Discussing the potential future benching og RG3

fansince62 said:
lmao.

as I see it..there are three groups separating out:

1) all the folks who just gee whizz loved RGIII in 2012 - when we were winning - but now can't toss the guy over the rail fast enough.

2) the folks who were skeptical all along and, I suspect, desired some degree of failure.

3) and the folks who want this string to play out to the end.

this franchise is the gift that just keeps on giving!
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I'm in group 1. But since then, it isn't me that's changed. It's him. He plays scared, and it shows. He fails repeatedly to read the defense, to the point he looks illiterate. You can't keep loving someone just because they made you giddy in the past. It's like staying together for the kids.
 
I'm 1 with the slight caveat I don't want any fence tossing until the end of the season. We have to give the season to be sure what he is or isn't. Without marked improvement, I'd see no reason to carry on with it.
 
stevenaa said:
I'm 1 with the slight caveat I don't want any fence tossing until the end of the season. We have to give the season to be sure what he is or isn't. Without marked improvement, I'd see no reason to carry on with it.
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caveat 2.0 here... the rest of the team gets addressed accordingly. Step one is the decision after Jan. 1. (HYPOTHETICALLY) He's proven he doesn't have it.... understanding that while he might not be the solution, he's not the only factor in the problem. Taking this team in a different direction means a lot more then just the QB.

I have to say I'm somewhere involved in group number 1 and number 3. I don't want to sell the farm on Griffin, but emotions aside, the evidence on the table is very damning. He deserves the end of the year to prove he's the future of the Washington Redskins... 6 weeks to show that even if the line falls apart or the ball was dropped, the QB wasn't the liablity. PLEASE GRIFFIN, LETS PLAY SOME FOOTBALL.
 
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Nobody said:
I'm in group 1. But since then, it isn't me that's changed. It's him. He plays scared, and it shows. He fails repeatedly to read the defense, to the point he looks illiterate. You can't keep loving someone just because they made you giddy in the past. It's like staying together for the kids.
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well....first...I loved the pun!

second...I'm operating on belief (all are free to condemn) that last season was so putrid he never had a chance to recover - in short...there was no second season learning going on. now....how many quarters in a new offense? I agree he has issues. I just think many are over-stating the time he has really had to learn & adjust.
 
tr1 said:
Sorry, man. Just calling it like it is.

I've been accused of wanting our team to fail because of my criticism, but I don't trash players who gave us so much hope in 2012 and have sacrificed so much for the team.

He deserves the benefit of the doubt considering the abysmal o-line he has and a coach who seems pretty inflexible with his play calling.
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He does not deserve anything. He needs to earn the job.

And Martin C, glad you're here. You bring the sort of discourse full of respect and are thought provoking with your posts. My initial thought when you post is not to react, but respond. Thank you.

As for your statement he is not taking off at the first hint of pressure...not all the time. You're correct, but let's take a look at Cooley's breakdown of the first INT, again.

The play was set up for Jordan Reed. He was open. Robert never made the throw...he hesitated as the rush closed in on him and took off.

Roberts was the outlet, wide open in the flat out on the right. Robert never saw him.

In the time it would have taken to get the throw off to either of the two, he ran to his left, and threw the poor pass to Paul.

His focus was on the pressure, when there was plenty of time, not the open receivers.
 
Elephant said:
He does not deserve anything. He needs to earn the job.

And Martin C, glad you're here. You bring the sort of discourse full of respect and are thought provoking with your posts. My initial thought when you post is not to react, but respond. Thank you.

As for your statement he is not taking off at the first hint of pressure...not all the time. You're correct, but let's take a look at Cooley's breakdown of the first INT, again.

The play was set up for Jordan Reed. He was open. Robert never made the throw...he hesitated as the rush closed in on him and took off.

Roberts was the outlet, wide open in the flat out on the right. Robert never saw him.

In the time it would have taken to get the throw off to either of the two, he ran to his left, and threw the poor pass to Paul.

His focus was on the pressure, when there was plenty of time, not the open receivers.
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I appreciate the compliment - lets see if you still feel the same when I've been around a while :)

I did a break down of that first play in another thread in response to a conversation about read option. It was before Cooley's break down but thankfully for me I agreed with him almost 100%. I'm pretty sure that was not a called play action pass out of the huddle but was a read option package play. We did not block the LDE - he was the read and the fact we did not block him is why I don't think it was just a play action pass. We had a dive to Morris, a seam route to Reed behind the dive as the first read and a bubble to the right to Garcon (not Roberts). The LDE stayed home on the play so actually the correct thing for Robert to have done was hand the ball off to Morris, but he kept it. The play action held the MLB and Reed was open in the seam - the throw had to be really quick though because the MLB recovered quickly and got in the throwing lane. But Rob hesitated - then pumped as he waited to see if he could hit Reed in the second window behind the linebacker and in front of the FS, he pumped again but by now that unblocked DE was right in his face and it was too late to take the wide open Garcon on the bubble (Rob did see him he looked at him but the DE was right on him by then).

So the problem here was not his focus on pressure. His problem was his hesitation to throw the ball then staying with his first read too long. He has to know that LDE is unblocked and not just standing around sniffing his jock. If he is going to turn Reed down he has to get to Garcon immediately. You cant stand there pumping the ball with an unblocked DE on the loose. This is Robs issue in a single play - he is playing without confidence, not trusting his eyes and reads and taking too long to process information and make decisions - hes thinking not just reacting and letting his natural ability take over. Then you add in some of the mechanical breaks downs like taking the wrong drops or reading the wrong side of the formation based on coverage and bad things are going to happen.

Just to cap things when Rob spun out of the pressure and ran to his left the corner on Jackson dropped his coverage and ran to his right. Jackson was all alone on the left sideline (same side as Garcon) about 20 yards behind the defense. Its really hard for a QB running to his left to see that but if Rob was playing with confidence and is seeing the field with Robs arm and ability that would have been six.

IMO we have to keep playing him to see how he develops and hope he gets his confidence back to see if he can be our future. This kid CAN play QB at a high level. We saw it last year in patches not just in 2012. He had some really good games last year throwing the ball even though overall he was pretty average. Lets all hope he can get out of this slump because if he continues to play like he did last week we are right back to square 1. We may be but lets see how this all plays out.
 
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Pretty good film breakdown that will make the OL is the only fault I can find crowd rethink their positions.

http://www.hogshaven.com/2014/11/20...vs-tampa-bay-buccaneers-1st-half-redskins-nfl
 
I hear the all-22's for this game are an early favorite for QB Horror Film of the Year.

:twitch:
 
I haven't heard anyone say the o-line is the ONLY fault. now....they have been the ONLY consistently sucky part of the game for several seasons (at least in pass pro)...so they have that to be proud of!!!!!
 
You haven't heard it because no one here has said it.
 
Oh please. According to so many all of RG3s issues are because of the OL. Its here and everywhere else. Give him a line... he has no time... cant complete passes from the turf... he afraid because he has no time... he always under pressure... get your heads out of the sand. The denial around here is hilarious. Whats the excuse dujour? I'll just go watch this press conference now, its sure to give me about the same amount of flippity floppedness.

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Hey DM - here's a newsflash for you brother - you're not the only one allowed to have an opinion here. You can dial back the condescension and snark any time. I see problems with Robert - if you think you and the others pummeling Griffin mercilessly are the only ones who see problems, you're kidding yourselves. But there are other factors at play as well.
 
Point to taken and... Doors swing both ways. Brother.
 
Dead Money said:
Oh please. According to so many all of RG3s issues are because of the OL. Its here and everywhere else. Give him a line... he has no time... cant complete passes from the turf... he afraid because he has no time... he always under pressure... get your heads out of the sand. The denial around here is hilarious. Whats the excuse dujour? I'll just go watch this press conference now, its sure to give me about the same amount of flippity floppedness.

Sent from my GT-N8013 using Tapatalk
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remind me to never ask you for advice crossing a busy street!
 
Fear The Spear said:
It's pretty clear that I will garner little or no support, campaigning for McCoy or Cousins.
So here goes.....
TJ Yates for QB !!!
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not so! I'm all for two QBs who have never recorded a winning record over the course of a season. let's do it!!!!
 
More than anything else, NFL football is a game of "What have you done for me lately?".
Players' stock is constantly changing - both, from down to up, as well as, from up to down.
If RG3 deserves a pardon for his past mistakes, then so does McCoy.
In that regard, McCoy wins, hands down.
He's 2-0 with his current team, and 2-0, in the current season.
Anything that happened prior to that, is irrelevant.
He's 2-0, while RG3 hasn't won a single game in his last 8 starts, with basically the same offense and defense support.
The difference is clear.
He's given us zero reason not to believe in him, in regards to his performance as a Redskin.
RG3 is on a decline. McCoy is on an incline.
Whatever happened to "going with the hot hand" ?
 
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