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Capital Obsession: The Shanahan Way; Wait, Which Shanahan?

One of many experimental iterations ...

KDawg

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*The Shanahan Way * Kyle Shanahan has been heavily scrutinized by Redskin fans the last few weeks, so I set out to check out what Kyle Shanahan’s...

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Goaldeje

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James Madison

Good points, KDawg. Only thing I would argue is that Houston's D has been n so horrendous for years, that may be why the Texans did not make the playoffs. Not sure you can pin those struggles on Kyle.

Having said that, as it applies to us, I agree completely we need to run the ball more. I have been a little surprised Shanny Sr hasn't stepped in to make sure that happens more. I guess neither are used to the NFC East yet.
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KDawg

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Goal,

I wasn't implying that it's purely on Kyle. I was implying that the offense hasn't made it to the playoffs. Keep in mind, a pass happy offense lacks the ability for ball control at times. Though, I'm not sure that's the case here with the walking first down in Andre Johnson on the Texans.

Kyle's offense has yet to make it to the playoffs... And that may not be a pure indictment of his own, but it is a fact. :)
 

Goaldeje

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True. The ball control issue is a big factor, no doubt. I've watched a number of Texans games over the last two years, and their offense is impressive. Their defense couldn't stop, ... well,, a McNabb led offense (too soon, cheap shot?). Theyre going to have to improve the D, as are we, to make a move.
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KDawg

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True. The ball control issue is a big factor, no doubt. I've watched a number of Texans games over the last two years, and their offense is impressive. Their defense couldn't stop, ... well,, a McNabb led offense (too soon, cheap shot?). Theyre going to have to improve the D, as are we, to make a move.
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In the meantime, it's my assessment we need to use the running game. :)
 

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Well, it's also a fact that few teams are going to win a division title with the 34 year old McNabb at qb, rookie free agents at RB, and an offensive line that features 3 centers playing the interior OL positions :)

This offense needs to be gutted in the offseason and while Grossman knows the system and that made some difference, the truth is the Redskins still have less talent at RB, WR and OL than the other teams in the division.
 

KDawg

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Well, it's also a fact that few teams are going to win a division title with the 34 year old McNabb at qb, rookie free agents at RB, and an offensive line that features 3 centers playing the interior OL positions :)

This offense needs to be gutted in the offseason and while Grossman knows the system and that made some difference, the truth is the Redskins still have less talent at RB, WR and OL than the other teams in the division.
That doesn't show with the rushing statistics. But yes, you're right. But I'm not sure what this has to do with the thread. I never said we had good talent... Just that we'd benefit from a more run geared offense.
 

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well, in order to run the ball against teams like the Giants and Cowboys you have to have the talent at RB and the physical presence on the OL.

if you notice the Redskins can run the ball on smallish fronts like the Bucs or the Colts but have a lot of trouble with teams that have that 310-320 DT who demands the double team.

Again, Shanahan may be more pass-happy than his father, but his father came in and had guys like Gary Zimmermann and Dan Neil in Denver to work with on the OL who were pro bowlers.

That meant holes for Terrell Davis.
 

Rymanofthenorth

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bds twin has it bang on, we ran well against smallish defences, and terrible against bigger ones.


Torains average was skewed by two games in which he had great YPC, on the whole we have had a lot of runs for no gain and no sustained rushing success. also we run the ball far better on stretch type plays than on basic runs and this leads to our inside run game being pretty bad.

I agree we need to run the ball more, but more importantly we need to run the ball CONSISTENTLY.
 

KDawg

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It's my argument that we don't run the ball well versus bigger fronts because we don't do it. Yes, our offensive line talent is scarce, and our running backs aren't all pros... I understand that. But when your best back only averages 15 carries a game you're not running the ball enough. Sometimes you get stuffed for a bit but then lanes open as the game wears on.

We don't run the ball enough to find out.
 

Bulldog

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KDawg, with all due respect I still don't see the difference between running the ball 15 times for a 2.9 yard average against the Giants and running the ball 25 times for a 2.9 yard average against the Giants :)

In the end it still adds up to a lack of productivity.

The Redskins are not the only team in this boat.

The Colts have a smallish OL that even when healthy can't establish a strong run game.

Despite Matt Forte, the Bears are another team that is often challenged to establish anything on the ground due to the state of the OL.
 

KDawg

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Bulldog, I think you're underestimating how well Ryan Torain has run the ball.

St Louis (16th ranked rush D): 6.57 YPC (7 carries, 46 yards)
Philly(11th ranked rush D): 3.89 YPC (18 carries 70 yards)
Green Bay(19th ranked rush D): 2.5 YPC (16 carries 40 yards)
Indy (28th ranked rush D): 5.0 YPC (20 carries 100 yards)
Chicago (3rd ranked Rush D): 5.95 YPC (21 carries, 125 yards)
Detroit (ranked 24th rush D): 1.11 YPC (9 carries 10 yards)
Tampa(ranked 29th rush D): 7.17 YPC (24 carries 172 yards)
Dallas (14th ranked rush D): 4.82 YPC (11 carries 53 yards)

I can see a point being made that the teams we've played haven't been outstanding by any stretch. However, he had a very, very good game against the 3rd ranked rush D. He also had a poor day against the 24th ranked rush D. Looks like a mixed bag to me. If we give him the ball more often, perhaps we'd be more successful... Especially when he's on.

The Tampa game comes to mind. He seemed invisible in the second half.

Indy, Philly and St. Louis are all games he should have gotten the ball more often in as well, although we were down versus St. Louis the entire game I still think he could have sustained some drives.

He's a tough guy to evaluate and when you're getting <15 carries in a lot of games you're limiting the potential for big runs.

On the flip side, Donovan McNabb has thrown the ball entirely too many times. He's proven, early on, that he wasn't doing great things for us. So why continue to force the throw? Run the football.
 

Rymanofthenorth

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thats a good point, when I used to do scouting for our team I would throw out a players best game and his worst game to better idea of his true average performance, a singular standout performance is usually just that. You are right that we didnt need Mcnabb throwing that much, but again how many times did we throw to get him in a rythm?
 

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