A Burgundy and Gold Obsession
'Politics is the art of looking for trouble, finding it everywhere, diagnosing it incorrectly and applying the wrong remedies.' - Groucho Marx

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  1. #41

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    George Mason

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    you might not think that mike, but people don't hesitate a second to refer to this country as a 'christian nation', or founded on 'christian beliefs', especially when they feel that the christian part of it all is under attack or that some other belief system has encroached somewhere.

    there are a lot of people in this country that think that way and have no problem saying that and thinking that it's not only right, but that for it to be any other way would be wrong.

    when someone points out that a policy is heavily influenced by christianity and that there is separation of church and state for a reason, the rebuttal and subsequent shift in conversation is almost always to how many of the founding fathers were christian implying that it matters what their belief system was or that it should be approval for allowing such influence.
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  2. #42

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    Navy

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    monikers die hard and people embrace change like being asked to wear sandpaper underwear

    doesn't mean its the truth. just means people hear a catch phrase and learn to believe it. those people are the problem with this country anyways.
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  3. #43

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    Im not saying we live in a theocracy, Mike, but yeah Christians, loosely and generally, run most everything in the US. Its inevitable when the population is so overwhelmingly Christian. Again, its fine. I dont see it as some grand conspiracy or anything. What I do occassionally see is that when a group chips slightly away at this cultural and political dominance, suddenly its an attack. The country is being subverted and Christians are being treated unfairly and not allowed to express themselves.

    Take this thread, for example. We pledge to this country under the Judeo-Christian God 99.99 percent of the time, but when the name of that God is spoken in another language one time, suddenly Christianity is under attack, and Muslims are getting special privileges and taking over the country.

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  4. #44

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    Navy

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    hasn't it gone to court and made clear that if you don't want to say "Under God" you dont have to?

    If you are given the choice and still are offended then perhaps its something deeper than just the words. Sounds like that person is probably looking for something to be offended over.

    Its the allegiance that matters, not if you praise my God or not. And that has been established in the courts of law as well. shit, as a matter of fact, you dont even have to stand or acknowledge the pledge at all. They have allowed people to live in this country and NOT pledge allegiance to it.
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  5. #45

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    And I'm willing to bet no one at that CO school was forced to say the pledge in Arabic either.

    As you say, some people are just looking for a reason to be offended.

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  6. #46

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    Navy

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    I know you are trying to tie all of this to Brian's discussion and points but that is not where I am headed. Those are his beliefs and I don't want to get in the middle of that.

    I just wanted to touch on the "Christians run the country" portion and discuss that. I dont agree and think that people continuing to tie together that someone who happens to own a business also happens to be a Christian as anything but coincidence are looking to start a fight.
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  7. #47

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    Mike, of course its nothing more than a coincidence. But given that 4 out of every 5 people in this country are Christian, that coincidence will occur far more often than it will for anyone of any other religion.

    Does that clear it up?

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  8. #48

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    Navy

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    If you believe it's just a coincidence there is no reason to bring circumstantial evidence in unless it's just to present a "maybe". Then that opens a bunch of doors.

    Incidents being blamed on being any religious has zero to do with anything unless they are saying it does.
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    Navy

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    PS, I've missed you being like this. Glad you're feeling better
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  10. #50

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    James Madison

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    Get a room.
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    OLine. DLine. Secondary.

  11. #51

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    Navy

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    How about you do us both a favor and shut your big yapper!
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  12. #52
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    Quote Originally Posted by Henry View Post
    And I'm willing to bet no one at that CO school was forced to say the pledge in Arabic either.

    As you say, some people are just looking for a reason to be offended.

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    but the principle these days is that we have to be attentive to those who are offended. there are some on this site who have stated such. why is it....then...if some parents are offended by this.....that their sensitivities count for less?

    we can get to the other discussion later - of what business a school has sanctioning these little morality plays in the first place. their job is to teach English, math, etc. this ever happens in the school my child attends - I'm finding some like-minded parents and suing.
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  13. #53
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    Navy

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    Where are the athiests from the Freedom from Religion cult to denounce school kids from saying one Nation under God in any language?
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    Never Get into a Fight with an Ugly Person. They Have nothing to lose. :)

  14. #54
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    Navy

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    Quote Originally Posted by tshile View Post
    you might not think that mike, but people don't hesitate a second to refer to this country as a 'christian nation', or founded on 'christian beliefs.
    Well that is because this is a Christian Nation (Just as the NBA is a Black League according to C Barkley,etc) founded on Judeo Christian principles. Which is why despite radical left wing extremism, the current push this administration and the Press to weaken the Nation by attacking and shaming success and the traditional American work ethic, America is still Exceptional. God Bless You and Allah Bless America.
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  15. #55

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    George Mason

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    Quote Originally Posted by fansince62 View Post
    but the principle these days is that we have to be attentive to those who are offended. there are some on this site who have stated such. why is it....then...if some parents are offended by this.....that their sensitivities count for less?
    because of the motives for their sensitivities.
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  16. #56

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    Quote Originally Posted by fansince62 View Post
    but the principle these days is that we have to be attentive to those who are offended. there are some on this site who have stated such. why is it....then...if some parents are offended by this.....that their sensitivities count for less?
    From the first page of this thread:

    Quote Originally Posted by me
    This is just PC backlash from the other direction. And it's just as eye-roll worthy.
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  17. #57
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    Navy

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    I'm just waiting to see outrage from people wearing USA flag T Shirts on on Yeah even we kicked the French's butt lets drink Mojitos and Coronas with lime day aka Cinco de Mayo. And be labelled a bigot for wearing a Pro USA shirt to school.
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  18. #58
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    Quote Originally Posted by tshile View Post
    because of the motives for their sensitivities.
    riiiight! so you play the game well! you don't care for the outcome - or are simply blessed with better insight into how the rules should be applied (i.e., to what YOU favor)...why then just claim you understand the motives! what a great sport!!! we get to arbitrarily decide whose motives to trust! whose values matter more! and we don't even need to ground the decision in fact...or defend the principle itself!

    what a great society!!! it all turns on a intent dime!!
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  19. #59
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    Quote Originally Posted by Henry View Post
    From the first page of this thread:
    I get it...when a principle doesn't conform to your value system it doesn't apply! it's just an eye roll!!! cuz some INTENT matters more than others!!! we get to pick and chose who gets to be offended!

    it just doesn't get any better than this!!!
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  20. #60

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    George Mason

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    Quote Originally Posted by fansince62 View Post
    riiiight! so you play the game well! you don't care for the outcome - or are simply blessed with better insight into how the rules should be applied (i.e., to what YOU favor)...why then just claim you understand the motives! what a great sport!!! we get to arbitrarily decide whose motives to trust! whose values matter more! and we don't even need to ground the decision in fact...or defend the principle itself!

    what a great society!!! it all turns on a intent dime!!
    it's not about what i favor, it's about the roots of feelings.

    those who have sensitives because they think Muslims attacked us on 9/11 have no standing. it was terrorists, and these people have deeper/other issues that are surfacing as hating Arabic, muslims, etc.

    Why you're being offended and who you're blaming matters. Especially if you're going to demand everyone else respect your feelings. You can't simply claim to be offended and expect everyone to cede to your offenses.

    People can pretend they care about it being sung in any other language, yet they didn't say a word when it was done in spanish. They likely wont say a word when it's done in french; or german; or portuguese; or any other language.

    But in arabic? It becomes a huge issue.

    It's as transparent as it gets. When the motives and/or roots of the sensitivity are founded in misplaced hate based on a groups religion/race then people don't respect the sensitivity.

    It's not about what I favor. It's about not condoning hate based on ignorance.
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