...I refer you to Bulldog's take on the current status of this team.

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Welcome back. I agree with most of this except the part about Haskins. Maybe It's the optimist in me. It's also hard to trust the QB analysis of a guy who preached to us years ago about Jameis Winston. How's that for a kick in the nuts

AbortionSurvivor said:

Welcome back. I agree with most of this except the part about Haskins. Maybe It's the optimist in me. It's also hard to trust the QB analysis of a guy who preached to us years ago about Jameis Winston. How's that for a kick in the nuts

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Jameis won a National Championship. I expected more, he will be exactly what I see Haskins being...average at best.

He will shine on occasion, but struggle through most of his career incapable of elevating his game to the next level.

We will never see Haskins better than what we see in Jameis Winston right now, except maybe maturity.

Haskins has the ability to change a game with his deep accurate arm.

That is something that can't be taught.

From all accounts he has a good work ethic and is fully capable of developing at the position.

I think looking ahead to future drafts is a fool's game if you have made investments at a position and haven't as of yet tried to make them pay off first.

I remember when Andy Reid drafted Mahomes at #11 and found some criticism because he had a playoff team and an established quarterback in Alex Smith. Some people thought Reid should have drafted OL help or take a corner after Marcus Peters departed.

A little more than a year later no one was asking any questions about that selection.

If I am in the organization and I think Haskins can become a top 5-7 qb why would I be looking to upgrade the next year?

You can win Super Bowls with quarterbacks in the top 15 if you surround them with the talent, forget the top 5.

Just ask Nick Foles, Joe Flacco or a one armed Peyton Manning that rode the defense to a win in 2015.

Meanwhile the other recent SB winners were Wilson and Brady, neither of which was a top pick.

Bulldog said:

If I am in the organization and I think Haskins can become a top 5-7 qb why would I be looking to upgrade the next year?

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Because he won't be a top 5-7 QB in this league. That is pure conjecture we can revisit in about 3-5 year, but I say it with the same confidence I said RG3 was a bust.

Arizona seems to have set the precedent with the Rosen trade for a better QB.

Elephant said:

Because he won't be a top 5-7 QB in this league. That is pure conjecture we can revisit in about 3-5 year, but I say it with the same confidence I said RG3 was a bust.

Arizona seems to have set the precedent with the Rosen trade for a better QB.

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Jury's still out on that.

Arizona's just as bad as we are in regards to on field product and management so I don't think they are a standard to which to aspire to.......

Funny thing about claiming to be a realist. When you claim it's over, after 3 games, There's nothing real about it.

In reality, anything can happen. 50yrs of watching the NFL has shown that, time and again. That's an unquestionable, fact.

Now, stages of likelihood abound. You can "best guess it". Or, "all signs point to..." etc...

It ain't over until it's over, is more realist than Droopy's never-ending cry of, "We're doomed".

If we ever do turn the corner, I fear many fans will need therapy to help them stop reflexively being negative. They won't be able to function, not having anything real, or imagined, to bitch about.

Predicting the Redskins will suck year after year and that nothing - EVER - will work out for them does not make anyone Nostradamus.

I am not buying the Winston-Haskins comparison. These are two unique individuals. There may be some physical similarities as well as style of play. But the mental game is huge at the NFL level. We have no idea who Haskins is yet. I've already noted that the descriptions of Haskins as 'inaccurate under pressure' and 'immobile' look to be offbase. The comparison also ignores that whether or not QBs thrive or fail is also highly dependent on the team and coaching staff in place around them. In that regard, I'd say Haskins (like Winston) looks doomed currently. But that could change.

Elephant said:

Arizona seems to have set the precedent with the Rosen trade for a better QB.

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Sorry El, I couldn't disagree with this statement more. Arizona just set the precedent for making incredibly stupid front office moves, and that's saying something considering the Redskins are also in the NFL with them.

Drafting back-to-back first round QBs is not something any competent front office would ever do. It's going to set that team back years. (anyone else notice Murray is on pace to take 85 sacks this year? Holy Moses) If Haskins was a bad pick, we should never have drafted him in the first place. But he's here now, and we need to see what we have in him. Ditching him after one year of bench-riding would be incredibly damaging to the franchise.

Personally, I suspect if Haskins doesn't work out here it will be because this team is incredibly disfunctional, and not because Haskins is a good or bad player. We are already setting him up to fail, having him ride the bench for dead-man-walking Gruden and then having to start over with a new coach next year who may or may not like him. This team is a mess, but Haskins is the least of our worries right now. Giving up on him after a preseason and a few games ... that would just make things worse.

I am a realist because a team starting out 0-3 that has these statistics of being dominated have a 4% chance of making the playoffs.

And by the ‘playoffs' I assume we are talking about an unlikely rebound to an outside 8-8 type record that somehow qualifies because of meltdowns by other clubs?

Frankly I would not order my life and career on a 4% chance of being 8-8 and riding a comet to the playoffs.

What I WOULD be doing is looking around to see the organizations that are successful and try to model my team on their processes.

As part of that we need to admit who on the current roster we are treading water with and seeing declining performances and work to get them off the team.

As Jimmy Johnson told several veterans in Dallas:

If I can lose with you, I can lose without you.

I would not be afraid to make some moves.

Why keep players to help us go 5-11?

Bill Parcells took a 1-15 team he inherited to 9-7 the following season.

It's clear Gruden doesn't have these kinds of leadership skills.

Forget the fact Parcells could find budget players that would go through a wall for the organization.

If this team is 0-5 or 1-4 after the Pats game we should give Norman his release.

Another player that seems to be taking up a roster spot is Jeremy Sprinkle.

He can't block and has questionable hands. Why is he here in Year 3 after being drafted? He still can't be counted on as a regular contributor, time to move on. He is replacement level.

The Redskins are having trouble stopping the inside running game. Perhaps we can move Ryan Anderson inside to provide better size and tackling ability there.

It's better than lining him out wide and hoping he somehow learns how to rush the passer as an OLB in the 3-4 where he lacks the athletic skills.

We need to clean ****ing house. New GM, new coaches, and as BD stated, drop anyone who is not contributing. In the offseason, I would try to trade or release (at a minimum) the following guys:

Norman
Kerrigan
Robert Davis
Vernon Davis
Sprinkle (unless he shows major improvement down the stretch)
Christian
Bergstrom
Moses
McCoy
Peterson
Apke
I'd also thin the LB and Corner ranks. We can't cut them all in one offseason but the guys who haven't been able to stay on the field or perform to expectations need to go.

I'm all for going young, young, young. We may be in a position to have a roster-shifting draft next year if we play our cards right. Time to finish the rebuild.

Henry said:

Sorry El, I couldn't disagree with this statement more. Arizona just set the precedent for making incredibly stupid front office moves, and that's saying something considering the Redskins are also in the NFL with them.

Drafting back-to-back first round QBs is not something any competent front office would ever do. It's going to set that team back years. (anyone else notice Murray is on pace to take 85 sacks this year? Holy Moses) If Haskins was a bad pick, we should never have drafted him in the first place. But he's here now, and we need to see what we have in him. Ditching him after one year of bench-riding would be incredibly damaging to the franchise.

Personally, I suspect if Haskins doesn't work out here it will be because this team is incredibly disfunctional, and not because Haskins is a good or bad player. We are already setting him up to fail, having him ride the bench for dead-man-walking Gruden and then having to start over with a new coach next year who may or may not like him. This team is a mess, but Haskins is the least of our worries right now. Giving up on him after a preseason and a few games ... that would just make things worse.

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But that's where you're wrong Henry. I was a huge proponent of what seemed like a blunder on their part to draft a QB in the 1st round, again. But you know what they did, they got all new leadership, decided that Murray was the direction they wanted to go with Kingsbury who ran a scheme Rosen was unfit to run. Then they ended up getting the Dolphins 2nd round pick, which looks like it will be the 1st pick in the 2nd round, on top of a later round pick to compensate them for the lost 1st rounder.


After watching 2 of Arizona's first 3 games of this season, and admitting it is a limited example, they are a far better team this year with Kyler Murray behind center, than they were with Rosen last year. So under new leadership who wanted to go in another direction, that's a push without playing a game to see Murray's potential on the field. Now that we've seen the kid is rather dynamic, looks a lot like Russell Wilson in his 1st season with Seattle, I'd say it was a bold move that looks like it will bear fruit.

That's what I'd like to see here, a whole new change in leadership from Allen down every single coach on either side of the ball, unless they choose to keep O'Connell who seems to be another young brilliant mind. And if that leadership decides to go with another QB because Haskins isn't their guy, I'm fine with it...in fact, I hope for it.

Boone said:

I would try to trade or release (at a minimum) the following guys:

Norman
Kerrigan
Robert Davis
Vernon Davis
Sprinkle (unless he shows major improvement down the stretch)
Christian
Bergstrom
Moses
McCoy
Peterson
Apke
.

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Add Jordan Reed to that list.