Hypocrisy re the Mississippi Licence plate debacle

[Rymanofthenorth]

So a large group is protesting the Civil war licence plate thing, apparently because Nathan Bedford Forrest is one of the generals who will be honored.

I get it, he founded the KKK, perpetrated a massacre etc etc. so I would have some sympathy for their argument but for one very small detail.

THERE ARE STILL SEVERAL SO CALLED WAR HEROES WHO HAVE MEDALS OF HONOUR FOR KILLING WOMEN AND CHILDREN. Before anyone goes off on a rant , I am not talking about Vietnam or afganistan, I am talking about soldiers who literally killed women and children and its even metioned in the dispatches that got them their medals. such heroes as the guy who bravely fired a cannon into a village of women and children, a guy who "chased several indians into a brush fire." This is the single most disgusting thing I have ever seen and it saddens me that it cheapens a medal meant for uncommon valour and men who really earned it.

its a blot on the united states that these medals even exits let alone are still celebrated. I have always supported the US as a staunch ally, I have many freinds in the US military community, but this is something that needs to be rectified. I am not a militant Indian by any stretch, but anyone wondering about this should read Bury my heart at wounded knee.

I will go and get some of the dispatches, you guys can read it for yourselves.

 

[Rymanofthenorth]

LMAO, that was pretty much the weakest reply I have ever heard for this Mike,

1- I don't pay taxes in the US but I have supported the U.S. Military through donations to the wounded warrior project and other charities for veterans, I think that more than entitles me to complain about something so ridiculous. I think however that this year I will not be contributing unless something is done about this. obviously being polite doesnt work lol.

2- the fact that people who murdered women and children and got medals for it not only looks bad on the US but it cheapens the medal for those who received it for actual valour, go read the dispatches from wounded knee, if you have any conscience at all you will change your stance.

your grasp of history is pretty poor, you do understand that if not for the french you would still pay taxes to the british right? and as for Russia, that was never a concern for us , thats some silly isolationist talk.

 

[Lanky Livingston]

Ryman, when they make a license plate honoring Custer or some other general who killed Native American women and children, then that would be the time to bring this up, no? I mean, the two are barely related, except that they involve military figures.

And not to make excuses for what we did to the Indians, but they weren't exactly using feathers and tickling us, either.

 

[Rymanofthenorth]

1- I dont pay taxes there, I contribute to your military through donations, thats the point.
if you had donated to their government, then you would have a say, (at least you should), I did donate to the military implying that I support them, meaning that they should take my opinion into account when making decisions such as letting those scumbags keep their medals.

My point about hypocrisy is that they are freaking out about licence plates because Forrest was a typical southern landowner with the typical attitudes of the era, yet true injustice goes completely unremarked on.

2- the point would actually be name one country that not only committed atrocities but then gave out medals and celebrated it every year, that list would somewhat smaller.

Your reading comprehension is really poor if you thought this thread was about licence plates.

 

[Rymanofthenorth]

Ryman, when they make a license plate honoring Custer or some other general who killed Native American women and children, then that would be the time to bring this up, no? I mean, the two are barely related, except that they involve military figures.

And not to make excuses for what we did to the Indians, but they weren't exactly using feathers and tickling us, either.

Lanky, google is your friend, thats the point, it wasnt just general custer, go look at the list of MOH recipients, the number from "the indian wars" is hugely disproportionate, and worst of all read the dispatches, one guy honest god got an MOH for firing a cannon into a village, another for bravely chaing several children into some burning brush, and another for killing several women in quick order. its an injustice that should be addressed yet is glossed over every year.

 

[Rymanofthenorth]

So proudly the Army displays it's flag with over 170 battle streamers at the Pentagon, White House, West Point Military Academy, museums and Army posts throughout the world. The Pine Ridge battle streamer has the highest number of Congressional Medals of (dis)Honor (20) of all the streamers including the Normandy Landing, Battle of the Bulge and Iwo Jima. According to the Army, the Secretary of War authorized which battle streamers would hang from the flag. The Secretary of the Army could have the streamer removed if it wasn't tied into the 20 Congressional Medals of (dis)Honor. For this reason, the permanent removal of this offending streamer would take congressional and presidential action.

 

[Lanky Livingston]

if you had donated to their government, then you would have a say, (at least you should), I did donate to the military implying that I support them, meaning that they should take my opinion into account when making decisions such as letting those scumbags keep their medals.

Actually, you can donate all the money you have to the US military, and they don't have to listen to a word you say, my friend. And they won't - as they shouldn't. The only way to get the military to listen to you is to move to America, become a citizen, vote for your leaders, and hope that somehow their policies effect the military in the way you'd like. That's it, fella. Outside of that, you don't even have a pot to piss in here.

Lanky, google is your friend, thats the point, it wasnt just general custer, go look at the list of MOH recipients, the number from "the indian wars" is hugely disproportionate, and worst of all read the dispatches, one guy honest god got an MOH for firing a cannon into a village, another for bravely chaing several children into some burning brush, and another for killing several women in quick order. its an injustice that should be addressed yet is glossed over every year.

So, because there are a large number of MOH recipients from battles against Indians, Mississippians should happily accept the founder of the KKK on their license plates?

 

[Rymanofthenorth]

You need to put on your big boy pants and ease up on the whine, there were no insults, your initial reply was weak and I said so.
this most recent one made no sense, speak to my own country if I have a problem with yours? lol wow.
Lanky, nobody said they have to listen to me or anyone else who supports and donates money to causes affiliated with them, however they should probably not be surprised when that support erodes.

and No lanky, what I said was its rather sad that THIS issue is getting so much pub when something that is far worse has gone on for decades despite actual military support for those medals to be removed.

 

[Dreamingwolf]

what makes you people say Forrest founded the kkk?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Medal_of_Honor_recipients_for_the_Indian_Wars

which ones of these are the ones whatever anti-usa site is ramping you up over?

 

[Rymanofthenorth]

LOL maybe because sometimes you say or write something so abjectly stupid that it almost defies belief. Your overly sensitive nature recently would be amusing if it wasnt so annoying. if you dont like a post I made, I will giev you a really easy way to avoid them, HOW ABOUT DONT READ THEM?

Basically, Mike it was something for discussion and any American or Canadian with an interest in seeing a country do the right thing would be interested in this. if you had merely posted an opinion rather than a weakass excuse I probably would not have said your responce was weak, but saying " it doesnt matter because you arent american and dont pay taxes" or " all coutries do bad things", despite the fact that I openly support the US military and friends and family in it and despite the fact that this isnt about what countries did but what countries should do, was not much of a responce.

I may not have a say, but getting some americans to talk about it and perhaps even do something about would not be a bad outcome.

 

[Rymanofthenorth]

what makes you people say Forrest founded the kkk?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Medal_of_Honor_recipients_for_the_Indian_Wars

which ones of these are the ones whatever anti-usa site is ramping you up over?

Forrest gump said so

 

[Lanky Livingston]

Lanky, nobody said they have to listen to me or anyone else who supports and donates money to causes affiliated with them, however they should probably not be surprised when that support erodes.

You said they "should" listen to you.

I did donate to the military implying that I support them, meaning that they should take my opinion into account when making decisions such as letting those scumbags keep their medals.

No, they shouldn't. If they listened to every person that donated money, they'd have no time to deal with things like, oh you know, the every day running of the military.

and No lanky, what I said was its rather sad that THIS issue is getting so much pub when something that is far worse has gone on for decades despite actual military support for those medals to be removed.

So much pub? I hadn't heard about it until today, when you posted it on this forum. So congrats, you've actually given it MORE publicity than it would have gotten otherwise.

 

[Rymanofthenorth]

You said they "should" listen to you.



No, they shouldn't. If they listened to every person that donated money, they'd have no time to deal with things like, oh you know, the every day running of the military.



So much pub? I hadn't heard about it until today, when you posted it on this forum. So congrats, you've actually given it MORE publicity than it would have gotten otherwise.

exactly the SHOULD consider the voice of people who support them, I didnt say they HAD to, if they are ok with people withdrawing support then thats fine. its not like I am a lone guy talking about this, several groups have brought this up over the decades.

as for so much pub its all over the news here but then Canadians are far more informed about what goes on around us and thats no stereotype, I find that average americans dont give a crap about much beyond their own town.

 

[Rymanofthenorth]

are you still whining? Its funny that you self identify as an uninformed american, ignorance is bliss I suppose. which again, would be why I adressed people here, most of the people here would not self identify that way and actually pay attention to whats going on around the world.

 

[Rymanofthenorth]

LOL its not my thinking, its pretty much the basis for an entire TV show here, we had a tv show host go around american universities and ask them ridiculous questions. they did the same thing to small town america. google "this hour has 22 minutes" its actually quite funny. apparently though you missed the word "average" in the OP. but thats ok.

 

[Miles Monroe]

Ryman,the thing you seem to be missing is context of time. What is not acceptable in this country now, was acceptable in it's time to a great degree. The mentality was completely different, and the farther you go back, more brutality was accepted.

With the time in history, and the general mentality, it's easy to see how these people would be viewed as hero's by many.

 

[Dreamingwolf]

Ryman,the thing you seem to be missing is context of time. What is not acceptable in this country now, was acceptable in it's time to a great degree. The mentality was completely different, and the farther you go back, more brutality was accepted.

With the time in history, and the general mentality, it's easy to see how these people would be viewed as hero's by many.

I think you are being generous, I dont think his intention is to put things in perspective he is just besmirching the USA. History is History, ryman is on his story to tell us we are savages and also not missing the oppurtunity to point out his nation is more informed than our nation. I mean really when he brought that out you gotta know this isnt a discussion, it wasnt a discussion from the get go. He started with a topic, and then immediatedly veered into an assualt on the USA.

I tried to stay on topic and asked why people were saying Forrest was the founder of the kkk(which everyone was saying he was and all were wrong) and he responded that he heard it on forrest gump. Come on, lets call a duck a duck.

 

[Boone]

Let me make this easy for you guys.

1. This is a stupid thread. The points being discussed having nothing to do with one another. I think most sentient beings would agree that creating commemorative license plates with this kind of subject matter is not the idea of the century. What that has to do with distaste with some Medal of Honor awards, I have no earthly idea?

2. I ought to give 2 or 3 of you this thread a nice long timeout. We've said repeatedly that this kind of crap doesn't belong here, isn't in line with the tone/culture we want here. You guys apparently just don't care, or think we're not keeping an eye on things here.

Knock it off.