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Random Commanders Thoughts

Well, unfortunately for the draft picks given up my feeling is the Redskins could have rebuilt much of the current team into an up and coming contender.

Three #1 picks and a #2 pick?

For a good GM that's FOUR premium athletes.

You have to remember that the compensation for Griffin was MORE than the Broncos gave up to Indy for the rights to John Elway.

Only a fool would say the move for what was given up was anything but a swing for the fences that crashed out.
I'm not sure I could disagree more. Coming off Rex and Beck, we needed to take a chance. And the chance worked. Am I the only one who remembers 2012? Talk about euphoric. The organization and Mike Shanahan ruined the kid. Should we have gambled those picks with such a crappy organizational structure in place? I guess not, but the thing is the gamble worked for that year.

Elephant is the ONLY person. I remember casting doubt during that run into the playoffs. And even he admitted he might have been wrong until the playoff injury.

The last two years have been the stuff of nightmares. And Griffin deserves a shit ton of blame for not adapting, being a shitty teammate, insisting on scheme change and just generally failing at his job. But when we're closing the book on Robert Griffin III in DC, let's not try to make ourselves feel better by pretending 2012 never happened.

As much blame as Robert carries, the organization and Shanahan carry equal amounts for ruining the most promising start to a Redskins career I can remember in quite a while.

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We have no return game. We consistently started deep in our own territory forcing long drives that just weren't logically going to happen.

I like Chris Thompson - he looks like possibly our best return guy in years. I also think Crowder has a lot of potential there if he can keep his hands on the ball.
 
I like Chris Thompson - he looks like possibly our best return guy in years. I also think Crowder has a lot of potential there if he can keep his hands on the ball.
I hope I'm wrong but from what I saw this game we didn't do so hot.

Also, 66 from the ravens got knocked stupid!! The redhead dude the skins training staff had to keep from falling down....wow!
 
I'm not sure I could disagree more. Coming off Rex and Beck, we needed to take a chance. And the chance worked. Am I the only one who remembers 2012? Talk about euphoric. The organization and Mike Shanahan ruined the kid. Should we have gambled those picks with such a crappy organizational structure in place? I guess not, but the thing is the gamble worked for that year.

Elephant is the ONLY person. I remember casting doubt during that run into the playoffs. And even he admitted he might have been wrong until the playoff injury.

The last two years have been the stuff of nightmares. And Griffin deserves a shit ton of blame for not adapting, being a shitty teammate, insisting on scheme change and just generally failing at his job. But when we're closing the book on Robert Griffin III in DC, let's not try to make ourselves feel better by pretending 2012 never happened.

As much blame as Robert carries, the organization and Shanahan carry equal amounts for ruining the most promising start to a Redskins career I can remember in quite a while.

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Where almost all of us were wrong in 2012 wasn't about Griffin being a special talent and that offense being deadly - we saw it, it was real, he and it was unbelievable that year. But I think that misses the point. The read option offense is not sustainable at the NFL level, at least not for a guy built like Robert Griffin, and with the rules changes that make QBs leaving the pocket 'fair game'. That rule doomed the read option and Griffin too. The hits a read option QB take are just too brutal at the NFL level. Taking Griffin where we did, for what we gave up, was the worst decision the Redskins have made since drafting Heath Shuler. Not because Griffin isn't an incredible athlete, but because his style of play can't work long-term in the NFL. Had Griffin been capable of adapting to a more conventional scheme, we might still have salvaged that move and turned it into a very expensive but workable plan to find a franchise QB. But it's clear now he can't adjust his talents to that more conventional style. It's not about hindsight. Almost everyone here was 'all in' when the Redskins did whatever it took to get a franchise guy. We just picked gambled and lost and picked the wrong QB.

Finding a QB has always been and always will be part skill and part blind luck - as much art as science.
 
I hope I'm wrong but from what I saw this game we didn't do so hot.

Also, 66 from the ravens got knocked stupid!! The redhead dude the skins training staff had to keep from falling down....wow!

Carrot Top got rocked! I think we are on the upswing on returns - it's our return coverage that is still scary. We almost ruined one of Kirk's TD drives at the end of the half letting them return it almost all the way. If it weren't for a great defensive forced turnover, we wipe out that entire drive and TD in under 30 seconds. The return coverage has got to get better. We aren't a talented enough squad to overcome major ST breakdowns constantly.
 
Where almost all of us were wrong in 2012 wasn't about Griffin being a special talent and that offense being deadly - we saw it, it was real, he and it was unbelievable that year. But I think that misses the point. The read option offense is not sustainable at the NFL level, at least not for a guy built like Robert Griffin, and with the rules changes that make QBs leaving the pocket 'fair game'. That rule doomed the read option and Griffin too. The hits a read option QB take are just too brutal at the NFL level. Taking Griffin where we did, for what we gave up, was the worst decision the Redskins have made since drafting Heath Shuler. Not because Griffin isn't an incredible athlete, but because his style of play can't work long-term in the NFL. Had Griffin been capable of adapting to a more conventional scheme, we might still have salvaged that move and turned it into a very expensive but workable plan to find a franchise QB. But it's clear now he can't adjust his talents to that more conventional style. It's not about hindsight. Almost everyone here was 'all in' when the Redskins did whatever it took to get a franchise guy. We just picked gambled and lost and picked the wrong QB.

Finding a QB has always been and always will be part skill and part blind luck - as much art as science.
I'm not sure I agree with your entire premise, but if I concede that, the rule change occurred AFTER we drafted him. Meaning that with hindsight we could have known not to draft him. But at the time, we could not have known the league was going to **** us over twice.

In my opinion, the risk at the time was high, but to say it was a horrible decision that shouldn't have been made is silly. We couldn't have had all the information.

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Sometimes I can't follow your all's logic. It's not about 'at the time'. Of course, every one of us (including Redskins Front Office folks) makes decisions every day of our lives that may prove to have been good decisions, okay decisions, or horrible decisions. There isn't any debating it - we gave up the effing farm for a guy who we are mostly likely about to release for no compensation. By default, that makes the decision to get him at all costs a terrible, terrible decision.

There may be 1000 reasons why this didn't all work out for us, many of which are no one's 'fault'. But the bottom line is, with the bases loaded, 2 outs, and needing a home run to win the World Series, we took the biggest bat available, stepped up to the plate, and swung it as hard as we could.

We whiffed. The one great season was fun, but it doesn't change that basic fact. We bet the farm and the bank just took it from us. I'm looking forward, not backward. But I think to do that as a franchise, we need to release Griffin and never look back.
 
If you're going to couch it that way, that's fine. My problem is with the people who say the move never should have been made in the first place.

That, IMO, is being intellectually dishonest.

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If you're going to couch it that way, that's fine. My problem is with the people who say the move never should have been made in the first place.

That, IMO, is being intellectually dishonest.

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There we mostly agree. I think knowing what we know now, the move of course shouldn't have been made. But that's different than faulting the Redskins for making the move at the time. I have never been a big believer in 'regret'. I tell my kids this and have always viewed it that way. You make the best decision you can, based on who you are and where you are in life, and then you hope it works out. If it doesn't that is part of life. I have never understood folks who engage in hand-wringing, self-flagellation, remorse over blown decisions, etc...

It didn't work out. That much is obvious to us all. Time to move on. Get busy living or get busy dying :)
 
The read option may not be 'sustainable' as the primary element in a scheme but as an element within a scheme it is sustainable.

(according to sources :twitch:)
2012 saw something like four teams putting it in as part of their repertoire (because of the Skins), now there are some 24 teams using it.
The Shannies were not that far off in bringing it to the NFL much like what's-his-face in Philly is now getting patted on the back for bringing in his college schemes to the NFL.

As mentioned ad nauseam during '12, Griff did not get injured because of the read option it was his lack of awareness during scrambles that got him in trouble.

Local advocates for Griff think keeping the read option viable within our scheme would do wonders for his own protection, primarily because the threat of him running creates hesitation on the defense. Griff apparently does not buy into that notion or has lost confidence in his own ability to protect himself. Remember him waving his arms showing he did not have the ball? Once he did that, any hit was roughing.
 
I saw a lot of disgusting things said about Griffin in chat last night....I am not really sure we will see any more unbiased opinions from anyone on here anymore.

That's BS Mike. You are so attached to Griffin you are not being objective. There was not one "disgusting" thing said about him. No one proclaimed joy over his injury. But many of us see him for what he has shown to be. Stating the obvious is not being disgusting. Almost everyone here thought we had our decade man in 2012. To top off his struggles, he's a hot bed of controversy. There is no positive outcome with him at this point. Cutting him lose is not a win. It's a huge freaking loss. We all realize that. But at some point you have to make the decision to move on and we're at that point.
 
That's BS Mike. You are so attached to Griffin you are not being objective. There was not one "disgusting" thing said about him. No one proclaimed joy over his injury. But many of us see him for what he has shown to be. Stating the obvious is not being disgusting. Almost everyone here thought we had our decade man in 2012. To top off his struggles, he's a hot bed of controversy. There is no positive outcome with him at this point. Cutting him lose is not a win. It's a huge freaking loss. We all realize that. But at some point you have to make the decision to move on and we're at that point.

Uh huh. Except there was, I quoted it, and backed it up. You don't have to like anything I say. Ever.
 
One thing that was refreshing was watching a game and seeing the focus be on the team rather than one individual.

The Redskins are a rebuilding team. There are good news stories about guys like Preston Smith, Jackson Jeffcoat, Moses, Jamison Crowder, Matt Jones that hopefully over time are going to help improve the compete level of the Redskins in the NFC East.

Kirk Cousins is in the same position as many of these other players. A guy with some talent that may or may not end up being a contributor on a contending team down the road, but someone that competes and understands the offense and can run it well enough that we can envision GROWTH and IMPROVEMENT by the UNIT.

What's ironic is that in his first two series in the game, Colt McCoy showed the kind of 'off script' playmaking ability rolling out and finding secondary receivers that is really at the heart of what we have NOT seen from Griffin in the past 2 plus years since he decided he wanted to be a Peyton Manning type drop back passer.

And McCoy has the most limited arm of the bunch.

Anyone else feel a 5,000 pound weight come off this team with Griffin inactive for the game and all of the issues surrounding him in a basket with the lid firmly on top? :)

Sometimes it really is addition by subtraction.


Dallas radio was reporting all day yesterday that Kirk is starting game 1. NFL network acted like they didn't have a clue. I wanted to see Kirk get the reps last night and was happy with what I saw. The best part of it all is that pre-season is not an indicator of the plays we'll run game 1. Game 1 will not resemble anything we've thrown out there yet. That's good for Kirk and will give him a boost or some advantage or confidence. He showed lots of confidence last night.
 
Is it me or does Kirk look like Chad Pennington? I just see no arm strength on that kid. I hold my breath every time he throws it.

EDIT: Yeah ok, I don't want to be some big downer when the team actually played not bad last night. Kirk's a smart guy and he does have his strengths and he played well last night. I just think his throws look awfully soft.

here's my take: arm strength is ok. I know what you mean on the visuals.

his accuracy last night leaves a lot to be desired.

on the bright side - he is one lucky dude. watched the game again today and there were many plays that could have turned out very differently for which the margin was very small.

per previous....first game in a while for Cousins to work with the first team.

love Preston Smith! this guy is gonna be a round for a long time.
 
Short some miracle, Griffin will be considered one of the biggest bust QBs at the price we paid ever. And that's a fair assessment if you ask me.
 
here's my take: arm strength is ok. I know what you mean on the visuals.

his accuracy last night leaves a lot to be desired.

on the bright side - he is one lucky dude. watched the game again today and there were many plays that could have turned out very differently for which the margin was very small.

per previous....first game in a while for Cousins to work with the first team.

love Preston Smith! this guy is gonna be a round for a long time.

I'm curious about the accuracy statement. 20-27 with 3 clear drops - that's pretty accurate fan. Note I didn't say perfect - balls don't have to be perfect, just catchable. I mean, what do you want? :)
 
Uh huh. Except there was, I quoted it, and backed it up. You don't have to like anything I say. Ever.

What was the quote? This? "biggest bust in sports history" ? Or was it in another thread? There's nothing disgusting about that statement. It's an opinion that seems pretty accurate at this point. Maybe he goes somewhere and turns it around, but I don't see it.

It isn't about liking what you say. This is a place to share and debate opinions. I didn't see anyone attacking RG in any way other than to point out he's not gotten it done. Doesn't matter how you parse out the blame, we are where we are. Maybe I missed it, but all I saw were guys stating there opinions on where he is right now and what we want or expect to happen. I don't get emotionally invested in individual players. We don't know them or anything about them. We see such a small microcosm of who they really are, and that is mostly tailored for public consumption. I don't care if he goes somewhere and succeeds or fails or leaves football all together. He's set for life financially for playing a game. What I want is what's best for the Washington Redskins. Right now that is to cut him lose and move forward with a complete rebuild.
 
Just fast forwarded through and watched all his throws. Most were on target away from the defenders grasp. He had a couple misses. He had one that would have been a pick if the throw didn't hit the dirt. It was the only play I saw him stare down the receiver. He looked the receiver before the snap and then looked him down as soon as it was snapped. The DB saw his eyes and broke on it but ball was in the dirt. On the deflected TD, one of the receivers screwed up the route. They both ran to the same spot, not just the same area. I think Kirk mentioned it was cover 0 with no deep help, so the throw was low risk. It was perfectly targeted. He had another questionable throw where a LB was pursuing down the line, which Kirk didn't see. Ended in an incomplete, but maybe could have been a pick if the LB was looking back. He wasn't in pursuit of the intended receiver, so wasn't looking for the ball. All in all, his accuracy looked good to me. He missed a few, but every QB does every single game. Definitely areas of improvement, no way we shouldn't be encouraged by what we saw. Doesn't mean he'll be an effective starter. Still don't know if we have one on this roster. But he's earning his opportunity. I was really impressed watching him work the field. No idea if he always made the right decision on his throws. Only the coaches no. But he definitely worked the field with his eyes, not settling in on any single target.

Harbuagh's a complete ass. Just saw the post half on-field interview. Your team craps itself in the last two minutes. Is the interviewer not supposed to ask about the relevant plays.
 
What was the quote? This? "biggest bust in sports history" ? Or was it in another thread? There's nothing disgusting about that statement. It's an opinion that seems pretty accurate at this point. Maybe he goes somewhere and turns it around, but I don't see it.

It isn't about liking what you say. This is a place to share and debate opinions. I didn't see anyone attacking RG in any way other than to point out he's not gotten it done. Doesn't matter how you parse out the blame, we are where we are. Maybe I missed it, but all I saw were guys stating there opinions on where he is right now and what we want or expect to happen. I don't get emotionally invested in individual players. We don't know them or anything about them. We see such a small microcosm of who they really are, and that is mostly tailored for public consumption. I don't care if he goes somewhere and succeeds or fails or leaves football all together. He's set for life financially for playing a game. What I want is what's best for the Washington Redskins. Right now that is to cut him lose and move forward with a complete rebuild.
So, your opinion about me being full of bs and calling him one of the biggest busts in history is ok, but mine deserves this? Like I said, you don't have to like what I said. Ever.

Jordan Campbell is a beast. That is a bug ass dude hitting linebackers.

Harbaugh is a complete prick and needs a slapping in the mouth.
 
Word on the Twitterverse right now (and it's guys like Adam Shefter tweeting it) "Football people want to move on from RG3 - but ownership not on board'.

It's about to get real interesting.
 

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