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Shanahans = Brain Dead Coaching

McKissic for the win

Bulldog

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In a season of serious brain farts and faux pas, the Shanahan's really outdid themselves today.

In a game where the team finally started to show some fight Mike and Kyle did their best to snatch defeat from the jaws of victory.

1. With the Redskins defense having held at the one yard line on fourth down, Kyle decides it's time to throw the ball out of the end zone when any reasonable prudence would dictate a run or a short pass to get out to the five or six yard line and set up a second down. But the ensuing interception brought the ball back to the one in a déjà vu moment for the Falcons to score a cheap touchdown.

That killed all the momentum from the defense. Kyle seemed to forget that while Kirk is a better pocket passer than Griffin at this point he is still a player in his second career start.

2. For a team that was 3-10 and looking for momentum over the last month of the season, does a sane coach really go for two points when an extra point gets you tied with a chance to win in overtime after overcoming SEVEN turnovers?

In one fell swoop Shanahan went a ways toward negating what was a flawed but energetic performance that if you played the odds may have very well resulted in an end to the 5 game losing streak.

For $7M a year Shanahan has made a number of head scratching decisions here from poor clock management to the hiring of ineffective assistants who have largely failed to improve the performance of their units.

But today was something different.

It wasn't confusion or a bad replay challenge, rather a conscious decision to shoot oneself in the foot.


Shanahan needs to be deactivated for next week's game.

He can join RG3 in the box and maybe the two can actually have a face to face discussion rather than a source vs source media battle.
 

GSF

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Any chance MS is trying to get fired at this point? Hard to come up with another explanation for his increasing incompetence.
 

FuriousD

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Kirk Cousins disagrees with you and I think he's in a slightly better position to speak about the pick and the game-plan in general. Bottom line is Kirk missed the receiver. It wasn't a bad call. It was a bad throw, period.

And we shouldn't be surprised that Kyle would dial up a pass in that situation. There's no better opportunity to throw your way out of the shadow of your own goal post than on first down. Kyle will dial up a pass in that position 90% of the time. He's done it a ton this year and in year's past.

I was fully expecting a pass but obviously not the result. At first I thought Robinson had screwed up and run a square-in when he should have curled but Kirk set the record straight and took full responsibility for not leading Robinson enough. Shame but the game didn't hang on this play.
 

SkinsFTW

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Yeah Kyles gonna pass and there was a stretch of 15-20 straight pass plays but the interesting thing was we kept moving the ball. People were screaming everytime we went away from the run when RG3 was in because he couldn't convert. Cousins made RG3 look like a bust. RG3 better step it up next year and take his job back.
 

Bulldog

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The fact that Kyle's style is to throw from the end zone in that situation in the past should not govern what he does in a NEW context with a quarterback starting his second NFL game.

Kirk may very well have made a mistake in his read and assumption of where Robinson was going.

The point is that a 23 year old quarterback without significant experience is a commodity you don't place the same kind of trust in those situations as you might a veteran that is quicker to read the coverages and get rid of the ball for a quick second down.

Again, I keep going back to that player vs. fit argument that we all seem to have ad nauseum since Shanahan has been here.

I don't see the kind of adjustments here as I see in other games where teams have personnel changes. In most cases, they don't remain static but match the playcalling to the skills and experience of the players on the field.

Point #1 aside for a moment, there was no excuse for Mike going for 2 in that situation.

This team was 3-10 and looking for something positive to build on. You don't take that away from them with a reckless call like that.
 

Bulldog

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The odds of kicking the extra point are 90% plus. The odds of converting a two point play are 50%.

For a 3-10 team that has had all kinds of problems getting lined up properly and executing basic plays all season, if you are the head coach you take the extra point and work to win the game in overtime.

If you have a team with Drew Brees, Jimmy Graham, Sproles and Colston then perhaps you go for the 2 with veteran players that have been there before.

Funny - Cousins threw the ball well for the most part, but those that are still in love with Griffin discount his performance and blame him for the couple of plays he would like to have back.

How about those Griffin interceptions where he threw the ball into coverage after looking down his receiver after starting the past 22 or 23 games for the organization?

Cousins deserves some time to get on the field and get comfortable leading an NFL attack before folks start to rip him apart.

If Griffin was maintaining his 20TD/5INT pace from 2012, Cousins would never have seen the field in 2013.
 

SkinsFTW

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Cousins was playing against the second worst defense in the League.

Let's get real.

Our o-line still struggled with these guys.
They were the 20th ranked pass defense. RG3 scored nothing for 3 quarters twice against the Eagles 31st ranked Pass Defense. Actually after the scrub in Minny just lit them up without Peterson playing they might drop to 32nd.
 

Miles Monroe

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They were the 20th ranked pass defense. RG3 scored nothing for 3 quarters twice against the Eagles 31st ranked Pass Defense. Actually after the scrub in Minny just lit them up without Peterson playing they might drop to 32nd.
Cousins also didn't have to read the D the way Robert is expected to, and just ran the plays called. No option plays, no audibles at the line. A pretty basic plan giving him a chance to succeed. Can't recall ever seeing Robert roll out nearly as much as Kirk did.
 
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McD5

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Cousins also didn have to read the D the way Robert is expected to, and just ran the plays called. No option plays, no audibles at the line. A pretty basic plan giving him a chance to succeed. Can't recall ever seeing Robert roll out nearly as much as Kirk did.
This is a good point. A co-worker of mine made another interesting observation. He played RB at UCF.

He said that when backup QBs come in, the O-line will really play with extra effort to protect them.. That they'll try to hold their blocks for half a second longer, and how that can make all the difference in the world.

That's not to discount Kirk's performance--but it may partially explain why (in addition to lack of tape) backup QBs often have immediate success.
 
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CounterTrey

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sorry the first couple times through I read it as you saying RG3 was a RB at UCF, not that your buddy was.
 

Henry

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The odds of kicking the extra point are 90% plus. The odds of converting a two point play are 50%.

For a 3-10 team that has had all kinds of problems getting lined up properly and executing basic plays all season, if you are the head coach you take the extra point and work to win the game in overtime.

If you have a team with Drew Brees, Jimmy Graham, Sproles and Colston then perhaps you go for the 2 with veteran players that have been there before.
I don't agree with your logic here. A 3-10 team has nothing to lose. You don't have to play conservative ball at 3-10. You can gamble because, frankly, 3-11 vs 4-10 doesn't make a lick of difference.

Funny - Cousins threw the ball well for the most part, but those that are still in love with Griffin discount his performance and blame him for the couple of plays he would like to have back.

How about those Griffin interceptions where he threw the ball into coverage after looking down his receiver after starting the past 22 or 23 games for the organization?

Cousins deserves some time to get on the field and get comfortable leading an NFL attack before folks start to rip him apart.

If Griffin was maintaining his 20TD/5INT pace from 2012, Cousins would never have seen the field in 2013.
Cousins did fine for a backup. He throws decisively and is clearly playing without the weight of the team on his shoulders. He throws a lot of picks, but he's good enough to keep the offense competitive (at least against lousy teams) and he's young, so he'll only get better. There's a lot to like about Cousins.

How about Griffin's interceptions? Well, Griffin's INT percentage is 2.6%. Cousins's is 5.9%. He throws interceptions more than twice as often as Griffin, and that's kind of significant. Sorry. He also throws TDs more often. So what our dilemma is at the moment is that Cousins is more confident with his throws, but not as physically capable. His passes tend to sail on him and if he's off the mark, it's a pick. Griffin throws lasers, but he's getting punchy and isn't making great decisions.

It's not about being in love with Griffin. Cousins looks to be a decent player. But it's about understanding which player has more potential. Which player has exhibited more talent and success given their opportunities. That's Griffin.
 

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This is a good point. A co-worker of mine made another interesting observation. He played RB at UCF.

He said that when backup QBs come in, the O-line will really play with extra effort to protect them.. That they'll try to hold their blocks for half a second longer, and how that can make all the difference in the world.

That's not to discount Kirk's performance--but it may partially explain why (in addition to lack of tape) backup QBs often have immediate success.
He makes a good point. Think about it... you just played a big role in a QB getting benched, and know if you get a second one killed, you're looking for a job shortly.
 

Lanky Livingston

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At this point, Shanahan is trying not to suffer any more season-ending injuries. Another potentially 15-minute quarter just adds to the likelihood that someone is going to go down with an injury, and what if they're gone for the first half of next season? Not worth it. At 3-10, no chance of playoffs, you end the game right there. I agree with his decision.
 

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Agree with Henry across the board. And I don't see how one can strongly criticize going for the win for the reasons he stated. It's not just about stats. In that position, with Atlanta on their heels and all the pressure on them, why not go for it? It didn't work out. It happens.

I do agree with Bulldog - the pass play out if the endzone (which is really the play that cost us the game) was ill-advised not because you can't sometimes catch the defense off guard and get out of trouble. It was ill-advised because Cousins is still inexperienced and doesn't have the rocket arm to fit the ball into tight places or the experience to know you have to throw that ball away if that pass play is called and no one is open. In that spot, it's simply a matter of looking at what the worst thing that can happen is vs. what the best thing that can happen is. Was a possible first down there worth the risk of a pick six there? Absolutely not.
 

CounterTrey

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The reason you don't go for it there is simple. Our team has struggled to even be in games of late and in desperate need of some success. When you are that far gone you go for the high percentage play versus the extremely low percentage one. Given how our D was actually playing decently toward the end there and the O was finally clicking the percentages were dramatically in favor of going for OT. It was monumentally stupid given the context. If Atlanta had been tearing it up then it makes more sense.
 

Bulldog

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I don't know what is going to happen in the future, but I would not hold the position that Griffin is destined to revisit the success the offense had in 2012 and he is a short stroke away from being a consistently elite qb in the NFL.

Talk about learning the position? Talk about Cousins throwing picks?

Have you watched Griffin this year trying to throw slants and basic out patterns? Have you seen his footwork? His inability to survey the entire field even when he has time and focus on his first read? How many times has Griffin failed to read the blitz and get the ball out quick to the hot read and taken sacks instead?

The other point is, you give Griffin so far what 24-25 games in the NFL to get experience, you give Cousins 2.5 games and then you are going to compare them?

That's a joke.

If you looked at Elway's numbers from his rookie season you would have traded him for the rights to Jay Schroeder :laugh:
 

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