Random Commanders Thoughts

[McD5]

Me neither.

In real news, 980 reporting Bobby Turner, RB's coach, is no longer RB's coach.

Mole killing?

 

[Burgundy Burner]

Me neither.

In real news, 980 reporting Bobby Turner, RB's coach, is no longer RB's coach.

Could be the mole I was talking about - referenced him too. Wanted him to stay, but something tells me he was a part of that leaking lie yesterday.

 

[Ax]

Hopefully by the end of the week, we'll have our new staff in place.

 

[Boone]

Wow BB, looks like you may have called it or maybe just coincidental?

And what ST said. I don't really mind RG3 giving it back a little, but generally the less he waxes poetically the better going forward.

 

[Burgundy Burner]

I wish it was coincidental only because I really wanted Turner to stay - he finds those rare gems at RB and coaches them up. But if he was the mole and still loyal to Shan, we had no choice. Bah.

 

[Primus Porcus]

I agree with you guys about him not talking on it that much. But the ratio right now is about this: media - 345353224352432453 RG III - 1

There has to be a time when he gets to finally say "enough is enough" and say something. Everyone else does it. So if he only does it now and then when its bad, I'm cool with it.

Agreed

 

[Lanky Livingston]

I wish it was coincidental only because I really wanted Turner to stay - he finds those rare gems at RB and coaches them up. But if he was the mole and still loyal to Shan, we had no choice. Bah.

Do you think it was Turner, not Shanahan who found all those late-round gems at RB? Interesting. I'm thinking it was more of a tag-team effort, and neither one would be very successful on their own, but I could be wrong.

 

[SkinsFTW]

Was Turner really on Shanahans staff when he found all those RB's from Terrell Davis to Clinton Portis, etc in Denver too?

 

[Burgundy Burner]

I think he had a lot to do with it. At one time, I thought it was more Shan than Turner. Given what we know about Shan these days, I'm more inclined to think that Turner had more to do with these successes. Just a hunch on my part and can't prove it.

 

[Burgundy Burner]

Was Turner really on Shanahans staff when he found all those RB's from Terrell Davis to Clinton Portis, etc in Denver too?

Yes indeed.

 

[CounterTrey]

Whoa...which one of Norv's teams was one of the most talented in Redskins' history?

1999 and 2000 this team was stacked talent wise...chemistry? Not so much but the talent was excellent comparitively. In 1999 we had 3 different receivers hit 1000 yards and a RB put up top numbers too. The O line was pretty decent then too.

 

[Lanky Livingston]

I think he had a lot to do with it. At one time, I thought it was more Shan than Turner. Given what we know about Shan these days, I'm more inclined to think that Turner had more to do with these successes. Just a hunch on my part and can't prove it.

I would think if it was more Turner than Shanahan, he'd have gotten more opportunities to move up (OC, etc.). Maybe he's just the best kept secret in all of sports? LOL. Maybe Shanahan pays him under the table to let him keep all the credit? Wouldn't surprise me one bit!

 

[SkinsFTW]

If Norv's tenure consisted of 2 years maybe your point would wash, but sadly for our team it didn't.

Snyder didn't own the team during Norvs craptacular 1994-1998 seasons. I'd have expected Norv to be fired after 1997 when we went from 7-1 to out of the playoffs, or even the moment Snyder bought the team, but he wasn't. He's still the winningest % coach in Snyders history of owning the team though, complete garbage as a coach that he is doesn't change reality.

Some facts aren't happy facts but that doesn't make them false either.

 

[Lanky Livingston]

1999 and 2000 this team was stacked talent wise...chemistry? Not so much but the talent was excellent comparitively. In 1999 we had 3 different receivers hit 1000 yards and a RB put up top numbers too. The O line was pretty decent then too.

Hmmm...in 99 only two WRs hit the 1K mark, but Davis rushed for 1405 yards and 17TDs (pretty damn impressive). I remember the run he had against the Giants when everyone thought he was bottled up, only for him to slip off the pile and rumble 40 some yards for the score...he was great before getting injured.

I'll admit that was a talented team, but one of the most talented in Redskins history? Maybe offensively...the defense was pretty porous IIRC (good ol' Mike Nolan). We could probably debate that all day, I'll just agree to disagree with you there.

 

[SkinsFTW]

1999 and 2000 this team was stacked talent wise...chemistry? Not so much but the talent was excellent comparitively. In 1999 we had 3 different receivers hit 1000 yards and a RB put up top numbers too. The O line was pretty decent then too.

Yeah he has some on D too with Green, Bailey, Stubblefield, Lang, Wilkenson, Coleman, Smith and somehow Sam Shade led the team in tackles in 99.

 

[tshile]

You just can't win on social media. If I were in one of these guys positions I'd never type anything on there.

Yeah. I don't have a problem with what he said, I just think it's a losing game he's playing. But that's his decision to play the game.

 

[CounterTrey]

Snyder didn't own the team during Norvs craptacular 1994-1998 seasons. I'd have expected Norv to be fired after 1997 when we went from 7-1 to out of the playoffs, or even the moment Snyder bought the team, but he wasn't. He's still the winningest % coach in Snyders history of owning the team though, complete garbage as a coach that he is doesn't change reality.

Some facts aren't happy facts but that doesn't make them false either.

Nope the team's record does not mean that Turner was the best coach and that's my point. He did less with more talent than other coaches here specifically Gibbs. No way he's been the best coach here since Snyder took over. The job Gibbs did was remarkable especially considering the context of the Taylor murder, and the job Turner did pales in comparison. Oh and Lanky that was one of the more talented teams, I didn't say they played well, in fact that's my point. That coaching staff was abysmal.

Now FTW if you meant to say winningest then maybe (although I would be willing to bet that Gibbs tenure was better than Turner's full 7. But even so if you want to make the numbers argument then that IMO is different than who is the better HC.

 

[Bulldog]

What has seemingly come out over the past couple of months is just how much of an asshole Shanahan was as a person.

Pathetic really.

You could say what you want about Norv or Zorn or Gibbs 2.0 but I never doubted they were decent people.

After Shanahan, I feel the need for a shower.

 

[Henry]

The actual record of Norv Turner during Snyders first 2 years of ownership compared to every single coach Snyder actually hired is revisionist history?

Maybe look it up next time. Norv had a winning record no Snyder hired coach has.

1999 10-6
2000 7-6

and won a playoff game. Yeah Norv sucks, but that just further proves how pathetic it's been since Snyder bought the team and turned it into his new marketing firm, and you guys are still drinking the same old Koolaid not only believing it's a fresh beverage but insisting that I happily partake as well.

I think this is a bit disingenuous. If Norv was a second year coach that had gone 10-6 and then 7-6 your point would be much stronger, but the fact is the guy went 49-59-1 as the head coach of the Redskins, went to the playoffs once in seven years, and fielded teams that were consistent only in their inability to play inconsistently.

Straight-up I think the best coach we've had here under Snyder is Joe Gibbs. Two playoff seasons out of four, with this owner and this front office, is a Hall-of-Fame worthy accomplishment in my opinion. But maybe that's just me.

In any event. I agree with your overall point, which seems to have gotten lost in the minutiae. Gruden going "28-3" is a completely meaningless stat. He is 0-0 as a head coach in the NFL. And against Snyder's record of 104-136 it looks a bit overwhelmed. To Mike's list:

Spurrier is 254-100-2 as a head coach for any team not called the Washington Redskins. This includes three different college teams and a USFL team. In those 27 other seasons, he's had one leasing season. Two season with the Redskins? 12-20. Two losing seasons.

Schottenheimer is 203-127-1 as a head coach for the rest of the world. With his three other teams, he put together back-to-back-to-back winning seasons by his third year with the team. The only team with which he failed to put together a perennial winner? The Redskins.

Gibbs ... I don't really need to go over this, do I? The man could get a 98 pound asthmatic to run through a brick wall for him. As I already said, his two winning seasons in four here should warrant a plaque in Canton somewhere. But ultimately, even he had a losing record under Snyder.

Shanahan went 146-98 as a head coach outside of DC. Even without Elway he went 99-81 before signing here.

Now one can point to all these guys and say they were too old or too dumb or washed up and hell, I would heartily agree in some cases. But the point here is that their records were all very impressive before they got here and tried coaching for Dan Snyder. 28-3 is really keen, but pretty little records tend to get chewed up and spit out here with impressive consistency.

And I do think that's a valid point.

 

[Bulldog]

But what you are missing is that Schottenheimer in Cleveland and KC worked under a GM. Ditto in San Diego.

Shanahan as well worked with a Personnel Director until 2001 which covered his Super Bowl years.

When these guys came to Washington they were in charge of personnel!

That's where the rubber hit the road

It wasn't that their systems didn't work, it was largely their personnel choices.