• Welcome to BGO! We know you will have questions as you become familiar with the software. Please take a moment to read our New BGO User Guide which will give you a great start. If you have questions, post them in the Feedback and Tech Support Forum, or feel free to message any available Staff Member.

This game could NOT have summed up the 'abandon the run' issue better.

  • Thread starter Lanky Livingston
  • Start date
McKissic for the win

Lanky Livingston

Guest

Okay, picture this scenario:

You are an offensive coordinator, with a rookie QB and a rookie RB. Your first two plays on offense are run plays to the rookie RB, and he goes for 27-yards. On two carries!

What would you do next?

A) Continue feeding the rock to the rookie RB, because obviously they can't stop him, or
B) decide two runs is enough, and call a play-action pass that fools absolutely no one, and get your QB destroyed on a CB blitz.

I think you know what our "brilliant" OC decided to do. Two more incomplete passes, and this beautiful beginning of the drive was WASTED. Absolutely wasted! Punt.

Next possession pop quiz: What do you do?
A) I would go back to what works, because obviously it was domination.
B) Hmmm...let's dial up a stupid trick play reverse, THAT'LL CATCH EM OFF GUARD!

To Shanahan's credit, he gave Morris the ball again after the failed reverse to Hankerson (WTF?). 3rd down incomplete pass, punt.

THIRD possession. After a pass on first down for no gain, Morris rips off another big run for 13 yards this time. FINALLY! Going back to what works! So, Kyle seemingly learning his lesson, gives the ball back for a 2-yard gain. And then abandons the run yet again. Two incomplete passes later, punt.

Next possession: Finally, more Morris. A 20-yard swing pass followed up by a 29-yard big gainer, that he probably should have scored on. Ryan Grant comes in and gets 5 yards, brilliant! We are really ramming it down their throats! Keep it going! Wait..what...3 yard pass? BOOOOOOO! Morris comes back in and gets knocked backwards, because on 3rd & 2, everyone is expecting run. Missed 31-yard field goal.

To top it all of, Griffin got injured. Exactly what people have said would happen, happened. RUN THE DAMN FOOTBALL!
 

Lanky Livingston

Guest
Also, this loss resides solely on the shoulders of the offense, in my opinion. If any one of us had been asked before the game if 24-points from the Falcons was a good thing, I'd be willing to bet most of us would be happy as a pig in sh!t to hear that!

Not to mention, the Falcons absolutely DESTROYED us in TOP - 37 to 23. Why? Because we didn't run the ball and sustain drives. 23 minutes of offense, when our RB pretty much could not be stopped? Are you effing ****ting ME? Unbelievable.
 

Ax

Guest
I guess we could trade Robert for 5 new offensive lineman, and just run the ball every down. I mean, why pass the ball at all.

And for the record, Robert got hurt when stupid got in his head and said, "Naw, don't throw the ball away, or run out of bounds. Let's make a cut that a ****ing deer couldn't pull off, and run right through that sissy ass linebacker!"

Robert's rookie foolishness cost his team a chance at victory.

Abandoning the run, in this game...

didn't...

****ing...

happen.

Mmmk?
 

Elephant

The Commissioner
Joe Gibbs Club Member
Joined
Aug 1, 2009
Messages
24,943
Reaction score
529
Points
1,143

Florida State

Yes it did Ax! Lanky is dead on with this one! And I don't care what stats suggest we ran it as much as we threw it, on critical plays we threw the ball instead of running it. In chat after Alfred churned off 2 runs over 10 yards, I asked who wanted to bet we run a play action here. I called, you don't think Mike Nolan could call that one?

If I can tell you what Kyle is going to call, you don't think an NFL defensive coordinator can?
 

Lanky Livingston

Guest
Yes. Yes it did.

Ax, just because you trade the farm for a guy, doesn't mean he HAS to win the game! As El pointed out in another thread, and as I said in the OP - that first drive Morris was GASHING them on the first two plays, and then Kyle got away from the run. Run, run, play-action? Really? Who is that going to fool? There are high school teams who would not be fooled by that.
 

Henry

I drink and I know things
BGO Ownership Group
Joined
Apr 12, 2009
Messages
9,900
Reaction score
226
Points
219
Location
Fairfax, VA


Yeah. Simply not calling a run on every single play does not equal Abandoning the Run.

We ran the ball well, but we didn't pass it well at all. Our inability to sustain any kind of passing game was our problem today. Once Griffin went out it was only a matter of time before we lost. Atlanta keyed on Morris and made Cousins beat them, which he clearly couldn't.
 

Lanky Livingston

Guest
You guys are missing the point - I don't want to run every play. That's not what I'm saying at all.
 

Elephant

The Commissioner
Joe Gibbs Club Member
Joined
Aug 1, 2009
Messages
24,943
Reaction score
529
Points
1,143

Florida State

But Kyle called certain pass plays when it was transparent. Then he calls a reverse on a rain soaked field to try to throw them off on 1st down? Come on! Morris was destroying them, our pass game was not working...why not do what works? I wouldn't have minded one designed run by Griff to keep the defense honest, but a reverse when the run game is working?
 

Lanky Livingston

Guest
We ran the ball well, but we didn't pass it well at all. Our inability to sustain any kind of passing game was our problem today. Once Griffin went out it was only a matter of time before we lost. Atlanta keyed on Morris and made Cousins beat them, which he clearly couldn't.
Uh...you're kind of right here. We weren't passing well. SO RUN THE BALL MORE. You only reinforce my point with this statement. We ran the ball well - so run the ball well! Stick with what works! Why try to pass when you're running so well?????

On that first (terrible) play-action, I would have liked to see them run the ball 4-5 straight times, especially with early succes. Run, run, play-action is not going to fool anyone.

Griffin is a wunderkind, and will be good for a long (hopefully) time. But he doesn't have to win every game - we CAN rely on other players for victories from time to time! That first drive should have gone for a TD - playcalling ruined it!
 

Henry

I drink and I know things
BGO Ownership Group
Joined
Apr 12, 2009
Messages
9,900
Reaction score
226
Points
219
Location
Fairfax, VA


Lanky, you can't say you don't want to run it on every play and then in your next post suggest we should have run it on every play.
 

Elephant

The Commissioner
Joe Gibbs Club Member
Joined
Aug 1, 2009
Messages
24,943
Reaction score
529
Points
1,143

Florida State

And in all honesty, the timing of the play action by Kyle was a textbook opportunity for it...the problem? Kyle calls that play too much. Where are the roll outs that would give Griff some time? I am not sure I saw one with Griff on the field yesterday. Cousins got one I think.

I guess what Lanky is saying and what I am agreeing with is the play calling is suspect at times. With an RB gashing the defense in a game where we needed to keep the best offense in football off the field, you run it more! When they stack the box, then you try something else.
 

Lanky Livingston

Guest
Lanky, you can't say you don't want to run it on every play and then in your next post suggest we should have run it on every play.
4-5 straight times is every play? Come on, Henry. EDIT: I see what you're saying - but "run the ball well" was not meant to imply running every play. But if you run twice for 27 yards, the next play should be a run. Run the ball a few more times, soften up the D, THEN call a playaction. Not when everyone on the planet expects it.

Let me pose the question this way: IF a team can't sustain drives, BUT they are running the ball extremely well; what is the problem?
 

Ax

Guest
Look, I like to pound the rock as much as anybody. And I've had problems with Kyle's play calling many times, as well. But some of you have allowed your personal dislike for the guy to fog your friggin brains.

You're more interested in screaming how right you are, when you GUESS correctly.

I'm sure had the first two runs gotten stuffed, you be crying about how everybody knew we were gonna run, and therefore we should have passed.

Being wrong sometimes isn't anything to be ashamed of.
Being right sometimes is hardly worth bragging about.
 

Lanky Livingston

Guest
Look, I like to pound the rock as much as anybody. And I've had problems with Kyle's play calling many times, as well. But some of you have allowed your personal dislike for the guy to fog your friggin brains.

You're more interested in screaming how right you are, when you GUESS correctly.

I'm sure had the first two runs gotten stuffed, you be crying about how everybody knew we were gonna run, and therefore we should have passed.

Being wrong sometimes isn't anything to be ashamed of.
Being right sometimes is hardly worth bragging about.

I mean, there is no way to defend against this statement, because we'll never know. But if they had run twice for 27-yards, and then been stuffed the next two times, I would have been happier than with a 7-yard loss due to a sack. Period.

Something tells me with the momentum we had, he would not have been stuffed, but that's pure speculation.

I would like to say, I've been one of Kyle's proponents over the past couple seasons when others were calling for his head. No longer. And I'm not allowing my "hatred" for the guy to cloud my judgement - I'm using my good sense to do that! :)
 

Elephant

The Commissioner
Joe Gibbs Club Member
Joined
Aug 1, 2009
Messages
24,943
Reaction score
529
Points
1,143

Florida State

The reality is Kyle Shanahan's play calling has been less that stellar at critical times. It always seems to blow up late in the 3rd quarter or early in the 4th quarter after we've had success with certain things and just in time for our defense to start being worn down. This is when good teams start to get momentum and it seems like it's when we always lose it. It always seems to happen when Kyle starts trying something different than what has been working, not because the defense adjusts but because Kyle wants to try to prove he is smarter than anybody else.

Am I reading too much into the reasoning behind the constant momentum swings for us at that critical time in the game? Maybe, but it's been going on for 3 seasons now.
 

Yusuf06

The Starter
Joined
Jul 15, 2009
Messages
1,648
Reaction score
0
Points
0


I have to admit that to some degree I had similar thoughts to Lanky's. That said I think it makes sense to remember that we were playing with essentially one healthy RB. If Morris had gotten hurt we'd have been down to a gimpy Royster and Ryan Grant who's only a week away from flipping burgers and even less time learning the playbook...nevermind that he has a history as a fumbling machine.
 

Henry

I drink and I know things
BGO Ownership Group
Joined
Apr 12, 2009
Messages
9,900
Reaction score
226
Points
219
Location
Fairfax, VA


4-5 straight times is every play? Come on, Henry. EDIT: I see what you're saying - but "run the ball well" was not meant to imply running every play. But if you run twice for 27 yards, the next play should be a run. Run the ball a few more times, soften up the D, THEN call a playaction. Not when everyone on the planet expects it.

Let me pose the question this way: IF a team can't sustain drives, BUT they are running the ball extremely well; what is the problem?
I believe I answered that?

me said:
We ran the ball well, but we didn't pass it well at all. Our inability to sustain any kind of passing game was our problem today.
If you can't pass the ball, drives are going to stall. Even when you run the ball well.

MY point in this thread is that Atlanta was simply a better team than us. Playcalling wasn't going to change that. We are going to lose games this year because we have some big holes on this team and things are not totally in sync. And it's not always because of one play that some of us think our coaches called badly. This just isn't a season where I see much of a point in complaining about stuff like that. There's too much that needs fixing personnel-wise for it to really matter.

This week, Atlanta shut down our passing game on defense and held onto the ball on offense. They KILLED in Time of Possession, which contributed to our lack of sustaining any kind of game-plan on offense more than anything else. Just being able to run the ball, while keeping us in the game for awhile, wasn't going to be enough.
 

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Total: 1, Members: 0, Guests: 1)

Private conversations
Help Users
As we enjoy today's conversations, let's remember our dear friend 'Docsandy', Sandy Zier-Teitler, who would dearly love to be here with us today! We love and miss you Sandy ❤
    Top