• Welcome to BGO! We know you will have questions as you become familiar with the software. Please take a moment to read our New BGO User Guide which will give you a great start. If you have questions, post them in the Feedback and Tech Support Forum, or feel free to message any available Staff Member.

Random Commanders Thoughts

All the QB talk is the tree ... the forest is whether or not "the team" has a brain to figure out how to build and sustain a team solid enough where having a real QB can push them into legit contender status.

Totally agree with all you said, and this is the crux of the matter.

This team has taken over two decades to pull itself out of the mire, and now we look like we're poised to be consistently good again and sustain it. But it feels like we're at a really precarious point where something like losing Kirk could be the tipping point. I don't want to see a domino effect which ends up with us in rebuild mode again. Teams like the Patriots have the culture and the leadership and the stability to weather something like this, I have no doubts that when Brady retires they'll be ok. I don't have that confidence with the Skins.

To a degree it's probably a bit of ingrained pessimism in the Franchise, but this is my big fear. Can we sustain our progress going forwards.
 
All the QB talk is the tree ... the forest is whether or not "the team" has a brain to figure out how to build and sustain a team solid enough where having a real QB can push them into legit contender status.

That's a very reasonable take (no surprise!). The pink elephant in the room though is that the ultimate (and historically shaky) state of the 'forest' directly impacts confidence that the 'tree' situation will be managed with any degree of competence. I myself, Bulldog reassurances aside, am highly skeptical this team can find a highly skilled solution under center for the long haul in the event we move on from Cousins. Why should fans have ANY confidence? I also think, the 2nd the departure of Cousins looks likely, fans begin devaluing him. He's 'better than average'. He's 'competent'. He's 'good' but 'not great'.

He's a helluva QB. No, he hasn't taken us to the Promised Land, but I disagree that we know what his ceiling is. He's very accurate, very smart, and he's a leader. I think he will continue to improve. I won't be surprised if he takes it to the next level this year.

Of course if he walks, life will go on. The Redskins will go on. But this bullshit narrative some are pushing that we won't miss a beat without Kirk Cousins, we'll just find a great replacement in a QB rich 2018 draft with our 20- something first round pick... I'm not drinking that Koolaid. I'm not even willing to take the dixie cup out of your hand :)
 
Well, I ain't tryin' to pitch kool aid here, so if that's how it sounded I'll blame the fact I'm badly out of practice postin'. :)

I am totally on board with Kirk being the best QB we've had here in a couple millenia. And I'm totally on board with the chance he could still make that final leap from 'legit starter' to 'elite/franchise QB'. What I am still holding out on is the argument that he is, right now, a 'pay him whatever it takes even if that amount ends up limiting our ability to keep building the rest of the team over the next few years' asset.

We have him this year, already budgeted.

We can have him next year, given the cap projections.

If after that, we still want to keep him around, and he asks for the moon and stars and Dan's first-born, we can hopefully say to him ... dude ... been fun ... but because we have a brain, we've got these guys we've drafted the last few years against this very possibility, so we think we're gonna bid ya adieu at this point. Here's your complementary walker and rocking chair.

I dunno. I'm just ready for some football.
 
Well, I ain't tryin' to pitch kool aid here, so if that's how it sounded I'll blame the fact I'm badly out of practice postin'. :)

I am totally on board with Kirk being the best QB we've had here in a couple millenia. And I'm totally on board with the chance he could still make that final leap from 'legit starter' to 'elite/franchise QB'. What I am still holding out on is the argument that he is, right now, a 'pay him whatever it takes even if that amount ends up limiting our ability to keep building the rest of the team over the next few years' asset.

We have him this year, already budgeted.

We can have him next year, given the cap projections.

If after that, we still want to keep him around, and he asks for the moon and stars and Dan's first-born, we can hopefully say to him ... dude ... been fun ... but because we have a brain, we've got these guys we've drafted the last few years against this very possibility, so we think we're gonna bid ya adieu at this point. Here's your complementary walker and rocking chair.

I dunno. I'm just ready for some football.

You should know that part wasn't directed at you.

My point is, if we know he's going to demand the moon and the stars (and I think we all agree, that seems certain), and we know we can't and won't pay him the moon and stars, what the hell are we doing? Paying a king's ransom to rent the guy for 1-2 seasons and then getting absolutely nothing for him? That's the rub for me. I can't get my mind around what logic is being applied here?
 
The only logic I see is that, although paying a premium price to do so, it gives the team some time to identify, procure, and develop his replacement.

Beyond that, maybe the organization believes that this team is closer to contending than the majority of the fans do. :doh1:
 
Another danger of just renting is, if he and Pryor become the Burgundy and Gold version of The Dynamic Duo, and he leaves after the season, Pryor just might go with him.

Not worth it to me. I'd rather have Pryor develop with Colt & Nate. two guys much more likely to be on the team in 2018.
 
Clearly this isn't the scenario the team or any of us would choose, but ... I guess the rationale for renting him this year is, that's how much it costs to rent a tagged quarterback. It's a lot of money, no doubt. But it didn't to my knowledge bust our cap this year and keep us from making reasonable roster moves to try to improve the team around him.

I'm not even thinking about 2018 at this point. I know the team is, and I know Kirk is, but I have no idea what the terrain will look like a year from now. So much will depend on how Kirk plays, how the team does around him, how Gruden does, etc. It's hard enough to really know the dynamics between Kirk and team this year, given the actual access/knowledge we have. To try to project it for next year to me is a waste of time.

So for year, we have a competent QB to help keep building our team. He's not cheap, but he's not crippled us financially either. We have a season to play, so I'm cool letting it play out and seeing where the chips fall.

I guess the idea that he walks next year and we don't get much for him doesn't bother me as much as it does some others. He was a fourth round pick, not a bonus baby that cost us draft picks.

As for what his trade value is NOW, well ... we have no way of knowing what that is today, nor projecting what he'll be worth after the 2017 season gets added to his resume. As long as we head into 2018 with a QB our 'brain trust' feels is the best option for the team going forward, I'm going to have to hope that they actually have a better handle on it than so many of us fear they might given the McClexit.
 
On a different note, Happy Birthday to Dumb Dumb Williams.

Try not to get busted again, doofus.
 
I guess the idea that he walks next year and we don't get much for him doesn't bother me as much as it does some others. He was a fourth round pick, not a bonus baby that cost us draft picks.

Well, as always - you have a calm, reasoned opinion. Here's why I don't see the trade aspect the way you do though. Where he was drafted is irrelevant. The goal of trading him isn't to 'get back' the original pick we made. We all know (and he has since demonstrated) that he has 1st round talent and probably should've gone there to begin with. That he didn't seems to be a major driver of his own dissatisfaction.

Sure - we don't know *exactly* what he would bring in a trade. But we know he would be highly sought after and that we'd get something significant out of it. The calculation is whether or not what we could get for him in a trade is > than the value of having Rent-A-Starter for another season? We still have leverage if we choose to use it, both with KC and potential trade partners. We control the uniform he wears for a full 2 years if we want to pay the price to do that. Are QB needy teams who love KC going to want to wait 2 full years to participate in a bidding war that is only going to be more expensive (for a then 32 year old QB)? He's as young as he'll ever be. He's as cheap as he'll ever be. And he can be yours for the low, low price of __________.

Or we can rent him for another year or two and get another playoff loss on our resume before we start all over again with an unknown quantity at QB and surrounding team talent that is another 2 years older.

The smart move is pretty obvious to me.
 
Go 10-6 in 2017 and contend for a playoff spot with Cousins.

Continue to add players in free agency and lock up Pryor and others that may emerge during the season to multi-year deals.

Draft a quarterback in Round 1 or 2. Have him sit behind McCoy for the first 8-10 games of 2018 and begin a new era with a young passer who has by that time a very good team around him.

By paying him $2 or $3M a year on his rookie deal the team will be able to do what the Seahawks did with Wilson and load up on talent at other spots.

If we keep Cousins he is going to have to really elevate his game because we won't be going out and getting those other profile players and he is going to have to raise the team on his own shoulders.

I wonder if at this point he realizes what the expectations will be IF he signs long-term here and gets a big contract.

If things don't go well, it could get hot for him in town pretty quickly.................
 
Of all the opinions I'm seeing here, including my own half baked ones, I think the one person that seems to be making the most reasonable, practical, and clear eyed case for the next year or two is brother bulldog.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
If I were the Redskins, if Trevor Siemian gets the starting nod in Denver again this year, I'd make a play for Paxton Lynch. I think that kid has a bright future and he's a baller. Broncos also picked up Chad Kelly with the last pick of the 2017 draft, and brought in another UDFA QB. So they are not settled on who the eventual QB is going to be. Lynch might be had relatively cheap if Siemian shines and Kelly looks decent enough to hold down the backup role.
 
My point is, if we know he's going to demand the moon and the stars (and I think we all agree, that seems certain), and we know we can't and won't pay him the moon and stars, what the hell are we doing? Paying a king's ransom to rent the guy for 1-2 seasons and then getting absolutely nothing for him? That's the rub for me. I can't get my mind around what logic is being applied here?

Bruce Allen to Kirk Cousins:

 
If I were the Redskins, if Trevor Siemian gets the starting nod in Denver again this year, I'd make a play for Paxton Lynch. I think that kid has a bright future and he's a baller. Broncos also picked up Chad Kelly with the last pick of the 2017 draft, and brought in another UDFA QB. So they are not settled on who the eventual QB is going to be. Lynch might be had relatively cheap if Siemian shines and Kelly looks decent enough to hold down the backup role.

Paxton Lynch grew up and lives about ten minutes away from me. In a super tiny town named Deltona.

On draft night, he held his viewing party at a bowling alley.
 
I should be posting this in the Tech thread - but I can't get to it - which is why I'm posting this in the first place.
I can't get access to any of the sub-forums, like SOW, 5 O'Clock, etc.
I can only get to the home page, and then get into individual threads like this one, but only by clicking it through the "News Feed" on the right. But if I go back to the top and click "Sons of Washington", it just takes me to the home page, and there's no options to get to any of the forums.

EDIT : It's acting different now. Instead of going to the home page when I click the "SOW" link in a thread, it takes me to the error message below. I know it's not the way I have it bookmarked, or how I'm spelling it, because I'm getting these issues while clicking links within the site.

"Invalid Forum specified. If you followed a valid link, please notify the administrator"
 
Last edited:

Users Who Are Viewing This Thread (Total: 6, Members: 0, Guests: 6)

Help Users
As we enjoy today's conversations, let's remember our dear friends 'Docsandy', Sandy Zier-Teitler, and 'Posse Lover', Michael Huffman, who would dearly love to be here with us today! We love and miss you guys ❤

You haven't joined any rooms.

    You haven't joined any rooms.
    Top