Looks Like McDaniels Might Have Been Right

[Lanky Livingston]

Kyle Orton: 104/165, 63%, 1236 yards, 7TDs, 1 INT, 1 fumble, 5-0
Jason Campbell: 98/147, 66.7%, 1108 yards, 5TDs, 6INTs, 8 fumbles, 2-3

I would have never thought I'd see the day that McDaniels was proven correct, but looks like he is. Sigh.

 

[Neophyte]

Lanky, don't you think maybe Denver's line has a little something something to do with that too? Orton has been sacked 8 times, Campbell 13. You can figure that the pressures, hurries and knockdowns are higher also higher for Campbell from looking at the sack numbers (can't find the other data anywhere real quick).

Denver's Line
LT – Clady – 1st 2008
LG – Hamilton – 4th 2001
C – Wiegmann - UFA 2008 (14th season)
RG – Kuper – 5th 2006
RT – Harris – 3rd 2007

They have mostly grown their own and with the exception of Wiegmann are younger than our guys. Compare that with our line where we are using an UDFA at RT (LT this week...) and our last 1st round pick is from 2000 and sidelined with an injury.

I also can't help but think that maybe McDaniels system is just more QB friendly than Zorn's and McDaniels is an experienced playcaller. I am not saying Jason is a great QB but I don't believe he has ever had a fair shake and I am doubting very much he will ever get one at this rate.

 

[Aston Gambino]

For what it's worth, in my Madden franchise, I let Jason go after the '09 season and he was picked up by Denver. The following year, he was the MVP of the league lol!

 

[Lanky Livingston]

Neo, I think you're spot on. Part of Campbell's lack of success is that our organization has failed to reinforce the lines over the years, and this will become painfully obvious this week when Stephon Heyer is at LT, and BM Williams is at RT. I'm not sure Campbell makes it out of this game alive.

Also, Campbell is partially to blame. He is not a great QB in this league...but with adequate protection, he could be a Trent Dilfer or Mark Rypien, and lead a strong defensive team to the playoffs at least, maybe further. But who knows...I guess we will see next year, as with all the QB-chasing activity in this offseason, I find it highly unlikely that the Redskins will re-sign him, and even if they attempt to, that Campbell would be willing to re-sign.

 

[Henry]

I don't know much about much, but having watched them both play I'll take Campbell over Orton in a heartbeat.

 

[Lanky Livingston]

just one more doom and gloom thread...

Glad that Neo was on here to set it straight.

Mike - we are 2-3, having lost to 3 pathetic teams. We've put up an average of 14 points against teams that have allowed an average of 33.1 points to the rest of the league. We lost to a team that hadn't won in 19 tries, giving up 3 90+ yard scoring drives to a rookie QB in the process. We lost to a team who's quarterback had turned the ball over an astounding 9 times in 3 games before he played us, and we got 1 turnover out of him. The heart and soul of our offensive line might have to call it a career with a spinal injury. The heart and soul of our offense has 338 yards in 5 games, with a paltry 3.7 ypc.

What is there other than doom and gloom????

 

[Lanky Livingston]

I don't know much about much, but having watched them both play I'll take Campbell over Orton in a heartbeat.

Did you watch Orton's last two drives against the Patriots? I did. He was calm, poised, didn't pat the ball once, and calmly led drives of 98 and 90+ for TDs to tie the game, and take it to overtime. Then in OT, he calmly led them down the field on their first possession for the winning field goal.

Against the PATRIOTS. This wasn't against the scrub Panthers, who Campbell couldn't manage to get a TD drive of over 10 yards against. This wasn't against the Lions, against which Campbell could only muster 2 TDs against. This was the New England Patriots, who's defense has admittedly seen better days, but still have some great playmakers, and are coached by one of the better defensive minds of our generation.

 

[Lanky Livingston]

that would be my challenge to you. find just ONE article that says something positive about the Skins. I don't need to because I keep a positive outlook but I would LOVE to see you put one up.

I have no positivity left. The Redskins have broken my spirit. Actually, going 2-6 after such a promising start last season broke my spirit I think...and its just taken this year's pathetic performance to hammer it home.

 

[Yusuf06]

Neo, I think you're spot on. Part of Campbell's lack of success is that our organization has failed to reinforce the lines over the years, and this will become painfully obvious this week when Stephon Heyer is at LT, and BM Williams is at RT. I'm not sure Campbell makes it out of this game alive.

Also, Campbell is partially to blame. He is not a great QB in this league...but with adequate protection, he could be a Trent Dilfer or Mark Rypien, and lead a strong defensive team to the playoffs at least, maybe further. But who knows...I guess we will see next year, as with all the QB-chasing activity in this offseason, I find it highly unlikely that the Redskins will re-sign him, and even if they attempt to, that Campbell would be willing to re-sign.

You're right Lanky, the two are not mutually exclusive. I think JC is a bad QB but it's equally true that our OL is simply awful. JC would probably do a bit better with Denver's line, but he'd still hold the ball too long, take too many sacks as a result, fumble when hit by a stiff breeze, miss open receivers etc.

In short, we need a real QB and an OL.

that would be my challenge to you. find just ONE article that says something positive about the Skins. I don't need to because I keep a positive outlook but I would LOVE to see you put one up.

Really? You are kidding, right? Teams playing as poorly as we are don't get articles with a positive outlook...well, other than those written by Larry Michaels. Try finding an article with a positive outlook about the Bucs. Lotsa luck with that, mmmkay.

Sorry but that's just reality Mike. I can't wait until the day we have a team worthy of positive press again, but that day just isn't here yet.

The good news is that IMHO with the single improvement of adding a good OL, we'd easily be a .500 team...even with JC. We're a long way from being a really good team but we're also not nearly as bad as our pathetic OL and playcalling are making us look.

There, how's that for something not quite so doom and gloom?

 

[servumtuum]

Mike-there are positive things as well as negative things being said about every team in the NFL. Fans of teams that aren't doing well just have a more difficult time finding the positive comments. I read the article and liked it-I like CP better because of having read it. Thanks for posting it.

 

[Yusuf06]

http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2009/10/13/portis-addresses-sellers-dust-up/

You trying to bring up something about the Bucs as proof that you can't find anything about the Skins that isn't doom and gloom is just silly. I don't know what point you were trying to make there but you just piled on in a conversation that was directed to Lanky.

But I found one that isn't doom and gloom. You might even like it but it doesnt have too much negativity about Zorn or Snyder

An article about team dissension that somehow didn't boil over into something really ugly is what anyone would consider "positive"? Wow, talk about lowered expectaaaations.

We'll just have to agree to disagree on this one bro.

 

[Henry]

Did you watch Orton's last two drives against the Patriots? I did. He was calm, poised, didn't pat the ball once, and calmly led drives of 98 and 90+ for TDs to tie the game, and take it to overtime. Then in OT, he calmly led them down the field on their first possession for the winning field goal.

Against the PATRIOTS. This wasn't against the scrub Panthers, who Campbell couldn't manage to get a TD drive of over 10 yards against. This wasn't against the Lions, against which Campbell could only muster 2 TDs against. This was the New England Patriots, who's defense has admittedly seen better days, but still have some great playmakers, and are coached by one of the better defensive minds of our generation.

Our team sucks. The Broncos don't.