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2011 Draft Order - Updated 1/3

Ax said:
Yeah, who'll ever forget Walter Murray, or Tory Nixon?
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in the end...they need to find a QB.

out of curiosity...what do you think is in the Shanny's collective minds...

- they think/believe Grossman got one team to a SB and could therefore do it again?

- they think he is a caretaker for 1-2 years?

- he's all they have?

- Donovan will get the message and execute as desired?

and...why hasn't Beck received any playing time? if this is all about "seeing what we have"...then we need to examine Beck as well.
 
I have to believe that the Shannys believe Rex is "all they have"; or possibly a "caretaker for 1-2 years".

Of course, maybe I'm just projecting my thoughts.....
 
I agree with fan on Beck. We need to see if he's got any potential by letting him go at it with the big boys at some point. And yeah, we may have no choice but to stick with Grossman for a couple years. We need to rebuild the lines and we need a young future QB. Hard to see how we satisfy both needs (not to mention plenty of other roster holes) in the short term?
 
Boone said:
I agree with fan on Beck. We need to see if he's got any potential by letting him go at it with the big boys at some point. And yeah, we may have no choice but to stick with Grossman for a couple years. We need to rebuild the lines and we need a young future QB. Hard to see how we satisfy both needs (not to mention plenty of other roster holes) in the short term?
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exactly. maybe Shanahan Sr has changed his goals: maybe he believes laying the foundation for future success will be a worthy component to his legacy.
 
Maybe Fan. Hard to know anything about how he is viewing things right now. This off season will tell us an awful lot. As I see it, there are three directions in which he can go:

1) rebuild starting with the lines, using Rex, Beck or a FA stop gap. This means we will not be competitive for 3 years, give or take, but once we are ready to draft a Franchise QB, they will be put in a much better position to win.

2) rebuild starting with a franchise QB (trade up, or one drafts) or a developmental QB. This route will mean a little more success immediately, if we find a good QB. But it probably hurts us more in the long run, as we will end up being an average team with a good QB, because f the limited other pieces around him. Harder to rebuild this way, IMO.

3) business as usual. Shanny will have convinced himself that we are only a couple of pieces away from making the playoffs. This option seems more and more likely with a win against the Giants. That would close the season with two wins against playoff contenders, and might tempt the coaches and FO to forget the ass kickings we sustained just weeks ago,

As you can probably tell, unless something crazy happens in the draft, I vote for scenario one. Drafting a bunch of linemen isn't going to win us the off season Super Bowl, but it will set us up well to do so in the future.
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about Beck, no point in keeping a guy who either doesnt have the potential to challenge for a starting spot or is at least capale of playing in short bursts at a decent level. so play him and find out, and if he fails no big loss this year.
 
goaldie....now that QB is likely out and we have limited draft resources....agree that option 1 is preferable.

it's not on anyone's "got to" list....but I'm thinking a break-away tailback has to be on the shopping list somewhere.
 
btw....it seems to me that most teams...when it comes to QB...draft "the guy" whenever they are in a position to do so. there is no set schedule.....teams can't take a flyer when the opportunity is there.
 
fansince62 said:
btw....it seems to me that most teams...when it comes to QB...draft "the guy" whenever they are in a position to do so. there is no set schedule.....teams can't take a flyer when the opportunity is there.
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Agree completely. If someone falls and the opportunity presents itself, we would be fools not to take it, plan be damned. I have a feeling the Browns are fairly happy Colt McCoy fell to them in the 3rd last draft.

And I also agree that we need a speedster out of the backfield. Keiland is a decent 3rd down back, but more of a pass catching threat rather than a true change of pace back I think we need.
 
Rymanofthenorth said:
looks like 3 , go watch that interview in the link I posted. Shanny still doesnt think we are in need of a complete rebuild.
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Hmmm....got a question ryman...how complete a rebuild are you thinking of? A "rebuild" can take many values numerically, or be concentrated in one area-such as an OL rebuild, or a WR corps rebuild or rebuilding the offense or defense-a complete team rebuild may be the only one Shanny's explicitly rejecting and may indicate more of a concentration in specific areas-OL, DL, ..things like that. I have no idea how many holes he might see as needing to be filled by another body other than the one that's already there. I just don't think there's enough information yet to make a determination as to what he means. As I mentioned in another thread-he's not given to detailed descriptions of what he has planned.

I've been ruminating myself over just how many holes we actually would need to fill with new players in order for the team to have sufficient talent to successfully operate if the premise of Allen, Shanahan&Shanahan, and Haslett remaining here proves to be accurate. I still haven't settled on a specific number yet.
 
well heres the thing, operating on the premise that Shanny wont admit hes wrong about the 3-4 (and history suggests he wont) we will need an entirely new front seven aside from Carriker at DE and Rak at OLB. every single player we had this year other than them needs to be either beaten and moved to a backup spot or traded. Lorenzo played hard and tried hard but he was a DT a year ago, Jarmon was told to lose, then gain weight and thats not as easy as it sounds. If we stay 3-4 we have several massive holes to fill or it simply wont work. we would need at a minimum another DE, a NT and OLB and an ILB. thats at a minimum and those positions are all starters spots that need to be filled.

in the secondary, we will need at least one Corner and a free safety. So on defence alone we will NEED 6 new starters to become even marginally effective in this scheme.

On Offence Im sorry I didnt see anyone really step up, but brown played better than he has all season so I would say bring in at least one guard and a center to beef up the Oline and preferably an OT who could compete. so thats two starters.
at receiver we need a number one, Moss could be a great #2 slot guy but we might even have to replace him, so we need to add a starter at REC and some depth

at running back, im not sold on torain in more than a rotational capacity, williams is a solid guy so keep em both and draft or sign a scat back with some breakaway speed.

unless a bluechip falls to us at QB I dont think we should waste important build picks on one but I could totally see Shanny taking a late flyer on someoen to mold.

in my eyes thats as close to a complete rebuild as it gets, last year we were third in roster turnover, but we didnt get younger, we got older, we didnt rebuild we tried to recycle, and that didnt work out.

whatever we do, they better display some savvy in finding players because this roster will be in dire need of upgrades .
 
And there it is folks . . . the 10th pick is ours in April.
 
servumtuum said:
Hmmm....got a question ryman...how complete a rebuild are you thinking of? A "rebuild" can take many values numerically, or be concentrated in one area-such as an OL rebuild, or a WR corps rebuild or rebuilding the offense or defense-a complete team rebuild may be the only one Shanny's explicitly rejecting and may indicate more of a concentration in specific areas-OL, DL, ..things like that. I have no idea how many holes he might see as needing to be filled by another body other than the one that's already there. I just don't think there's enough information yet to make a determination as to what he means. As I mentioned in another thread-he's not given to detailed descriptions of what he has planned.

I've been ruminating myself over just how many holes we actually would need to fill with new players in order for the team to have sufficient talent to successfully operate if the premise of Allen, Shanahan&Shanahan, and Haslett remaining here proves to be accurate. I still haven't settled on a specific number yet.
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Serv, it seems to me that we will be concentrating on the defensive side of the ball in the upcoming draft and free agency periods. Monty and Lichty (really got to get a new nickname for him) played decently enough when pressed into duty, in fact you could make the argument they played better than the starters they replaced. I think we will grab some depth and 1-2 starters on the line, depth through the draft, starters through FA. We do need a prototypical WR1, but that may have to wait, depending on what is available. I think we also need a burner, but with Shanny's history of late round RB gems, I am comfortable spending a 6th round or later pick there.

I know that sounds like a lot, but the offense is somewhat manageable. We have seen Kyle's offense work the way it is supposed to work from time to time, so with a couple of improvements here and there, I think it could pick up a little steam next season.

But the D? Ouch. As Ryman says, if they are committed to running the 3-4 again, we are going to need a lot of pieces on D. We will be drafting depth and starters on all three levels of D. Not that it can not be done, but we are going to see a lot of turnover on that side of the ball, I think. That's the total rebuild Ryman is talking about, I would wager.
 
So the draft order has Dallas ahead of us, but we are sitting behind them in the standings? Someone explain that to me. I think it is strength of schedule and all, but is that right? Am I correct in my strength of schedule?


Edit: I looked into it. It is strength of schedule but is it last year's win/loss or this season's? Because we played the same 14 games as the Cowturds! The only difference were the two conference games that were not part of the NFC North.

Dallas = New Orleans 11-5
Arizona 5-11
16-16

Redskins = St. Louis 7-9
Tampa Bay 10-6
17-15

Where am I going wrong here guys?

Edit 2: Here's something that could irk Jerruh Jones since he lucked out with a 9 pick while holding a better position in the standings than us. You guys think we could trade Haynesworth for a swap in the draft order with Tennessee at 8 and us at 10? :square:

Take that Jerruh! :moon:
 
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Walter Football is projecting the Skins to take Newton at #10 and WR Broyles from Oklahoma at #41.
 
Another draft related question, if you could call it that, more like a "Hmmm....I wonder?" What I'm wondering is if we might see something along the lines of the roster "purge" we had last season to either try to pick up more picks or make room for more FAs to bring in for "position competition"-something Shanahan apparently likes as an operating mode for filling team needs?

Another thing, right now, the potential pool of available FAs seems to look better overall than was the case last season. But something that I'm wondering might be in play in the strategy Allen/Shanahan use-actually true of any team-are the unknowns of a new CBA; rookie salaries that may be limited with a new CBA, changes in the number of years of play necessary to separate restricted versus unrestricted free agency, possible roster size increases due to expanding to an 18 game season. I haven't heard or read much real news, other than speculation but I can't help but think owners, GMs and coaches have to have these uncertainties in their heads when planning what to do this particular off-season as far as acquiring players.
 
Serv, if we purge this roster again its because the guys we brought in last year failed to perform not because we are trying to bring in new talent. the only way it would benefit us is if we managed to get younger this time, and not older. whats gonna be interesting to me is if we get rid of our best players for bargain basement prices, if I was a gm in the NFL id have the skins on speed dial. I could see Cooley going for a 3rd, but who else do we have thats even tradeable? Mcnabb? we might get a 4th MAYBE, depends on another teams desperation, Haynesowrth? Id be surprised if we got a 4th. moss is a free agent, Carter might go for a 5th or 6th whats sad is we went from having significant depth at DE to it being a huge hole in one season with one change. I just cant get past that. when your engine breaks down you dont spend all your money on a new transmission.

I think this offseason is gonna be very telling and Im not excited about it.
 
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