• Welcome to BGO! We know you will have questions as you become familiar with the software. Please take a moment to read our New BGO User Guide which will give you a great start. If you have questions, post them in the Feedback and Tech Support Forum, or feel free to message any available Staff Member.

Random Commanders Thoughts

Boone said:
Disagree - Portis was a bonafide #1 RB and probably the best overall player we've had in the decade before Bob arrived. I've never bought into the whole 'shutdown corner' mystique. Bailey was a helluva corner but my personal opinion is that having a game-changing RB has more impact on wins and losses than a great corner. I know a lot of people may see it the other way. But Portis was underrated while Bailey has if anything been overrated over the years. Given the circumstances (Bailey was leaving one way or the other) it was a win win for both teams.
Click to expand...

A 12-time pro bowler? A future HOF'er? Versus a guy whose entire career was only 9 years?

Plus a second rounder on top of it?

License and registration please. :)
 
9 years is a long time to be a starting RB. It's a different position. Funny how the pro Bowl is a joke until someone wants to use it as the gold standard in an argument :) is Bailey, at his position, a better player than Portis was at his? Probably. But we got 'bent over'? Bailey was leaving. One way or the other. Period. So i'd say we did pretty well given the situation.
 
Boone said:
9 years is a long time to be a starting RB. It's a different position. Funny how the pro Bowl is a joke until someone wants to use it as the gold standard in an argument :) is Bailey, at his position, a better player than Portis was at his? Probably. But we got 'bent over'? Bailey was leaving. One way or the other. Period. So i'd say we did pretty well given the situation.
Click to expand...

I can't remember if it was known that Bailey was leaving for sure or not, in which case we had little leverage. Still got fleeced throwing in the additional second, however. We harp on building through the draft all the time, yet here we are throwing second rounders into a deal to sweeten the pot, to trade for a position that's arguably the easiest to find talent in the later rounds, forget about the 2nd.

And I agree, pro-bowls are a joke. He was a seven time all-pro, however, which is pretty significant.

Sent from my XT1060 using Tapatalk
 
Btw - the reason for the 2nd round pick was that Bailey was in his last contract year while Portis had several more years in his. Portis, at the time, was coming off back to back 1500+ yard seasons as well. So while it might look like we got screwed now, at the time it was not a head-scratching trade. Add into the equation that Bailey basically gave the Redskins an ultimatum and the Skins tried to do right by him, and I think it's hard to criticize the move.
 
We got something for a guy that was going to leave to save his marriage.

Portis only cost us the pick we sent with bailey and as far as I'm concerned we got the better end of the deal.

It doesn't matter what anyone thinks about bailey. The option was get something for him, or have him walk when his contract was up.

Portis was one of very few bright stars over that period. No one played harder than him.
 
Well, I probably opened the can of worms with 'equal value' when 'value' would probably not be disputed.
 
Boone said:
Well, I probably opened the can of worms with 'equal value' when 'value' would probably not be disputed.
Click to expand...

I wouldn't dispute we got a fantastic redskin and extremely hard worker or of the deal.

Sent from my XT1060 using Tapatalk
 
McD5 said:
A 12-time pro bowler? A future HOF'er? Versus a guy whose entire career was only 9 years?

Plus a second rounder on top of it?

License and registration please. :)
Click to expand...
I'm sorry but Champ Bailey is the most overrated corner of the last twenty years. How in the hell he ever got this "invincible shutdown corner" moniker is beyond me.

I would say that the added bonus for Champ leaving DC is that it also got him away from Amani Toomer,who absolutely owned Champ on a regular basis.
 
DieselPwr44 said:
I'm sorry but Champ Bailey is the most overrated corner of the last twenty years. How in the hell he ever got this "invincible shutdown corner" moniker is beyond me.

I would say that the added bonus for Champ leaving DC is that it also got him away from Amani Toomer,who absolutely owned Champ on a regular basis.
Click to expand...

I wasn't going to say anyting because I didn't want to start it, but since you did... that's exactly how I felt too.

I remember my dad always called him Chump Bailey when he got burned

"GOOD JOB CHUMP, YOU JACKASS"

I recall hearing that quite a bit...
 
DieselPwr44 said:
I'm sorry but Champ Bailey is the most overrated corner of the last twenty years. How in the hell he ever got this "invincible shutdown corner" moniker is beyond me.

I would say that the added bonus for Champ leaving DC is that it also got him away from Amani Toomer,who absolutely owned Champ on a regular basis.
Click to expand...

Most overrated? That might be a stretch.

Have you compared his stats to Darrell Green?
 
Last edited:
While Roland was a great player, I never did care for him from day one. In a rookie interview, when asked about having great players to learn from, he said it was an honor to learn from the best..... Deion.

That was enough for me right then and there.

At this point, Roland = availability issues.
 
McD5 said:
Most overrated? That might be a stretch.
Click to expand...

IMO, in order to be a shutdown "elite" corner, you cannot have a gaping hole in your game.

You want to know how to beat Champ Bailey? Throw the ball over his head. He can't locate it and if your QB is accurate, he gets burned every time.

As long as the ball is in front of him,where he can see it, he's awesome.

That's a very good player IMO. Great, All world shutdown corner? Umm no.

Another thing that killed me about Bailey..his last year here...Spurrier Skins vs Brady and Belichick...Champ comes up in run support, forces a fumble. The ball is laying on the ground right in front of him..all he has to do is pick it up and take off.

What does the GOAT do? Jump up and start clapping..for himself!! meanwhile the Patriots dive on the ball and recover. Contract year, you want (in his words) to be paid and you pull that crap?

Shawn Springs played better for us than Champ ever did.
 
Bailey was a good corner. He was rarely out of position and that made it tough to throw on him. It did seem to happen more often than it should, however, that when a ball was thrown his way and he was covering well and in position to make a play, that he simply couldn't make the play on the ball.

He was not Deion or Hall, who would take chances and use their athleticism to make up the difference. He just covered really well, which discouraged QBs from throwing his way. But when a QB did test him, he looked, to me, painfully average.

Because of this I think he was vastly overrated. He was not a guy who fundamentally changed the way a defense played, the way Green or Deion did. He was just a real solid player. I liked the guy a lot, but I just never understood the absolute reverence the media had for him. Both when he was with us and when he moved on.

Having the benefit of hindsight, I do think we got the short end of the trade. That second rounder really tipped the scales heavily in Denver's favor. Straight-up, I might still say I'd rather have had Bailey than Portis, but that's a very very close call. Portis led our team in rushing for five years, something only two other players in Redskin history have done ... Riggins and Brown. But as it has been pointed out, Bailey is still playing.
 
Boone said:
Disagree - Portis was a bonafide #1 RB and probably the best overall player we've had in the decade before Bob arrived. I've never bought into the whole 'shutdown corner' mystique. Bailey was a helluva corner but my personal opinion is that having a game-changing RB has more impact on wins and losses than a great corner. I know a lot of people may see it the other way. But Portis was underrated while Bailey has if anything been overrated over the years. Given the circumstances (Bailey was leaving one way or the other) it was a win win for both teams.
Click to expand...

If it had been a player for player swap I would agree but that 2nd rounder was a killer and totally skews the thing in favor of Denver. And over rate the "shutdown corner" all you want, my friend, we lament the state of our secondary every Sunday and have since Champ left. No doubt things would have been different if Sean had lived but without a bonafide #1 CB we have been hurting.
 
No matter how good, or bad our corners have been, the lack of even decent safety play since Sean, has been the bigger secondary problem. And until we get better safety play, no corner we have, or will have, can look very good consistently.
 
I don't really disagree about the 2nd rounder ... I was addressing Bailey vs. Portis in terms of talent/impact mostly.
 
Straight up, Bailey for Portis, I think it would've been a great trade. Even throwing in a later pick like a 4th rounder, I'd have been okay with. 2nd round picks are often 1st round talent that slipped through the cracks...too much.

And then Shamahan wasted it on Tatum Bell, lolz.

Sent from my XT1060 using Tapatalk
 
Ax said:
No matter how good, or bad our corners have been, the lack of even decent safety play since Sean, has been the bigger secondary problem. And until we get better safety play, no corner we have, or will have, can look very good consistently.
Click to expand...

I think lack of pass rush has been our secondary's biggest problem.

Sent from my XT1060 using Tapatalk
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Total: 3, Members: 0, Guests: 3)

Who Read This Thread (Total Members: 22)

Help Users
As we enjoy today's conversations, let's remember our dear friends 'Docsandy', Sandy Zier-Teitler, and 'Posse Lover', Michael Huffman, who would dearly love to be here with us today! We love and miss you guys ❤

You haven't joined any rooms.

    You haven't joined any rooms.
    Top