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Random Commanders Thoughts

Boone,
I was paraphrasing Gruden's response to the press.

I agree with the sentiment of his answer, I think a lot of folks thought Grif should have been pulled after so many shots prior to the concussion, if Grif wants to play, he's gotta learn.

Don't know if 'pocket presence' is something he can learn but if he can figure out how to at least protect himself we're better off.

Thanks for clarifying, couldn't figure out what your position was. I agree with you. The idea that we have to be afraid to let a starter play in the pre-season, I think it's a pretty good indicator of how fragile our confidence is as a fanbase.
 
I cringe at the thought of RG3 going up against a defense like the Ravens on Saturday. But there is hope, right?


 
Gruden has already commented on the Detroit game regarding Grif's tough time.

Essentially asked if his QB did not get his bell rung would he have kept him in.

YES, probably at least another series..... the whole offense needs the work.... we were a 4 win team last year....

not sure why folks aren't addressing the obvious for this game: a new LT, complete rookie right side of the line, under-sized center (a known issue), and a LG known as a better run blocker than pass blocker. QB who is a second slow on decision-making. the coaching staff knows this is a weak set-up. yes...work em out if that is going to be the starting set-up. but don't get your QB slaughtered in the process. Gruden is being a lot more clever in how he is going about things compared to last season in terms of how he masks his thinking. He's still a second tier coach in my book. He doesn't fix anything! McL is gonna have to do the heavy lifting for him.
 
John Keim ‏@john_keim · 2h2 hours ago  Virginia, USA
The Redskins worked out FB/TE Evan Rodriguez today. spent time on Tampa's practice squad last year. 5 starts w/Bears in 2012.

Bears? Evan Rodriguez arrested for second time this offseason | ProFootballTalk

It's not a huge deal. Just understand the next time you hear McLovin say that he only wants high character types......it's bs.

I'm sure he'd probably prefer a clean record, but he's not scared of rap sheets.

I'm no fan of this type of signing either. That being said, with less then 3 weeks to the season opener, and loosing 2 of 3 TE's for sure, and the third with a real question mark about injury issues, there scrambling to find bodies. Not like there's a limitless pool of TE's out there at this time of the year, and it looks like the team is not real comfortable going with a question mark, and a group of rookies behind that. Even if we do sign the guy, once cuts begin, a better option may come available, and we can send him packing.
 
not sure why folks aren't addressing the obvious for this game: a new LT, complete rookie right side of the line, under-sized center (a known issue), and a LG known as a better run blocker than pass blocker. QB who is a second slow on decision-making. the coaching staff knows this is a weak set-up. yes...work em out if that is going to be the starting set-up. but don't get your QB slaughtered in the process. Gruden is being a lot more clever in how he is going about things compared to last season in terms of how he masks his thinking. He's still a second tier coach in my book. He doesn't fix anything! McL is gonna have to do the heavy lifting for him.

While I completely understand your sentiment about getting him the reps behind his starting line, my only counters would be the fact that it's not exactly guaranteed that he won't be playing behind reserve O-linemen during the season, and it's negates his reps in game speed. It's a serious catch 22 for anyone. He's getting his head beaten in, but the only way he's going to get better is life fire reps.
 
I'm no fan of this type of signing either. That being said, with less then 3 weeks to the season opener, and loosing 2 of 3 TE's for sure, and the third with a real question mark about injury issues, there scrambling to find bodies. Not like there's a limitless pool of TE's out there at this time of the year, and it looks like the team is not real comfortable going with a question mark, and a group of rookies behind that. Even if we do sign the guy, once cuts begin, a better option may come available, and we can send him packing.

Did we sign him?
 
2 topics being discussed simultaneously so I'll respond to both.

1. Signing guys with Character issues. Until a year or two ago I'd have been right with you Boone, I've always been very critical of signing low character guys. I like to root for teams that do it the right way with good guys. That has changed for me however. I'm friggin sick of losing. I gave up my season tix, have soccer games planned on several Sundays and have altogether lost a lot of the enthusiasm I've been known for as a fan. So at this stage I really don't give a crap who they sign, just win freakin games. I know that's a bit lame, but being a satellite fan that travels 1000 miles round trip for the games I've put in a lot more effort and passion for games than the average fan has and after 20 years of it I'm broken down enough to not give a crap about character. Just win freakin games.

2. Griffin absolutely should be playing as much as possible, I don't dispute that. But if you're going to essentially throw a backup rookie line out there to protect him against one of the most brutal and physical lines in football in Detroit and they don't protect and are getting him killed then yea you should pull your head out of your cranial cavity and sub in a backup at QB as well. It's the kinda of crap that this team has done to ruin multiple QB's. Bush league.
 
2 topics being discussed simultaneously so I'll respond to both.



2. Griffin absolutely should be playing as much as possible, I don't dispute that. But if you're going to essentially throw a backup rookie line out there to protect him against one of the most brutal and physical lines in football in Detroit and they don't protect and are getting him killed then yea you should pull your head out of your cranial cavity and sub in a backup at QB as well. It's the kinda of crap that this team has done to ruin multiple QB's. Bush league.


Are we gonna do that week 2 against the Rams if Williams is hurt?
 
It's week 2 of preseason dude, not week 2 of regular season. We don't even game plan...apples and oranges.
 
Just to clarify...whole different ballgame when players who are dinged and wouldn't play in a preseason game than a regular season game when they would play. We have all hands on deck and all of our weapons out there and it changes things significantly.
 
Just to clarify...whole different ballgame when players who are dinged and wouldn't play in a preseason game than a regular season game when they would play. We have all hands on deck and all of our weapons out there and it changes things significantly.

Yeah but those guys 'dinged up' have a lot better track record then Griffin. They also have proven they don't necessarily need the reps at a core level. Desean Jackson doesn't need to go out and play against a bunch of 2's to get better at the deep ball. Trent Williams doesn't need to go out and get live fire reps to get better at Pass Pro. Ryan Kerrigan doesn't need reps to work on bull rush. Griffin needs reps in pocket presence.
 
Yes but you miss the point. IF you want him to get reps then protect him. If he's getting killed he's not getting reps. You have an actual NFL HC willing to rip another HC it was so bad. I can't remember the last time I saw that.
 
CT, I'm genuinely curious ... how would you have had Jay "protect him" in those series against the Lions? Suiting up Trent wasn't an option once the game started ... and we don't know what the actual play calls, hot reads, etc., were that Bob may or may not have executed. Seems to me if we needed to get Bob some reps handling the basic passing game, Jay's options were either to let Bob and the OL try to get their collective shit together, or pull Bob altogether since he couldn't seem to help himself out there.

Am I missing another option that would have allowed him to get Bob pocket reps, and also "protect him?"
 
Screens, quick passes, roll outs, hand offs, play action. Any and all of those would have protected him more than just standing upright in the pocket.
 
We've covered this ground before, Mike. But it's worth getting into it a bit more (hey, it's only Tuesday). :)

Robert was on the field for 16 plays.

7 were runs.

Where we don't seem to be on the same page is on what happened on each of the nine times he dropped back to pass. I've watched each of them several times, and unless I totally missed one, not one of the nine plays called for seven-step, read and throw options. They were all either 3- or 5-step drops. Making them exactly the kind of short, quick passes you're talking about. And there were short options open on each and every one of those plays that Bob either didn't see or didn't choose to go to.

I'm not putting it all on Bob--the pass pro was awful. But it's unfair to put it all on the OL or Gruden, either. An NFL QB HAS to be able to read a defense at the LOS and know where the pressure is likely to come from ... and HAS to be able to react to a breakdown (like Scherff getting pushed back into his face), slide in the pocket to find a lane and get rid of the ball to the open man ... and HAS to know, when all else fails, to get down and protect both the ball and himself.

That's what I didn't see from Bob, and why I have serious doubts he'll be any better at the basic pocket-management stuff we're going to need from our QB if we're going to ever right the ship and start beating some people.
 
Hey man, you asked what you should do. That's what you should do. I didn't see a single roll out or screen ran but I'll take your word for it.
 
Ok so he had 9 drop backs. Say you call 2 screens, a roll right, and a TE seam. You've now taken 4 of those 9 plays, and taken away those reps from his experience. That's 40% less then an already very limited amount of snaps where he's responsible for pre-snap reads and pocket conditioning.

I do find myself wishing he could have gotten into SOME sort of a rhythm, and maybe you're right, roll outs and screens could have started that process, but like I said, no matter what he does, it's going to be scrutinized and evaluated, and opinions are going to be formed.
 
Sure, but you also take away a stinger and concussion. You take away two major hits to your qb you don't want and you save the drama.

He may have even been able to stay in longer since he most likely wouldn't have gotten the concussion.
 
CT, I'm genuinely curious ... how would you have had Jay "protect him" in those series against the Lions? Suiting up Trent wasn't an option once the game started ... and we don't know what the actual play calls, hot reads, etc., were that Bob may or may not have executed. Seems to me if we needed to get Bob some reps handling the basic passing game, Jay's options were either to let Bob and the OL try to get their collective shit together, or pull Bob altogether since he couldn't seem to help himself out there.

Am I missing another option that would have allowed him to get Bob pocket reps, and also "protect him?"

Take him out after the third offensive series.

His counterpart, Stafford, only played two offensive series'. Griffin played four. It's the second pre-season game. Leaving Bob out there was not necessary and (obviously) dangerous given the circumstances.
 
Stafford is an established, arguably elite QB. Bob is ... not.

What would be interesting is to see how many series the other 30 starting QB's got over the weekend though. And to maybe get a sense of what other teams with projected starters short on experience got.

Also, I just put a breakdown of Bob's nine pass plays in the Development Tracker thread. Would love to get some feedback on that from you and others, particularly if anyone has the time/inclination to review the videos ... to me they paint a pretty clear picture of two things. One, pretty crappy pass pro on several of them, and two, a QB who had no idea what to do in response.
 

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