How down on Ron Rivera are you?

[Chris]

Well, Ron’s teams are competitive…in the middle of seasons.

 

[Rhino-Rhino]

I feel like as with many coaches the game is passing him by . He hasn't had a winning season since 2017
2022- 8-8-1
2021-7-10
2020- 7-9
2019- (Carolina) -5-7 (fired )
2018- (Carolina)-7-9
2017- finally his last winning season -11-5
Not much to be excited about with those numbers .I think his giant mistake was taking the same people with him from Carolina and thinking they could create magic here in DC .I think he's loyal to a point where it can hurt you

 

[DixieFlatline]

I'm kind of medium on Ron. I'm not calling for his head, but I also wouldn't be disappointed if he retired or was fired. The team has been competitive in his three seasons, but also hasn't been much of a threat. They have the occasional upset and surprise win. But overall, it's been mediocre with more frustration than enjoyment as a fan. I don't see that really improving too much, but it could. I fully expect the new owner to bring in his own guys unless 2023 turns into a huge success on the field.

Which brings me to something I was thinking about as I was listening to the podcast. There are some similarities to when the team was sold 24 years ago. The team was very mediocre and just could never get over the hump in the mid to late 90s. In 96 they started 7-1 and limped to a 9-7 finish. In 97, they finished 8-7-1 in what as mediocre a season as you could get. In 98, they started 0-7 and finished at 6-10. I vividly remember discussing with family when I was home from college how I didn't want John Cooke to continue to own the team because that meant more Norv Turner. Some in my family liked Norv at the time and wanted to see him stay. When the franchise is bought in May of 99, the team is already in place. I can't remember if any action was taken that offseason, but for the most part, the football staff was kept in place for the 99 season. The Redskins go on to win the division and Norv keeps his job. Now, we know the things that happened after that which derailed the franchise after the 99 season, but I just want to focus on what happened in 1999 in the immediate aftermath of the sale. I'm not saying the 2023 team will win go out and win the division, but I'm pretty sure no one thought they could win it in 1999 either after the dreadful start in 98. If that happens though, it would be very difficult for a new owner to fire a coach that just won the division. I'm stating all this to just say to prepare for the possibility that Rivera gets another year if that were to happen.

Overall, I agree with what was said on the podcast though that the most important victory this year will be getting a new owner. What happens on the field will almost be secondary. Yeah, I'll watch and root for them, but the start of the 2024 offseason is where I'm expected to start having more hope in the future of this franchise.

One change I remember for the offseason was bringing in Brad Johnson after we lost Trent Green. That may have ended up being a wash on QB talent between the two.

 

[Kel Varnsen]

One change I remember for the offseason was bringing in Brad Johnson after we lost Trent Green. That may have ended up being a wash on QB talent between the two.

That happened in February, so it was before the sale. My point is that after the sale, things remained the same for that first year. There as no tinkering or tampering. That came later.

 

[DixieFlatline]

That happened in February, so it was before the sale. My point is that after the sale, things remained the same for that first year. There as no tinkering or tampering. That came later.

Gotcha.....I couldn't remember all the timing for that.

 

[Kel Varnsen]

I know he had his issues, but I wish Scot was still here.

I don’t. His tenure here was terrible. His drafts, which were his specialty, were awful. They reeked of being the smartest man in the room who knew something no one else did. Except he didn’t. His drafts were 7 and 8 years ago and the only player still on the team from those drafts is Kendall Fuller. Scherff was a great pick and they got as much as they could from him. Preston Smith in DC wasn’t as good as Montez Sweat. Even in Green Bay, he had 1 good year. Otherwise he’s a contributor and a solid rusher. Otherwise, nothing but busts. Doctson, Matt Jones, Sua Cravens to name a few. I believe his personal problems affected his job and being in this organization, he needed to be as clear minded as possible to deal with those guys. He wasn’t and it showed.

 

[Neophyte]

I will forever be grateful to Rivera for bringing respectability back to my team, both on and off the field. No question, he has made us better. He has also done it under some of the most trying circumstances, both personal and professional, that any team coach or executive has had to work under. My respect for the man is immense.

However, I fear he has reached his ceiling as a Head Coach unless he is gifted a Great Quarterback. His best years as a HC came with Cam Newton, one of the most potent weapons of his generation, under center in Carolina and he still failed to win a Super Bowl. In fact, he had one great year there and a couple of solid years. That's it.

I know we have QB issues here but I can't help but feel that Rivera (and by extension, the staff he has assembled) has failed to maximize the usefulness of the talent this roster does have. While I understand that this team could not expect to win a Super Bowl under Rivera, I don't think it is unreasonable to have expected 3 years of playoff football. Slow starts and even slower finishes have plagued this team under Ron. This is a pattern throughout his career as a Head Coach...a pattern that shows a decided problem with self-evaluation and behavior modification.

I just don't see this team getting much above .500 with Ron at the helm. I don't mind him staying for 2023, but short of a strong showing in the NFC Championship game next January, I don't really want him here in 2024.

 

[SkinsOrlando]

Ron was mediocre before he came here, had one magical season in Carolina and that's it. He's exactly what I expected to get, mediocrity, I want him gone. He served his purpose and the circus around the team died down, now he can go enjoy retirement.

 

[Knightingale]

My thoughts kind of align with Om's earlier post.

Ron is exactly the kind of guy I want to turn this operation around from laughing stock to respectability. Considering how long we'd been the former, and with all the shitstorm that's been flying around the past few years, it's kind of a miracle job he's done. Especially as the Front Office has done nothing to really help. I had high hope for Jason Wright, and while I think it's better than the Bruce Allen days there's a massive tendency to shoot themselves in the foot from that particular side of the operation. And most of the gaffes seem like such simple stuff. Stuff easily fact checked.
So against that back drop, and the continuing Ballad of Dan Snyder, the fact our actual TEAM puts out a professional showing is pretty amazing.

I'm not going to totally blame him for the fact we're still paddling in the middle of the pool. I think a lot of that has to do with the fact we haven't had a Franchise QB for such a long time. And Ron's not the only one who hasn't solved that problem (unless the Howling Commanders come good next year!)

I'm kind of hoping that Howell and Bierenemy might be the missing pieces of the puzzle. A competent QB and a good OC to take the pressure off Ron on game days. If Del Rio can reproduce this years Defense results, and Mayhew and co can shore up the O-Line, I think there's lots to be positive about.

 

[Boone]

I totally hear you guys on what a solid citizen Ron Rivera is. I didn't think that needed to be said - but if so - I agree. He's a good man with nothing but good intentions. I admire Coach Rivera for his personal courage, commitment to integrity, how he treats people, for his respect for the military, and for being a responsible accountable adult.

But let's be real. Only in Washington is NOT being a narcissistic, petty, misogynistic, power-hungry, sexually-abusive, disgusting SOB grounds for praise Rivera is the anti-Snyder. There's no question about that. I would hope that we are ALL anti-Snyders. On the ultimate scorecard, I guess Beezlebub (aka Dan Snyder) deserves credit for listening to Joe Gibbs and hiring Ron after we moved on from dope-smoking creeper Jay Gruden.

But at some point, we have to get around to judging his performance as the Head Football Coach (and in this coach-centric model, the defacto GM).

I'm willing to keep an open mind. Of course, if his hiring of Eric Bienemy and commitment to Sam Howell proves a stroke of genius, no one will be happier. But I'm far from sold that it's going to be all sunshine and roses from here on in.

I like Ron Rivera. But show me Ron. Because so far, it's been weak. And if you can't get it done here pretty soon, sorry, but I hope the new owner sends you respectfully and appreciatively into retirement.

 

[SilentThreat]

The other thing we have to remember...


This should be the standard, not the exception. We all feel so 'good' about Rivera, but we've had it so bad regarding culture around here that we're looking at Rivera like he's some sort of messiah, when THIS is how EVERY executive should act. Additionally, he's the head coach, so we can't restrict our judgement of him to off the field, and at the facility.

Results matter, and he's been tepid... underperforming if you really want to look at it. He's had hurdles that have restricted the results, but he's not only the chef, he's also the one getting the ingredients. Last year we had the weakest schedule in the league on paper... and it appears that it was pretty accurate. Wentz was the pick (Even if Snyder was the one who forced it) going into this season. As the season went on, we found ourselves 'hoping' he could be an answer as the physical talent was not matched, and we saw Heinicke for what he was... but coming into the season, I don't think ANY of us tapped Wentz as our choice at QB... Rivera did. Meanwhile we watched Geno Smith have a renaissance of his career, and Daniel Jones appear to be a legit starting QB. Tua and Herbert in 2020, Kenny Pickett in 2022. All 3 of those guys were on the board when we were on the clock.. Add to that Christian Darrisaw in 2021. We could legitimately have Herbert at QB, and Darrisaw at LT right now, instead of an internal debate about picking up Chase Young's 5th year option, and Jamin Davis.

Normally I don't like revisionist history, but these were names talked about on THIS message board. These were not surprises... I was big time in the camp of taking Chase Young, but I didn't think we would be HERE in year 3. I was wrong. I also don't get paid to run the team. This is what happens when the coach and the GM are the same. There's a reason only a few guys have been able to do it. I need a GM that's thinking about what's best for the team in 5 years, while the Head Coach is thinking about whats best for the team in 5 minutes. Those 2 will not align every time, but it's the conversations that need to be had.

There is something that needs to be considered also. The Dan Snyder factor in all this. Did Dan Snyder make the pick of Chase Young at 2? From a business standpoint, you could see where that might be the preference. A player capable of becoming a global brand. Jersey sales, and hype if you have a consistent DPOY candidate. It's possible... Wentz.. again, 'could' have been Snyder, regardless of what Rivera came out and said.

IMHO, Rivera is a perfect fit for Team President. He's the guy that can do what Jason Wright is doing... but better. I'd love to see him transition away from the football ops, and over to the business side once a new Owner is in place... He's a football guy, so ultimately I dont think it happens... but I think he'd be great at it.

 

[Chris]

It will be interesting to see what management structure any new owner will institute. I would prefer one that has (1) a Team President/CEO that is totally responsible for everything on the business side of the operation and (2) a GM that is totally responsible for everything on the football side of the operation but not also the Head Coach.

Rivera, who is a very solid human being (and as Boone pointed out- only in Dan Snyder’s world does that become a remarkable attribute) is not remotely qualified for the first nor particularly adept at the second.

I view Rivera’s role as that of simply a ‘manager’ of the on-the-field product. I would like a Head Coach who is a difference maker before, during, and after games. To me he is not.

 

[Knightingale]

ST nailed the point I think I was trying to BADLY make.

I do still think there was background meddling by Snyder in a lot of these decisions. It wouldn't surprise me if he was the one pushing for Wentz and Young (although I really wanted Young too, so...)

I think a change in ownership may answer a lot of these questions. If the franchise slowly starts to steady itself and move in the right direction, then I think we can be fairly confident that the Snyder stink was still on many of the decisions taking place, despite any protestations from Coach and President etc.

 

[DieselPwr44]