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Kirk Cousins Development Tracker

"Victim crowd"?

Who are you referring to exactly with that? And what do you mean by it?
 
MikeSr619 said:
Who are you referring to exactly with that? And what do you mean by it?
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Maybe the 'Griff is the victim of subterfuge and or ineptitude by members of the coaching staff.' crowd?
 
TomE said:
Maybe the 'Griff is the victim of subterfuge and or ineptitude by members of the coaching staff.' crowd?
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You using too many of them fancy words for my liking. Next time you call a man a subtertude you better be able to back it up!!
 
Goaldeje said:
Nice approach McD.

Keim's flaw is the assumption that Gruden is a capable talent and situational evaluator; this extrapolation is not in evidence yet.

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If you read the article, you'll see that Gruden's view meshes with Kyle's view. I suppose it's possible that Kyle is also a bad evaluator though.
 
I think that's a pretty reasonable summary by Keim of what's gone on.
 
I think it could be accurate. There is enough other evidence to declare Gruden a buffoon that makes me hesitate to conclusively decide anything yet.

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Oh, I think it's pretty obvious Cousins understands the offense Gruden wants to run better than Griffin does.
 
Miles Monroe said:
So, you're saying that Griffin has designed the offensive schemes, and drew up the plays from years 2, 3, and 4 that didn't fit his skill set. Last I checked, for 3 seasons coaching has demanded Griffin be something he isn't, a conventional QB, not Griffin.
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No, between his reckless play, his inability to actually perform any offense that doesn't involve him being a racehorse, the fact that the NFL changed the rules so the style of offense best suited to his abilities prior to getting slowed by injury, all play a large part in him being tied to the cart.

You can complain about the coaches not fitting the scheme to fit his abilities, but what is continually over looked is that his abilities (or lack there of, I should say) minimize what the coaches can actually do with him.
 
The good news? From Mark Bullock:

#Redskins offense schematically very similar to this Packers offense. Packers have more run/pass option plays and obviously better QB

Yeah, just trying to point out schematically, this is what Skins offense designed to look like, when run properly.
 
I think by declaring Griffin his Starter meant that the team would not be looking to draft or trade for a starting qb. I also don't have a problem believing they wanted to give him the best opportunity to succeed. He just came up short.
 
So, how's this for a wild theory?

Jay actually loves Griffin.

But, after witnessing the Oline getting eaten alive by a pride if lions, he decided to sacrifice Pick, er um, Kirk, while the new kids learn enough to be counted on not to get Robert killed. Saying it was "Kirk's team" was simply providing him with the same confidence builder he gave Robert when announcing him as the starter during the offseason. Means Jack Shit.

Now Robert, out of the limelight, is allowed to further learn the job out of the view of know-nothing armchair GM's. While the Oline improves it's game. And Gruden banks on either Kirk getting injured, or, his alter ego, Pick, continuing to do what he does best, justifying benching him forever, again.

Oh yeah, this could be happening. :joker:

As for this Sunday, I'm looking forward to seeing, Kirk, take the bull be the horns, or, the eagle by the wings, as it were, and leading us to victory.

If his alter-ego takes charge, there will be chants. And they'll rhyme with, Far Be Thee!
You know it, and I know it.

When they say, "you're the man", you damn well better be, The Man.
 
Any word on DJax return? As big as Sunday is for Kirk Cousins (not to mention Jay Gruden), in terms of his being able to show that the new normal for him looks more like the Rams game than the Giants game, it would be nice if we could see him run the offense with its only legitimate game-breaking threat in the lineup.
 
We might get a clue with the injury report. Could also be a smokescreen to make the fecals have 2 defensive game plans.

I suspect we won't know for sure until the inactive list comes out Sunday morning.
 
tr1 said:
Here's the problem with Keim's summary. He fails to mention WHY the Skins picked up Robert's option. I believe McCL was on board at the time.
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Sources said:
The Redskins will exercise their fifth-year option on Robert Griffin III's contract, a move that will keep the star quarterback under Washington's contractual control through the 2016 season.

Redskins general manager Scot McCloughan announced the team's decision Monday, saying there is a "very positive feeling in the building right now."
McCloughan said that the team had made its decision on Griffin "a while back."

"He's a good football player," McCloughan said. "He's got the tape out there. Everyone knows what he did in [2012] when he was offensive rookie of the year. This offseason will be his second in the system, being healthy, being able to go through the offseason."
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Yep, Scot was 'on board', they declared Griff 'the starter' after Gruden hinted at an open competition, Griff was locked up for next year in case he blossomed into an NFL QB coming into a second year system, giving him all off season to learn with the full team support and trust that he so craves.
It's also reasonable to suspect that Griff not playing is just to avert financial disaster but it might be more reasonable to think that he's just not ready and still can not protect himself well enough to even give the staff a hint of success regardless of the financials.

tr1 said:
Keim is so in the tank for this coaching staff he's unable to be objective. I guess RG3 hasn't given him the respect he feels he deserves?
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Have absolutely no response to the above unmitigated speculation.




tr1 said:
Anyway, it's obvious Gruden just hasn't changed his scheme to fit Robert. Never has. So yeah, there's a total disconnect when it comes to skill set and play calling.
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Sources said:
The Redskins’ braintrust — head coach Mike Shanahan and offensive coordinator Kyle Shanahan — built an offense tailored to Griffin’s skills.

In one way, they were a huge success. Griffin, the second player taken in the 2012 draft, had a dynamic rookie season, passing for 3,200 yards with 20 touchdowns and just five interceptions. He ran 120 times in 15 games for 815 yards and seven touchdowns.

In another, more important way, the Shanahans proved theirs was not the way to go.

Griffin’s knee appears to be 100 percent now. The Shanahans are gone. Jay Gruden is the new coach.
Instead of building a system around Griffin, Gruden and his staff are installing an offense and learning who does what best.

“Coaches coach, players play,” Griffin said. “So Coach is calling the plays. We’re trying to execute what he calls to the best of our ability.”

But Gruden is a realist. Griffin ran frequently as a rookie and got hurt. The team was 3-13 last season when Griffin’s knee prevented him from playing at his highest level. Gruden sees the connection.

Instead of being the team’s second leading rusher, the new staff is more interested in Griffin buying time with his feet, then making a play with a pass. They see him as a runner when an opening occurs or when all else fails in a passing situation.
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even more sources said:
Whenever he was asked as a rookie about comparisons between his game and other NFL quarterbacks, Robert Griffin III often heard the names Cam Newton and Michael Vick. Griffin would acknowledge that he, like those two, had great mobility. But he always made it clear he didn’t want to pattern his game after either of them.

Griffin always said that instead, he wanted to develop more along the lines of Aaron Rodgers – a pass-first quarterback who uses his mobility to extend plays and enhance his passing, rather than a player who uses mobility to mask deficiencies throwing the ball.
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It seems that Gruden's system is tailored to a Rodgers skillset, you know, the same one that Griff wants to run. All he has to do is develop the same skillset as Rodgers, just hasn't happened yet.

McD5 said:
The good news? From Mark Bullock:

#Redskins offense schematically very similar to this Packers offense. Packers have more run/pass option plays and obviously better QB

Yeah, just trying to point out schematically, this is what Skins offense designed to look like, when run properly.
Click to expand...


tr1 said:
We all get it.
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Yes tr1, we do
 
Don't want to speak for Tr1 (he's more than capable of that himself), but I believe one of his points (and, imo, it's a salient one) is that Gruden's system should be considered so infallible as to require talent bend to the system rather than the reverse. What has Gruden's system showed to this point that would merit that? The great coaches in NFL History are notorious for devising a system that accentuates their players' strengths, not their weaknesses as Gruden has done to this point.

If Kirk came in and lit the world on fire, an argument could certainly be made in Gruden's favor. Since that has not happened, I think it is perfectly legitimate and acceptable to question Gruden's methods.

Sadly, Kirk and Robert both look worse to me than they did before Gruden got here. This is a totally subjective opinion, mind you, worth precious little, but that's the analysis of my eyeball test. So at some point, we have to ask: who is the QB that will fit Gruden's system? Is Aaron Rodgers the right fit? Who else would fit.

Because frankly, at that point, if you need someone as talented as Aaron Rodgers to execute your system, I'm not very impressed with your system. So why then are we so attached to this system again?
 
Well said Goaldy.

The system might be fantastic. Who knows.

Maybe all that's required is someone who knows how to teach it.
 
Interesting turn to the conversation. At the risk of derailing the Kirk thread ...

It's hard to come up with a long list of coaches who crafted strong offenses without equally strong QB's, isn't it? Gibbs ... ?

Seems to me no modern NFL offense is going to run very well, or consistently, unless the guy pulling the trigger is at the very least reliably competent. Acknowledging I may be missing/forgetting some example, can anyone think of any other coach whose offensive system is/was so good it achieved sustained success without really good QB's?
 
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