Random Commanders Thoughts

[Bulldog]

Jones came out of college with the question of how far he would go and how fast.

Some draftniks had him as a #5 or #6 pick because of how raw he was.

Some questioned his instincts as a rusher and said he was a great athlete but not yet a good football player.

McCloughan disagreed and actually said he considered taking him in Round 2.

What I saw was a guy that wasn't prepared mentally to play in the NFL.

Unlike Crowder and Smith who came on as the season progressed, Jones never stopped looking like a rookie.

 

[McD5]

Reports are saying that the Jets passed on Robert, and that he just left Cleveland after a visit today.

 

[Miles Monroe]

I think you guys are misreading me. I never even hinted about keeping him or anything else. Dallas had an off year last season with their O line. Loss of their coach, and injuries had their line on the ropes. Once Romo got clobbered again, teams could just stack the box, and make them play a one dimensional game. People forget pretty quickly just how good they were running the ball two seasons ago. Odds are that they'll begin the season with a solid O line again. As it's been said, a good back will produce behind a good line..... Morris doesn't need to be a star, he needs to move the chains...

When I say he'll make us look stupid, it's as in running over our defenders, not that we were stupid to let him go. Our run D hasn't been a real strong point, and with all the turn over we'll have on the D line this season, can anybody say with any certainty just how good we'll be against the run ? I have faith our front office will get it figured out in time, but I think Dallas was a bit closer to figuring it out. I expect their run game to be greatly improved. As of this minute, I can't say the same about our run D.

 

[Boone]

What do you base your 'odds are' 'they'll be a a great OL again' prediction on? The media hyped the *great* Dallas OL up beyond reason. Are they a GREAT OL? If so, what happened in 2015? I think their 'greatness' is in question. Was last year the outlier, or maybe the year before?

I don't care how we 'look', or whether the pundits say we made a 'stupid decision'. I care about whether we make stupid decisions. After watching Almo struggle his ass off for two seasons to be a starting quality NFL RB, I don't think moving on from him is some monumentally unjustifiable decision.

 

[Fear The Spear]

Jones never stopped looking like a rookie.

I attribute him "looking like a rookie", to the fact that he actually was a rookie. Nothing terribly unusual about that, at all.
I would only be concerned if he continued looking like a rookie, after ceasing to be an actual rookie.

 

[McD5]

I think Alf can do pretty well in Dallas as a backup. Run DMC went over 1,000 yards last season and he only started nine games. They could just use him late in games to run out the clock and limit his wear and tear.

He might also be a decent fit replacing Blount in New England. Again, limited carries in a RBBC capacity.

If he really wants to start, Seattle might be his best shot. They are actually a ZB team. Now he would likely begin as a backup to Rawls, but he might even have a chance to become a starter in time.

 

[Miles Monroe]

What do you base your 'odds are' 'they'll be a a great OL again' prediction on? The media hyped the *great* Dallas OL up beyond reason. Are they a GREAT OL? If so, what happened in 2015? I think their 'greatness' is in question. Was last year the outlier, or maybe the year before?

I don't care how we 'look', or whether the pundits say we made a 'stupid decision'. I care about whether we make stupid decisions. After watching Almo struggle his ass off for two seasons to be a starting quality NFL RB, I don't think moving on from him is some monumentally unjustifiable decision.

Where did I say they would be a great line again. Hell, I never even said they were great. I said I expected the line to be solid at the beginning of the season, and I'm basing that on them being solid in 2014. No media hype, just a young line that did a dam good job under a good line coach. In 2015.... lost coach, injuries..... starting QB gone..... I also said I expected their run game to be greatly improved. I base that on the fact they will have Romo under center again, who is mobile enough to help the line as they develop as a group, and loosen up the D for the running game.

Who said getting rid of Morris was a stupid decision ? I'm basing what I never said on the shooting pain in my left nut that is making my vision blurry. Of course, the pain could be due to a slip of foot while getting on me motorcycle, and squashing the boys on the fuel tank this morning, and the Johnny Walker Blue label could well be the blurry vision

 

[Boone]

Where did I say they would be a great line again. Hell, I never even said they were great. I said I expected the line to be solid at the beginning of the season, and I'm basing that on them being solid in 2014. No media hype, just a young line that did a dam good job under a good line coach. In 2015.... lost coach, injuries..... starting QB gone..... I also said I expected their run game to be greatly improved. I base that on the fact they will have Romo under center again, who is mobile enough to help the line as they develop as a group, and loosen up the D for the running game.

Who said getting rid of Morris was a stupid decision ? I'm basing what I never said on the shooting pain in my left nut that is making my vision blurry. Of course, the pain could be due to a slip of foot while getting on me motorcycle, and squashing the boys on the fuel tank this morning, and the Johnny Walker Blue label could well be the blurry vision

Okay - sorry if I'm overstating your position - but you are backpedaling pretty fast from the Redskins 'looking silly' for releasing him Pete. I'm just arguing that there's no real reason for Redskins fans to worry about THIS front office 'looking silly' as compared to our many truly silly front offices of the past Sorry to jump on you. You know I love you more than this team

 

[Goaldeje]

Well, I will say it. I am concerned that releasing Morris will make us look silly. Not because Scot doesn't know what he's doing, but because I'm not sure there is a back out there who can fit Gruden's scheme for a rushing attack. Mainly because I'm not sure he has a scheme for a rushing attack.

A third round pick is pretty high for a RB these days. If I were Scot, I'd be pretty damned hesitant to pick any RB higher than the 6th round at this point unless an unbelievable value dropped for some reason. Gruden did outstanding work with Kirk last season, but I considering Alfred regressed as soon as Gruden took the helm, and the guy who was touted as being better then Alfred looked worse, or charitably, the same as Alfred, if I'm Scot, Gruden needs to prove he has any semblance of what a rushing attack should look like before I invest in it again.

We can keep blaming Alfred if we want, that's fine. But I won't be a whit surprised if our running game continues to struggle and Morris goes elsewhere and has a fine season.

 

[McD5]

2012 1,613 yards 13 TDs 4.8 YPC
2013 1,275 yards 7 TDs 4.6 YPC
2014 1,074 yards 8 TDs 4.1 YPC
2015 751 yards 1 TD 3.7 YPC

That's a pretty clear pattern. Could Scot even justify re-signing a guy who had 751 yards and 1 TD in a contract year? I suppose he could if we completely changed course and replaced our O-line, and then we went back to the RO with our QB.

In the bigger picture, I wonder if those in the horse and buggy business had similar concerns when cars were invented.

Last season, Denver had a few more rushing yards than we did and they won the SB.

New England had fewer rushing yards than we did and they nearly made the SB.

The most rushing yards last season? Buffalo.

Like New England and Denver, I trust Scot is more focused on defense and the passing game, and less focused on how to increase sales of our horse and buggy line.

 

[TomE]

Tandler has a nice little perspective on our current free agency path and the future of the team under Scot.

It will certainly be interesting over the next few to see how this team shapes up.

'Football' players with actual cap management will be a first for this team since when, the early 90's?

The contract structures don't seem to be of the sell-the-farm variety for the FA's brought in.

Haven't seen an over abundance of restructuring that hamstrings the future cap either(so far).


Don't know if Scot is 'saving' for the specific players mentioned but the gist of the blurb makes sense.


Are the Redskins saving their cap dollars for 2017? | Rich Tandler's Real Redskins

 

[Boone]

Well, I will say it. I am concerned that releasing Morris will make us look silly. Not because Scot doesn't know what he's doing, but because I'm not sure there is a back out there who can fit Gruden's scheme for a rushing attack. Mainly because I'm not sure he has a scheme for a rushing attack.

A third round pick is pretty high for a RB these days. If I were Scot, I'd be pretty damned hesitant to pick any RB higher than the 6th round at this point unless an unbelievable value dropped for some reason. Gruden did outstanding work with Kirk last season, but I considering Alfred regressed as soon as Gruden took the helm, and the guy who was touted as being better then Alfred looked worse, or charitably, the same as Alfred, if I'm Scot, Gruden needs to prove he has any semblance of what a rushing attack should look like before I invest in it again.

We can keep blaming Alfred if we want, that's fine. But I won't be a whit surprised if our running game continues to struggle and Morris goes elsewhere and has a fine season.

First of all 'blaming Alfred'? That's not an accurate characterization of any posts I've read. Morris is responsible to a large degree for his production just like every player in the NFL. Does that mean he has to do it alone or can be expected to do it alone? Probably not. Obviously you are right that the scheme and support around him is hugely important. I haven't seen anyone posting that doesn't get that.

The funny thing is, the arguments and hand-wringing over this move are very similar to what we heard when the team moved on from Griffin. His backup was flawed, unproven, and probably a less gifted player. The team was making a monumental error. He would make us regret it when he moved on and became a star elsewhere.

So far, it's that argument that sounds silly, not the team's decision.

Will that prove to be true with Almo? I don't know. I just don't understand the selective McCloughan support.

 

[Elephant]

Well, I will say it. I am concerned that releasing Morris will make us look silly. Not because Scot doesn't know what he's doing, but because I'm not sure there is a back out there who can fit Gruden's scheme for a rushing attack. Mainly because I'm not sure he has a scheme for a rushing attack.

A third round pick is pretty high for a RB these days. If I were Scot, I'd be pretty damned hesitant to pick any RB higher than the 6th round at this point unless an unbelievable value dropped for some reason. Gruden did outstanding work with Kirk last season, but I considering Alfred regressed as soon as Gruden took the helm, and the guy who was touted as being better then Alfred looked worse, or charitably, the same as Alfred, if I'm Scot, Gruden needs to prove he has any semblance of what a rushing attack should look like before I invest in it again.

We can keep blaming Alfred if we want, that's fine. But I won't be a whit surprised if our running game continues to struggle and Morris goes elsewhere and has a fine season.

There are 2 RB's that will likely go in the 1st round this year. Not sure why you are putting such a low premium on RB's. Not everyone is getting 4 years out of a 6th round draft pick at RB.

And I just don't get the idea that Matt Jones looked worse than Morris. Yes, there were fumbling issues, so I guess we can use that criteria. Yes he was injured so I guess we can use that one too. However, when in the game, Jones was much more apt to hit the same holes that Morris missed, without hesitation like Morris. He showed he could get around the edge, unlike Morris this past season. He caught passes out of the backfield better than Morris. And he certainly had break away speed as witnessed on at least a couple long TD runs, unlike Morris.

Morris was a great character and back for us for 2 years, I am not sure I buy into the struggle in season 3 as Boone does, but if you are incapable of seeing that Alfred Morris' ability declined dramatically this year, not because of any scheme he was running, but simply his personal performance, I just wonder.

 

[McD5]

So far, it's that argument that sounds silly, not the team's decision.

Will that prove to be true with Almo? I don't know. I just don't understand the selective McCloughan support.

It's not selective McLovin support. I'd guess it's more of a consistent hate for Gruden that lingers within a small portion of our fan base that is still upset with Gruden for verbally undressing RG3.

Which in itself is very ironic. We are very thick-skinned when it comes to our own team name, and expecting everyone else around the league to not be offended.

But God forbid our HC verbally corrects our QB, then benches him and wins the division. The horror!

That portion of fans still incorrectly (in my opinion) blames the fall of RG3 more on Gruden than on Shanahan playing him injured or his own performance.

 

[Ax]

You mean like the selective support/nonsupport of re-signing McRib?

Look, coaches have every right, and responsibility, to sink or swim with the guys they want playing.

Gruden appears, to me anyway, to be a devoted "system guy". His system. And that's fine. My first preference is for an adaptable coach. I don't know what goes on behind the scenes, nor should I. But he doesn't appear to have anything that resembles a "plan B" in his playbook.

As to Alfred's stats that McD posted, they definitely show a steady regression. However, were I to use the ole cherry picker too, the most significant dropoff in YPC, came under Wonder Boy. That's the fact. I don't think someone believing it's more due to the coaching/scheme carries any less weight that those believing it more due to Alfred.

Career history on guys like Morris, and Griffin hasn't been written yet. Except by those who see there position as being currently correct.
Time will tell.

 

[Ax]

It's not selective McLovin support. I'd guess it's more of a consistent hate for Gruden that lingers within a small portion of our fan base that is still upset with Gruden for verbally undressing RG3.

Which in itself is very ironic. We are very thick-skinned when it comes to our own team name, and expecting everyone else around the league to not be offended.

But God forbid our HC verbally corrects our QB, then benches him and wins the division. The horror!

That portion of fans still incorrectly (in my opinion) blames the fall of RG3 more on Gruden than on Shanahan playing him injured or his own performance.

In light of the boards civility request, a proper response to this continued bullshit from you is quite impossible.

 

[Boone]

That's a nice counter Ax - touche' - but the difference is, you don't hear me predicting the downfall of the Redskins because of the decision. Everyone here has the right to applaud or critique whatever they want - obviously. I don't understand what McCloughan and/or Gruden see in McRib. But ultimately I figure they most know something we don't. I'm not going as far as McD5 just did. But I do see a trend where moves that fans 'love' are attributed to McLovin, and moves they 'hate' are all about Gruden. And you'll notice that I questioned what McLovin is thinking with LeRibeus, not Gruden - because I know ultimately its Scot that is driving the player/talent decisions.

Ultimately with Almo, I think we are arguing about the wrong things. It's really not about Almo's talent level, work ethic, or whether or not he'll torch us down the road or be a star on another team. It's about whether he's a good fit for this offense. You said it well - the dropoff in production that is inarguable and dramatic may be as much about the Gruden offense as it is Almo. But where I push back is that this means Gruden's offense cannot be effective on the ground. There's 2 years of evidence though that it can't be effective with Almo carrying the ball.

 

[McD5]

The Browns reportedly continue to have interest in RG3. "Sources" say they are calling other teams to ask about his character.

Browns are making calls to gather info about Robert Griffin III | ProFootballTalk

Prior to getting Hue Jackson as a coach, Cleveland would have been a nightmare situation for any QB. If Robert ends up there, hopefully Hue can turn it around quickly.

Edit: I'll put these in the NFL forum in the future. Old habits die hard.

 

[Boone]

I just posted something similar in the Random NFL Thoughts thread. It's still a terrible landing spot for Griffin - because he'd start there and I think what he really needs is a season or two to work and learn before getting thrown into the pressure of a starting role. And Cleveland is a revolving door for HCs and OCs - so it's highly likely he'd be starting over in a couple years with a new regime.

 

[McD5]

I agree. I was talking to BB about this the other day, and actually ran a twitter poll asking the following:

If you were RG3, and ended up unsigned at the start of the NFL season, would you:

A. Just continue to train and wait for someone to get hurt?
B. Go play in the CFL for a season?

The votes were split 50/50.

Signing with Cleveland might be his third option.