The Sky is not Falling Thread

[Die Hard]

Yeah Suter who does Sheehan's film reviews keeps insisting they should start Coleman at RT.

The O line right now ranked 7th by PFF. I agree with this:

I think I saw the graph that put our O-line at 7th.... but I'm pretty sure that's in pass blocking efficiency. But in that chart - I saw it on Reddit - Washington's 0-line run blocking efficiency is among the 5 worst in the NFL. I saw it about a week ago... but I'm not digging for it.

 

[skinsinparadise]

I think I saw the graph that put our O-line at 7th.... but I'm pretty sure that's in pass blocking efficiency. But in that chart - I saw it on Reddit - Washington's 0-line run blocking efficiency is among the 5 worst in the NFL. I saw it about a week ago... but I'm not digging for it.

Run blocking 19th on PFF right now.

 

[skinsinparadise]

Keep in mind to as to O line grades.

The initial lineup
A. Coleman struggled big time at LG. Some now think he is better at tackle.
B. Allegretti was atrocious at RG
C. Conerly started with a murders row as a rookie adjusting to a new spot.

Things are trending up big time from that point.

 

[skinsinparadise]

Definitely true, but one caveat is if we end up being very predictable on playcalling -- even great OL cannot withstand that very well. It depends on what kind of rush structure there is, but generally (especially against PHI style) if they know what you are going to do, you are toast. OL can't stop it in that case. Especially with those DBs (in passing situations).

I am relatively high on Kliff. So lol I am the wrong guy on that point. No Terry for a good chunk of the season, no Noah, no Jayden. Scrubs off the street playing WR. Yet they are middle of the pack or close to it in a number of offensive categories with arguably the worst talent in the NFL as to who has played.

Joe Whitt on the other hand who I didn't care for last season let alone this one -- didn't get more out of less.

 

[skinsinparadise]

 

[Bulldog]

IMO Washington can get back to 9-8 or even 10-7 in 2026 if several things go our way:

1. We are able to capitalize on high draft position to add star talent or trade down and make impact selections with those picks.

2. We smartly use free agency and avoid going the trade route to add talent as Peters has largely done up to now. I give a pass on Tunsil as LT is a must have position. But Lattimore and Deebo play positions you can draft or sign for.

3. Quinn rationalizes the strategy of how the team is going to employ Daniels for his longevity in the league and make certain that he is not our leading ground threat in 2026.

4. Fix the bloody defense. This unit is an embarrassment. The DL is the worst in the conference. Payne needs to go. We need more youth and speed at linebacker. Amos is looking to be a keeper at corner. Safety is another position the team can never seem to solidify either through draft or free agency. That needs to change.

 

[method man]

IMO Washington can get back to 9-8 or even 10-7 in 2026 if several things go our way:

1. We are able to capitalize on high draft position to add star talent or trade down and make impact selections with those picks.

2. We smartly use free agency and avoid going the trade route to add talent as Peters has largely done up to now. I give a pass on Tunsil as LT is a must have position. But Lattimore and Deebo play positions you can draft or sign for.

3. Quinn rationalizes the strategy of how the team is going to employ Daniels for his longevity in the league and make certain that he is not our leading ground threat in 2026.

4. Fix the bloody defense. This unit is an embarrassment. The DL is the worst in the conference. Payne needs to go. We need more youth and speed at linebacker. Amos is looking to be a keeper at corner. Safety is another position the team can never seem to solidify either through draft or free agency. That needs to change.

On #4, how many players do we have that we would be excited to see start on D next year? Luvu & Amos? I guess Kinlaw and Dorance (pending knee health) too

 

[Bulldog]

Yep, 4 or 5 guys out of the 26 on that side of the ball.

On offense I think we have an OL if we get Tunsil resigned and Conerly makes the leap in Year 2 after his move to RT.

We need another starting WR and a TE if Sinnott and Yankoff don’t show they can contribute in passing game.

But there’s a LOT more to do on defense.

There is no Tunsil or Daniels in the front seven.

Payne is a name only. Ditto for Lattimore and Wagner. These guys are done as top level performers in the NFL.

I would also consider moving Sainristil outside permanently and bring in a coach to work with both he and Trey so we get the most out of them.

Less than impressed with the defensive staff Quinn has assembled.

 

[SkinsNumberOne]

I am relatively high on Kliff. So lol I am the wrong guy on that point. No Terry for a good chunk of the season, no Noah, no Jayden. Scrubs off the street playing WR. Yet they are middle of the pack or close to it in a number of offensive categories with arguably the worst talent in the NFL as to who has played.

Joe Whitt on the other hand who I didn't care for last season let alone this one -- didn't get more out of less.

I know there is worse than Kingsbury but ignoring his obvious playcalling issues? A lot of you guys are putting your heads in the sand here. Let's acknowledge his playcalling issues, they seem too obvious to ignore at this point. I know a few of us are saying this, but I don't see how it's not nearly 100% agreement by now.

I will reiterate here- DQ has expressed a different opinion to Kliff. He has talked about how they need to dedicate to the run even if it gets 1-3 yards. He said it last year and he is saying it this year. Why? Kliff is doing the same thing again.

Literally as I am writing this:
CRod a huge part of getting down to the 3 yard line, 2nd and goal.

2 passes.

Very predictable from Kliff.

Incomplete. Big momentum shift following the fumble. Their defense has to feel good.

Commanders are the NFL worst at opening drive points on the season with 13. Even with an injured team, playing LV, NYG twice, a bad Dallas defense at the time we played them… now great field position today/no Jalen Carter/having good success on the ground.

16 points.

^^ not saying Kliff is the worst OC in the league but he has obvious issues at this point.

 

[NoCalSkins]

I am not sure if the Ben Sinnott question mark is purely a fan thing or what because after the Ertz injury, the fact that he hasn't been a lot more integrated into the pass offense, especially with a back up and now 3rd string QB out there, tells me the coaches are ready to turn the page on any hope of him becoming a TE1. It looks to the eye that anytime he does get thrown the ball he has some ability, he hardly goes down at first contact, and even can truck defenders, but he is just not seeming to get the opportunities to make any worthwhile impact.

 

[Faithful Fan]

I am not sure if the Ben Sinnott question mark is purely a fan thing or what because after the Ertz injury, the fact that he hasn't been a lot more integrated into the pass offense, especially with a back up and now 3rd string QB out there, tells me the coaches are ready to turn the page on any hope of him becoming a TE1. It looks to the eye that anytime he does get thrown the ball he has some ability, he hardly goes down at first contact, and even can truck defenders, but he is just not seeming to get the opportunities to make any worthwhile impact.

Sinnott also catches it when it’s thrown his way. I don’t think he has ever had a drop.

His lack of opportunities is the most puzzling thing to me. It sort of made sense when Ertz was the ahead of him, but why not give him a shot now? The only explanations I can see are the coaches are idiots or he sucks.

 

[burgold]

One of the odder things the commentators said yesterday was that the coaches wanted to use a lot of 3 linebacker sets so they could get Magee on the field. Maybe I get wanting to to get Wagner his 2,000 tackles, but otherwise, there is no reason if you want to see Magee out there you just don't put him out there. Same thing with Sinnott. Who cares what the "normal" string looks like or if Bates is number 2? Time to give the young guys some run and see if they're worth our time.

 

[DWinzit]

One of the odder things the commentators said yesterday was that the coaches wanted to use a lot of 3 linebacker sets so they could get Magee on the field. Maybe I get wanting to to get Wagner his 2,000 tackles, but otherwise, there is no reason if you want to see Magee out there you just don't put him out there. Same thing with Sinnott. Who cares what the "normal" string looks like or if Bates is number 2? Time to give the young guys some run and see if they're worth our time.

Do preach brother Burgold!!!

There are quite a few of us who have been saying this. It seemed like DQ heard us when he talked about these young guys more involved a couple weeks ago in a presser

 

[skinsinparadise]

I know there is worse than Kingsbury but ignoring his obvious playcalling issues? A lot of you guys are putting your heads in the sand here. Let's acknowledge his playcalling issues, they seem too obvious to ignore at this point. I know a few of us are saying this, but I don't see how it's not nearly 100% agreement by now.

I will reiterate here- DQ has expressed a different opinion to Kliff. He has talked about how they need to dedicate to the run even if it gets 1-3 yards. He said it last year and he is saying it this year. Why? Kliff is doing the same thing again.

Literally as I am writing this:
CRod a huge part of getting down to the 3 yard line, 2nd and goal.

2 passes.

Very predictable from Kliff.

Incomplete. Big momentum shift following the fumble. Their defense has to feel good.

Commanders are the NFL worst at opening drive points on the season with 13. Even with an injured team, playing LV, NYG twice, a bad Dallas defense at the time we played them… now great field position today/no Jalen Carter/having good success on the ground.

16 points.

^^ not saying Kliff is the worst OC in the league but he has obvious issues at this point.

I hear you. Your point seems to be he's not the worst but a bottom rung coordinator. And the league talking about him as a HC candidate because of his playcalling are fools. And its so obvious that anyone should see it.

I don't feel that way. I did feel that way about Whitt, though who I did think was bottom of the barrell. Kliff's not my favorite offensive coordinator but he's IMO above average. Almost all of these offensive coordinators have tendendies that can be exploited though.

I just googled Sean McVay who I think is the best play caller with the word predictable and a bunch of fans whether on reddit and elsehwere were complaining about his predictability.

I don't care about micro stats so much on offense like first possession stuff. If I cared about any stat like that it would be red zone where they are ranked third best in the NFL.

For a team that has played with crap talent on offense for most of the season and even the rare times they are fully healthy, they basically got one weapon who threatens a defense, playing with basically a backup QB or banged up starter for most of the season -- yet the offense is OK, tough for me to be that mad at Kliff.

I am not mad at Kliff about the offense. I am mad at Peters.

 

[Boone]

Yeah, I doubt any NFL peers would characterize Kingsbury as a weak OC or even 'predictable'. I suspect they would tell you he's a very talented and creative OC. The problem with criticizing playcalling is that it is highly dependent on who is available. For decades we have criticized coaches because they didn't build offenses or defenses to take advantage of the available roster talent. All coaches have 'systems' and 'philosophy' which drives a lot of what they try to design and do. But when your roster is constantly changing and most of your playmakers (including the most important one of all) aren't available, you do the best you can to call plays the guys who are still standing can execute with some degree of success.

As fans, we may hate 'excuses' like a season with an epic number of injuries, but we probably need to cut the coaching staff at least a little slack in our assessments. It's just reality in the NFL, coaching can only get you so far. Ultimately it's about the guys on the field, and in that regard 2025 just wasn't our year.

 

[burgold]

Strangely, the game against NY and the Eagles convinced me that the sky is not falling.

This year has certainly been one of football tragedy, but we stood toe to toe with the Giants, the Broncos, and the Eagles. It took all the willpower and second chance phantom calls the refs could muster for the Eagles just to stay in the game. When the dam broke it broke in a bad way, but even as injured and depleted as we can still compete. Just the return of a few of our injured (Harris and McLaurin) was enough to put us back in the fight. Now, it probably helps that I wrote off this year a while ago so any signs of life are a pleasant surprise, but I weirdly feel much more optimistic about the near future than it seems most on the board do. I mean, yeah, it's clear we need different edge rushers and more help at wide receiver and tight end, but we will be getting troops back who might be enough by themselves to flip the script. Already, the narrative has changed (for me) from god-awful to bad and I can imagine that the step from there to pretty good isn't that far off.

 

[Boone]

I agree to an extent burgold. I'm not ridiculously negative about the future either.

I think the overall angst and doom and gloom (which is understandable) is the result of several things:

1. Our history. We are used to having our hopes dashed, having a season once in a blue moon where we get fooled into thinking things are changing, only to crash back to earth with horrible reality.

2. The failure to address the defense coaching situation in a more timely aggressive way. Yes - Joe Whitt Jr. gets a little bit of a pass like the rest of the coaching staff due to the ridiculous injuries he's had to navigate, but I think it was clear fairly early on that he might be in over his head, and I believe Quinn waited way too long to do something to right the ship.

3. Dan Quinn in a really bad season sounds and looks a lot like Ron Rivera. He is full of platitudes, nonsensical (to me) talk of 'hitting our marks' and 'spaces' and 'learning and growing-isms'... his schtick definitely sounds a lot like Ron Rivera's at times. But I think he is a far better coach than Ron Rivera ever was. I think Quinn is actually capable of learning from mistakes, I think he is highly respected by his fellow coaches and our players, and I think in a season where we experience just the usual level of injuries and bad luck, he is a winning HC.

I still think, particularly with Jayden Daniels on this roster, the team has a bright future, at least by Washington definitions.

 

[burgold]

Yeah, the Whitt problem is a problem. He got a mulligan for an awful year in 2024 because the team did so darn well and we all discounted some of our woes due to personnel. Then this year, we trotted out a team designed to a degree to address the bigger problems. Bigger lineman to stop the runs. Moving Mike back to his "natural" position at nickel and drafting Amos, etc. Now, no one can argue that the injury bug didn't impact the D, too, but you can see with a group as or more injured than the one Whitt started with the defense is better with Quinn behind the joystick. It is no longer a humiliation. Right now, I'd probably rank it as below average which is a huge step forward.

I think where this team fell apart is that they were so fixated on stopping the run and so sure in their belief that they could manufacture pass rush without pass rushers that they created a weakness impossible to overcome. Yesterday, Hurts had an hour to throw the ball. The pass rush was never going to get there and if it ever got close, he just ran for a first down. That's personnel. We need better athletes in the front seven.

All that being said, Whitt was not only bad he was bad enough to lose the team. The effort out there when he was calling plays seemed worse. What we saw were whole games like the fourth quarter against the Eagles.

So, the sky can be propped up by a combo of better coaching, but it also needs better personnel. I don't think we're many steps removed from expecting an "average" defense. We saw that for much of the game yesterday with a unit pretty much devoid of talent. The question is, how will they address it and how much will they take advantage of the excuse of injuries to go with the status quo?

 

[Boone]

Our D is slow. That is the kiss of death for an NFL defense. You don't realize just how slow we are until you see a guy like Jordan Magee out there. That has got to change.

 

[Chris]

I think as to ‘overall angst and doom and gloom’ goes my #1 would be that nearly every fan (if not every fan) bought fully into last years magical season as a true indication of the state of the team going forward. An easy schedule, fortuitous lack of ordinary injuries, a lot of luck, and one magical finish got the best of us. This season was a reverse mirror to last year’s.

As I have previously stated ad nauseam, last season’s team what not as good as it seemed. This season’s team, considering the circumstances, is not as bad as it seems. Players didn’t suddenly forget how to play, coaches didn’t suddenly forget how to coach.

If I had to point to one factor that I have a bone to pick with it would be the roster decisions during the offseason. This team clearly needed, and still needs, to add some top-line talent and outside of Tunsil I don’t think they did.

I hope that the front office didn’t fall for the same trap that the fans did.