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  1. #1
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    Default Thousands of jobs to be cut at DoD; memo

    Democrats just can't help themselves

    http://www.federalnewsradio.com/?nid=35&sid=2311661


    Thousands of federal employees and contractors are about to be shown the door on one of the five sides of the Pentagon.

    In memo, entitled "Track Four Efficiency Initiatives Decision", Defense Secretary Robert Gates directs the services and Pentagon agencies to make huge cuts in more than just spending.

    The Federal Times reports the "positions include 176 civilian senior executive positions - 97 members of the Senior Executive Service, 21 senior level and scientific professionals, five Defense intelligence senior executives and 53 Defense intelligence senior level positions - and 33 highly qualified experts."

    Especially hard hit, reports DefenseNews, is the Missile Defense Agency (MDA), which has been "directed to eliminate 500 contractor support positions in 2011 and another 500 in 2012. This will save $225 million, according to the memo."

    Wired's Danger Room reports that's in addition to another "130 from the office of the undersecretary for policy and 364 from the military's health care management organization".

    According to Federal Times, Gates said the department must lower drastically the maximum number of senior mentors and advisors (highly qualified experts or HQEs) it "allows itself to employ, from 2,500 down to 350 or less."

    "I think that's a pretty substantial cut," Carol Bonosaro, president of Senior Executives Association, which represents the government's top managers, said of the civilian cuts. "Maybe I would have expected about 100 at most," she told the Federal Times.
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    James Madison

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    I truly hate hearing people are losing their jobs. Especially when I would bet money on the fact that someone who knew what they were doing could find ways to cut expenditures with minimal loss of jobs.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goaldeje View Post
    I truly hate hearing people are losing their jobs. Especially when I would bet money on the fact that someone who knew what they were doing could find ways to cut expenditures with minimal loss of jobs.
    Posted via BGO Mobile Device
    Uh, Goaldje, we're talking about Washington, remember?

    If DARPA gets hit I'm gonna be upset.

    (Selfish, I know, but I am a big DARPA fan)
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    I'm giving it a 2-4 year window. Looking for improvement in all areas. Redskins, you're on the clock.

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    We have been talking about cuts, here we go. I hate that any part of our defense has to be cut, but cuts need to be made everywhere. I don't know enough about the Pentagon's make-up, but it doesn't appear that the troops in the field will be directly affected by this. Can any of you military guys confirm this?

    Next up, that abomination called Obamacare! Oh yeah right, like that will happen now. We can thank Sarah Palin for not having a majority in the Senate! Then the GOP could have repealed that monstrosity of an expenditure. I swear it was her meddling in NV and DE that lost us 2 more seats that we could have picked up.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elephant View Post
    We have been talking about cuts, here we go. I hate that any part of our defense has to be cut, but cuts need to be made everywhere. I don't know enough about the Pentagon's make-up, but it doesn't appear that the troops in the field will be directly affected by this. Can any of you military guys confirm this?

    Next up, that abomination called Obamacare! Oh yeah right, like that will happen now. We can thank Sarah Palin for not having a majority in the Senate! Then the GOP could have repealed that monstrosity of an expenditure. I swear it was her meddling in NV and DE that lost us 2 more seats that we could have picked up.
    It is easy to blame sarah it is hardewr to blame the ignorant fools that voted for someone else
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    Quote Originally Posted by Goaldeje View Post
    I truly hate hearing people are losing their jobs. Especially when I would bet money on the fact that someone who knew what they were doing could find ways to cut expenditures with minimal loss of jobs.
    Posted via BGO Mobile Device

    it's not as those these senior folks won't find jobs pretty swiftly in the private sector - that revolving door has been swinging for decades. there is a need to pare back the top heavy top. there's also going to be $6 Billion in contractor cuts as well with a grand total of DoD cuts of $13.6 Billion over five years. The other, undiscussed, part of this effort is expansion in government workforce at DoD - a transition that has been ongoing over the last two years to terminate contractor jobs and replace with government. while there is no doubt a lot needs to be trimmed...including drawing down hopeless commitments in Afghanisatn (my opinion)....there has not been a corresponding reduction in National Security/Military commitments. More work for fewer people! What a great morale builder!
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    Indiana

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    Quote Originally Posted by fansince62 View Post
    it's not as those these senior folks won't find jobs pretty swiftly in the private sector - that revolving door has been swinging for decades. there is a need to pare back the top heavy top. there's also going to be $6 Billion in contractor cuts as well with a grand total of DoD cuts of $13.6 Billion over five years. The other, undiscussed, part of this effort is expansion in government workforce at DoD - a transition that has been ongoing over the last two years to terminate contractor jobs and replace with government. while there is no doubt a lot needs to be trimmed...including drawing down hopeless commitments in Afghanisatn (my opinion)....there has not been a corresponding reduction in National Security/Military commitments. More work for fewer people! What a great morale builder!
    You might want to sit down and take a deep breath, fansince.

    I agree with you.

    I think I mentioned before that I used to work for a DoD contractor-cost plus contracts, of course.

    It was like pigs at a trough.
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    I'm giving it a 2-4 year window. Looking for improvement in all areas. Redskins, you're on the clock.

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    Quote Originally Posted by servumtuum View Post
    Uh, Goaldje, we're talking about Washington, remember?

    If DARPA gets hit I'm gonna be upset.

    (Selfish, I know, but I am a big DARPA fan)
    Serv...what's the tech transition rate for DARPA?
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    Quote Originally Posted by servumtuum View Post
    You might want to sit down and take a deep breath, fansince.

    I agree with you.

    I think I mentioned before that I used to work for a DoD contractor-cost plus contracts, of course.

    It was like pigs at a trough.

    I'm not anti-contractor....

    What will happen down the road is totally predictable. There will be fewer military to lead projects, provide requirements, etc., etc. The GS types who already depend heavily on contractors will not be able to make up for the increased workload with shrinking contract support. not saying every gov type is a loser....there are many outstanding public servants who carry the load...and....shhhhh...can no kidding lead! just not enough...and too few with actual operational experience.
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    Quote Originally Posted by Elephant View Post
    We have been talking about cuts, here we go. I hate that any part of our defense has to be cut, but cuts need to be made everywhere. I don't know enough about the Pentagon's make-up, but it doesn't appear that the troops in the field will be directly affected by this. Can any of you military guys confirm this?

    Next up, that abomination called Obamacare! Oh yeah right, like that will happen now. We can thank Sarah Palin for not having a majority in the Senate! Then the GOP could have repealed that monstrosity of an expenditure. I swear it was her meddling in NV and DE that lost us 2 more seats that we could have picked up.
    they are cutting some miltary Necc whih i fall under has been ynder speculation to be looking to cut 8000 jobs some military and civilian mixed at least 1 battalion of 600 personnel will get axed with draw dons continuing for a few year
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    Quote Originally Posted by redskins26 View Post
    they are cutting some miltary Necc whih i fall under has been ynder speculation to be looking to cut 8000 jobs some military and civilian mixed at least 1 battalion of 600 personnel will get axed with draw dons continuing for a few year
    My heart goes out to you. I have been partially employed since I graduated college 2 years ago and it's tough.
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  12. #12

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    Quote Originally Posted by Elephant View Post
    We have been talking about cuts, here we go. I hate that any part of our defense has to be cut, but cuts need to be made everywhere. I don't know enough about the Pentagon's make-up, but it doesn't appear that the troops in the field will be directly affected by this. Can any of you military guys confirm this?

    Next up, that abomination called Obamacare! Oh yeah right, like that will happen now. We can thank Sarah Palin for not having a majority in the Senate! Then the GOP could have repealed that monstrosity of an expenditure. I swear it was her meddling in NV and DE that lost us 2 more seats that we could have picked up.
    El: Palin backed TP candidates the locals pushed....i.e., you take what the pool provides. And in NV...that was as corrupt an election as it gets. Reid is just another political crook.

    of course the troops will be affected......there are already huge problems with modernization. they are about to get worse. at a deeper level....does it strike you that risking one's life in Afghanistan is an honorable effort when the CiC states we will be outta there in a yr and a half?
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    I think most everyone that has served or works in DoD knows there are vast areas that can be cleaned up and savings realized. The procurement process would be a great place to start. Outlandish contracts for sometimes piss poor products are another. And we could probably lop off a third of the generals in the military and probably never miss them

    But the move to cut out contractors and fill those positions with government employees is rather stupid,especially in DoD. The contractors came about because of the gutting of the military by Klinton in the 90's. The military used to have the people to do the jobs that are now filled by contractors. 20 years ago Haliburton would not have had a prayer to do a lot of the construction they do at deployed locations now because they military would have built all of that stuff. This is an example of short sighted planning. Of course you can tell people this until you're blue in the face and they won't listen. The military to this day has not recovered from the gutting in the 90's

    And now, same crap. And again, under a Dem regeime.
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    Formerly known as ...............Sarge

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    Quote Originally Posted by fansince62 View Post
    Serv...what's the tech transition rate for DARPA?
    Interesting question, fansince. I'm now starting to dig around and see what information I can find relating to tech transfer from DARPA to the civilian world. I've found a couple of papers on it and will get back to you on this. I really hadn't given that a great deal of thought other than a general assumption that it does occur. My main interest in DARPA stems from a personal interest in robotics, AI, cybernetics, and neuroscience and am supportive of the idea of automating our defense systems. Additionally, my belief is that society in general is and will continue to be incorporating these technologies and DARPA's ability to translate advances in new technologies into practical applications that would be easily reconfigured for other-than-military application is a resource I am reluctant to inhibit.


    Quote Originally Posted by fansince62 View Post
    I'm not anti-contractor....

    What will happen down the road is totally predictable. There will be fewer military to lead projects, provide requirements, etc., etc. The GS types who already depend heavily on contractors will not be able to make up for the increased workload with shrinking contract support. not saying every gov type is a loser....there are many outstanding public servants who carry the load...and....shhhhh...can no kidding lead! just not enough...and too few with actual operational experience.
    Quote Originally Posted by Sarge View Post
    I think most everyone that has served or works in DoD knows there are vast areas that can be cleaned up and savings realized. The procurement process would be a great place to start. Outlandish contracts for sometimes piss poor products are another. And we could probably lop off a third of the generals in the military and probably never miss them

    But the move to cut out contractors and fill those positions with government employees is rather stupid,especially in DoD. The contractors came about because of the gutting of the military by Klinton in the 90's. The military used to have the people to do the jobs that are now filled by contractors. 20 years ago Haliburton would not have had a prayer to do a lot of the construction they do at deployed locations now because they military would have built all of that stuff. This is an example of short sighted planning. Of course you can tell people this until you're blue in the face and they won't listen. The military to this day has not recovered from the gutting in the 90's

    And now, same crap. And again, under a Dem regeime.
    There is a quandry here that I'm wondering about. Having worked for a DoD contractor and seen waste and over-charging first hand makes me lean toward being less than comfortable with using contractors while yet understanding the difficult position the military is in trying to maintain their current role in a cost cutting scenario.

    Fansince, I'm looking for a minimax regret solution here, I don't know if one exists, however. Once you involve politics, any rational-choice based form of decision analysis seems crippled almost beyond use.
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    I'm giving it a 2-4 year window. Looking for improvement in all areas. Redskins, you're on the clock.

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    Quote Originally Posted by fansince62 View Post
    El: Palin backed TP candidates the locals pushed....i.e., you take what the pool provides. And in NV...that was as corrupt an election as it gets. Reid is just another political crook.

    of course the troops will be affected......there are already huge problems with modernization. they are about to get worse. at a deeper level....does it strike you that risking one's life in Afghanistan is an honorable effort when the CiC states we will be outta there in a yr and a half?
    Don't want to get this thread too far off track, but those candidates would never have represented the GOP if it weren't for Palin's support. What was most frustrating was her all or nothing attitude about it too. When criticized for jeopardizing a GOP victory in DE and NV, she came out swinging instead of looking at the big picture. I like her fight, but I have learned that you have to pick and choose your battles. She needs to learn that or she will never be successful in Washington politics and her fighting spirit cost the GOP 2 seats at least in the Senate.

    As for the cuts, like I mentioned before I know little about where to make cuts in Defense where it wouldn't harm our troops in the field. I just know there needs to be cuts. I will leave that discussion up to you guys with military experience. Something I wish this President would do!
    Last edited by Elephant; 03-21-11 at 01:38 PM.
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    Quote Originally Posted by fansince62 View Post
    Serv...what's the tech transition rate for DARPA?
    Fansince , after figuring out what you were referring to by "tech transition rate" I have, so far, cxome across a report by the Potomac Institute analyzing DAPRA's performance during the 1990's on this.

    In two areas, DARPA-to-Service-Acquisition(DSA) 60% of the time their products followed this path and DARPA-to-Industry-to-Service-Acquisition was the path followed 30% of the time and using a Service Laboratory partner 10% of the time.

    Here's the link to the report-PDF file-for more details: http://potomacinstitute.org/images/transdarpatech.pdf
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    I'm giving it a 2-4 year window. Looking for improvement in all areas. Redskins, you're on the clock.

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    Quote Originally Posted by servumtuum View Post
    Fansince , after figuring out what you were referring to by "tech transition rate" I have, so far, cxome across a report by the Potomac Institute analyzing DAPRA's performance during the 1990's on this.

    In two areas, DARPA-to-Service-Acquisition(DSA) 60% of the time their products followed this path and DARPA-to-Industry-to-Service-Acquisition was the path followed 30% of the time and using a Service Laboratory partner 10% of the time.

    Here's the link to the report-PDF file-for more details: http://potomacinstitute.org/images/transdarpatech.pdf
    Serv...back in the day while in uniform I was actually going to fill a rotation at DARPA. Made it through the nomination process and just needed a 5 minute interview with the director but then everything went to H during the transition to the Bush admin when a bunch of political infighting broke out. I was asked to wait while the backstabbing/power plays were reconsiled. rather than taking an unattractive mandated option B to some organization/job I didn't want, I opted for another job I chose as opposed to waiting for the political dust to settle. In the event, during the interview process I learned that 30% is actually a target considered the standard for all of these R&D communities. at the time neither DARPA nor many other DoD labs were hitting that target and so there was discussion about budget cuts. don't know where they are today...I moved on.
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