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Im excited but leery (gotta be lucky to be good)

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Rymanofthenorth

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I am excited because RG3 and Morris have displayed that they dont care if anyone else has given up, THEY havent given up. Griffin has cemented his position as THE leader of this team. The Offence is inconsisent but when its on its on, the problems with the Offence are no longer issues at QB and RB, inconsistent play by the key parts of the offence are a thing of the past, they might not be perfect (they are rookies after all) but they dont play like rookies, they might make a few mistakes but they also make the play far more often than not. Our Issues on Offence come because the Oline gets overpowered or just gets beaten. once we upgrade this Oline we will see far more consistent play, right now Morris often makes a superlative play just to get 5 yards, once he gets some more room? same with Rg3, once he gets more time, we will see huge improvements. We need some upgrades at receover as well but we can win with the receovers we have as long as they continue to improve, Garcon in particular has gotten better each week. We actually have a pretty decent offence, but Griffin takes too many hits on plays when he shouldnt even be touched, thats gotta stop too. This is our franchise, we need to protect him. but overall, definately a lot to be excited for. we see what the O can do now, operating with a bad Oline and subpar receovers (aside from santana and garcon) what we could do with some upgrades will be special.

the Defence, its brutal, we cant cover Tight ends, we cant cover wideouts on streak patterns, sometimes we cant stop the run, the Dline comes off the ball too slow, we run the same looping slow developing stunts and the same straight up the field blitz for kerrigan, with little variance. Our Backers are inconsistent, sometimes Fletch lights guys up, but he has been worse in coverage and he has even missed some tackles , something we just never saw before. Riley tends to overrun plays a lot. Kerrigan looks lost and tentative, last season he came down hill hard and often stopped plays at the LOS or forced cutbacks, this season that split second of hesitation is a huge problem. Our secondary cant tackle and cant cover, Cedric, is just too slow but is probably our best player in the secondary, Doughty is solid but just too slow, he often gets to the proper place just a split second too slowly. we need some serious upgrades in the secondary and at NT, getting rak and Carriker back will hopefully be upgrades as well.

but the last part is luck, we havent had any, the ball never bounces our way, guys get held blatantly and the damn commentator watches the replay and talks about how well the Olineman is playing (lmao), To a real skins fan sometimes It felt like the football gods have abandoned us. but recently, the ball has started bouncing our way, tips dont always go right to the bad guy, HOLDING GOT CALLED A FEW TIMES THIS SEASON. hell without some serious luck against the Mara losers, we lose that game badly, we cant rely on luck to win games, but I gotta say it sure is nice to get some and a get a win.

I don't care if we make the playoffs, to me this season is a succsess if RG3 stays healthy, if Morris stays healthy, if the defence improves, those things give me hope that there is in fact light at the end of a very loong tunnel.
 

Cycleans

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I don't think you are being objective.The Oline gave up no sacks and the running game was dominant. The Giants and the Cowboys are pretty good defenses this year in most measurable stats. I realize the Skins gave up some sacks against Dallas. But the Body of work says the Oline is a lot better than you give them credit for.
 

Rymanofthenorth

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if you dont watch the games and only see highlites then it would appear that the Oline is far better than it really is. if however you were watching the game several things would have stood out.

1- Rg3 got decked several times, even on short drops he had guys in his face any time he tried to throw from the pocket. the times he rolls or sprints out he often gets the edge and buys time.

2- many of Morris's runs should be short or no gainers but he slips tackles and slides into the seams and often gets a lot more than he should, once we actually start making those blocks he will have way more long runs. his best runs come on runs against good de's they get upfield and he slides into the seam and gets 7-10 yarders off it, but any time we run gut or countercutback, he gets hit for short yards because too many guys get in the backfield. luckily our scheme only needs ONE olineman to win his match up and he can get 4-5 yards.

3- the danger of looking at box scores is inherent here, you have got to see how many times Rg3 is on the ground, its way too much, even last game the announcers talked about how often he takes really big hits just to complete short passes. yes it shows how tough he is but its bad.
 

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We had to fight through a phantom horse collar call and a stupid offensive PI call as well. Add in the phantom leg whip PF and the phantom illegal formation from the first Giants game too.

Take those things away and we're 4-0 against the NFCE this season. That's not luck - that is the best team in the NFCE this year.

But I don't disagree with your ideas about the defense. We'll have key starters back next year and the draft will probably focus on safeties, CBs, and DT. Add in a RT to that group too. The future is awesome.
 

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if you dont watch the games and only see highlites then it would appear that the Oline is far better than it really is. if however you were watching the game several things would have stood out.
WHAT? I watch the games....I just think you been blowing your horn for too long stating that our Oline is in shambles....I wonder do you actually watch the games. The Oline has played poorly for a long time but whether it's the Shanny's system or Rg3 in general the Offense has been pretty potent. I realize that you have an above average understanding over (Joe the fan) of the x's and o's on the oline.
I just believe I'll trust an NFL head coach over your semi pro experience.:afro: Just saying. No offense intended.
The oline has jelled it's an integral part of the winning streak and drive to the playoffs. Are they stacked from book end to bookend with probowl talent? Of course not but they are playing well.
 
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I think its fair to say that our D in general (but especially the secondary) has been suspect all year as has the O-line. But we have had some devastating injuries. I think stating that we are winning right now in spite of them is ridiculous though. WE ran on the Super Bowl champs last night not the reverse. It was our D that held when it mattered last night, not theirs. The D and O-line are playing above their talent level right now. I don't see how it can be argued.

Sent from my BlackBerry 9650 using Tapatalk
 

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guys get held blatantly and the damn commentator watches the replay and talks about how well the Olineman is playing (lmao),
Oh my God someone else has checked this off as something that irks them! This literally drives me insane. Madden used to be horrible about it and right now Aikman is probably the worst about it. Gruden is evidently very adept at it as well. I realize there's holding on every play but if a blatant mugging hold is responsible for a play busting loose, it's not a GREAT offensive play worthy of being lauded!:soapbox:
 

Rymanofthenorth

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1- RG is holding on to the ball longer than he should to let the play develop and that is getting him hit as much as anything else.

2 - how do you explain the way the ends were sealed and between Morris and Griff they were breaking off big runs? Thats the joy of our OL getting out there and blocking. Not every play is going to be for big yards.

3 - Steve Young and Trent Dilfer are idiots and have NO room to talk. The big hit that Griff took was because he slid at the last second to stay inbounds. that wasnt anything to do with him trying to get the big yards but instead remembering at the last second he didnt want the clock to stop.

I agree with not being able to cover tight ends and thats on Haz. He just doesnt call the right scheme. But to me it seems like every game we let one receiver look like a stud no matter who it is.

But Ryan, we just won 3 in a row. 3 divisional games in a row and now sit firmly controlling our own destiny. Cant you be happy about that?

he does hold the ball too long sometimes but he also gets very little time even on 3 step drops, we are most effective off play action or rollouts but straight drops get him killed lol. the first series he was on the ground twice.

the ends dont get sealed in this scheme, they get trapped, basically what we rely on is a team to have aggressive upfield guys, when they get upfield, the back finds the seam it creates, the problem comes when only one guy makes his block and that happens far too often. we run offtackle and 6 hole very well against teams will good ends because they have to respect the edge run by griff and because morris has shown some outside speed too. but you will notice that instead of truly getting the edge and getting in the clear, he gets almost edge and gets tackled after 7-10 (not bad but with better Oline play he gets huge runs in double digits on the same play.

I was talking more of the shots he takes on a regular basis than the few he takes when he runs.

I am happy we won, its awesome, but we know where our holes are and we need to make sure we dont suddenly start thinking this team is a finished product, we have holes and need to make sure we dont get ahead of ourselves.
 

Lanky Livingston

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Welp...bad D just got worse...Ced Griffin suspended 4 games for violating the substance abuse policy. D'oh!
 

Rymanofthenorth

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WHAT? I watch the games....I just think you been blowing your horn for too long stating that our Oline is in shambles....I wonder do you actually watch the games. The Oline has played poorly for a long time but whether it's the Shanny's system or Rg3 in general the Offense has been pretty potent. I realize that you have an above average understanding over (Joe the fan) of the x's and o's on the oline.
I just believe I'll trust an NFL head coach over your semi pro experience.:afro: Just saying. No offense intended.
The oline has jelled it's an integral part of the winning streak and drive to the playoffs. Are they stacked from book end to bookend with probowl talent? Of course not but they are playing well.

sorry I just assumed you were looking at the box score, my apologies . I would suggest though looking at the way Griff is often hit after he throws, the way he rarely can get set in the pocket and the way our Oline hasnt done well on short yards unless we catch someone off guard.

The offence has been solid, go back and read what I wrote. The Oline is playing well above its talent level in spurts but its inconsistent. btw the NFL head coach has been wrong more than a few times and the semi pro guy was right, you may want to rethink that lol.

the Oline is playing better, that bodes well, but its still limited and im hoping that they keep playing well.

"I think its fair to say that our D in general (but especially the secondary) has been suspect all year as has the O-line. But we have had some devastating injuries. I think stating that we are winning right now in spite of them is ridiculous though. WE ran on the Super Bowl champs last night not the reverse. It was our D that held when it mattered last night, not theirs. The D and O-line are playing above their talent level right now. I don't see how it can be argued."

This scheme does better against aggressive ends, and the D was the beeficiary last night of a lot of lucky plays, several huge drops that were difference makers. its different when a D wins you a game, they were not doing that. Eli on several plays acted like he was under pressure when there was nobody near him.
 
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China

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sorry I just assumed you were looking at the box score, my apologies . I would suggest though looking at the way Griff is often hit after he throws, the way he rarely can get set in the pocket and the way our Oline hasnt done well on short yards unless we catch someone off guard.
This isn't strictly true. When doing straight dropback passing you are correct, the O-line doesn't hold up well and Griffin needs to get rid of it quickly or he takes a hit or a sack. However, on play-action fakes he frequently gets more time and is able to set up. You can't make those long bombs and deep crossing routes if there's no time.

Does the running game and play-action fakes cover for some of the weaknesses in our O-line? Sure, but what's wrong with that? That's what our coaching staff should be doing, scheming to get the most out of the limited talent available.

EDIT: I'd be curious to see the stats of how much time in the pocket Griffin gets, especially the difference between straight drop-backs and play-action.
 

servumtuum

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This isn't strictly true. When doing straight dropback passing you are correct, the O-line doesn't hold up well and Griffin needs to get rid of it quickly or he takes a hit or a sack. However, on play-action fakes he frequently gets more time and is able to set up. You can't make those long bombs and deep crossing routes if there's no time.

Does the running game and play-action fakes cover for some of the weaknesses in our O-line? Sure, but what's wrong with that? That's what our coaching staff should be doing, scheming to get the most out of the limited talent available.

EDIT: I'd be curious to see the stats of how much time in the pocket Griffin gets, especially the difference between straight drop-backs and play-action.
China, you gave me a place to post an article I found about Griff and why his effectiveness in play-action is far better than any other QB in the league.

Also it helps explain why defenses are having such a hard time with our offense.

Robert Griffin: Perfect Play Action
Steve Palazzolo | 2012/12/01

Tweet
We’ve been touting our new Signature Stat that breaks down the best quarterbacks on Play Action Passes, but it’s now time to take a look at some of the game film behind the best play action passer in the league, Robert Griffin III.

Most quarterbacks see a moderate improvement when using play action, as passing lanes are generally bigger with the defense having to show respect for the run. But in Griffin’s case, the difference is astronomical. His 12.5 yards per attempt when using play action ranks first in the league, while his 5.7 yards per attempt without play action ranks dead last.



Why is there such a drastic difference?

A lot of credit has to go to the Washington Redskins’ coaching staff that has put Griffin in a position to use his unique skill set. They’ve expanded their playbook this year to include a number of zone read variations where Griffin can be used as a run threat, but they’ve also kept the base zone blocking scheme that has been a staple of the Shanahan family for a number of years. The diverse running game, along with having a run threat from both the quarterback and a running back, has made for some nice throwing lanes for their rookie passer.

That’s not to say that Griffin’s had an easy time of it on play action, but it’s his skill set that has opened up these opportunities. I compare Griffin to New England Patriots wide receiver Wes Welker in that their stats may be inflated because of what are perceived as 'easier’ plays. Welker’s reception numbers are inflated every year by a number of screen passes, but he is only used in the screen game because of his after-the-catch ability. Obviously, any wide receiver would love to have the extra receptions, but Welker’s skill set allows him to make the most of those opportunities. Similarly, Griffin’s ability to torch defenses with his legs has netted him some much easier throws.

Let’s take a look at a pair of examples:

Week 11 vs. Philadelphia Eagles — 3rd Quarter, 1:23

Washington does a nice job of selling the run, the linebackers bite up to respect it, and Griffin turns his head around to a wide open middle of the field.



Outside wide receiver Josh Morgan likely has an option on his route where he can take it to the post if the deep middle of the field is open, but with the free safety staying put, he rounds it off into more of a dig route into the vacated middle. Despite tight end Logan Paulsen being a little late in picking up defensive end Brandon Graham, Griffin has a nice throwing window and a fairly easy 16-yard completion.



Week 12 at Dallas Cowboys — 2nd Quarter, 13:57

Griffin is in the pistol with a running back, fullback, and tight end in a 'diamond’ formation. This set is rare in the NFL, but the Redskins have made good use of it this season. They fake the run and essentially run a two-man route. Much like the last play, the middle of the field is wide open, but Griffin had bigger things on his mind. Wide receiver Aldrick Robinson runs a post route on cornerback Brandon Carr, but it’s safety Danny McCray who is the key to this play. He gets caught looking in the backfield and by the time he realizes his mistake, Robinson is well past him. Here we see Griffin’s strong arm and accuracy as he throws the ball almost 60 yards in the air and hits Robinson in stride for the touchdown.



The Redskins’ offense keeps linebackers and safeties 'on a string’ as well as any in the league. The variation in their run concepts, including the threat of Griffin as a runner, has kept those middle-of-the-field defenders moving forward, backward, and laterally with confusion.

The next step for Griffin is showing improvement in situations where the defense is expecting the pass, particularly 3rd-and-long. Without moving defenders, the throwing windows are a little tighter and the reads a little more complicated. This is not unique to Griffin as many rookies struggle in this area, but with the Redskins playing to his strengths so efficiently in the play action game, it’s going to buy him some time to develop in other areas.
Article link: https://www.profootballfocus.com/blog/2012/12/01/robert-griffin-perfect-play-action/
 

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Those pockets look pretty darn clean to me, and i've seen plenty of that.


Oh, and i've heard a couple different national analysts say that Williams has played well enough to be considered for a pro-bowl bid
 

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[\Quote]I agree with not being able to cover tight ends and thats on Haz. He just doesnt call the right scheme. But to me it seems like every game we let one receiver look like a stud no matter who it is.

But Ryan, we just won 3 in a row. 3 divisional games in a row and now sit firmly controlling our own destiny. Cant you be happy about that?[/QUOTE]



We don't control our own destiny If we go 4-0 and Seattle and the giants both go 4-0 and every team above them finishes out we won't make the playoffs
 

tshile

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Those pockets look pretty darn clean to me, and i've seen plenty of that.


Oh, and i've heard a couple different national analysts say that Williams has played well enough to be considered for a pro-bowl bid
same has been said for will montgomery.
 

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If it makes anyone somehow feel better for some bizarre reason, we did lose a fumble and the Gints scored on the ensuing possession.

Nick
 

Rymanofthenorth

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Those pockets look pretty darn clean to me, and i've seen plenty of that.


Oh, and i've heard a couple different national analysts say that Williams has played well enough to be considered for a pro-bowl bid
read what I wrote, I said that we are more effective in play action but that straight drop backs arent working and the stats clearly support that. so much of our offence is due to misdirection or using the defences own speed against it, the problem has come when we become one dimensional for any reason. anyway, we have a few more games, by the end of the season we will see. TW has played very well in spurts and had some bad games, monty has improved and would be one of the few guys I wouldnt be looking to get rid of lol
 

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