A Burgundy and Gold Obsession
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  1. #21
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    Default Re: If we think Haskins is the guy, then Gruden needs to go asap

    Callahan is an Allen guy from their Oakland days.

    So , if he decides to toughen things up and move away from Gruden’s management style I doubt there is going to be any backlash.

    Things here are tough on coaches but Gruden made things a lot more difficult than they had to be,

    He had the endorsement of Snyder and Allen for most likely the first 4 years of his tenure but failed in that time to set down any standards of conduct and preparation for the team.

    I don’t think Snyder has any vested interest in seeing players at practice being on their smartphones and blowing off their responsibilities.

    That was up to Gruden to set a tone and enforce it.

    Most of the high picks and players Allen and Snyder champion are good guys.

    It’s a number of the others that needed to be dealt with.

    Remember Allen talking about the offseason workouts and how they were less than what he was used to at Alabama?

    These were all things in Gruden’s control to fix and he just refused to listen.

    You don’t become a Walsh, Gibbs or Belichick allowing players to take it easy and giving them extra days off when their performance shows they need the work.
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  2. #22

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    Default Re: If we think Haskins is the guy, then Gruden needs to go asap

    Quote Originally Posted by Ax View Post
    With equal respect, yes we are.

    Nothing good could even approach happening until Gruden was fired.

    The day is coming when the pendulum swing the other way for our team. Whether any of us are still alive is certainly debatable.
    But we are, one day closer, to that day.
    A true optimist would argue that time can bend back on itself and that we can actually relive the last 20 years as repeating Super Bowl champs.

    Question: will DS be in this alternative reality?
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  3. #23

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    Default Re: If we think Haskins is the guy, then Gruden needs to go asap

    It is possible.
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    "Losers always whine about their best. Winners go home and **** the prom queen"

  4. #24

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    Default Re: If we think Haskins is the guy, then Gruden needs to go asap

    double post


    Yes it is.
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    "Losers always whine about their best. Winners go home and **** the prom queen"

  5. #25

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    Default Re: If we think Haskins is the guy, then Gruden needs to go asap

    Quote Originally Posted by Ax View Post
    It is possible.
    Well then....I can go to work today happy in that insight! What a change from the last five weeks and 20 years!

    Thr Skins need more than new coaches. They need athletes. They need to find out if Haskins can handle NFL pressure. They need a whole new culture and organizational approach. This aint gonna be no magic turn-around. This is gonna take a few years at best. The sad part is that certain aspects of this require a capable owner - there are changes that cannot be handed off to "professional football people". Not holding my breath.

    But I do, in all seriousness, recognize and appreciate your unrelenting drumbeat leading the charge up the mountain!
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  6. #26

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    Default Re: If we think Haskins is the guy, then Gruden needs to go asap

    It's simply a choice, my friend.

    I'm not in charge of what the team, or other people do. So I don't fret too much over it. I'll point out what I see. But beating dead horses, or picking on the disabled, isn't very fulfilling for me.

    I remain hopeful. It's all I can do. And I hope, that my positive attitude can pull others toward the light. However dim it can be, at times.

    You appear to hope your negativity will pull more folks into the dark, with you. Misery loving company, and all.
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    "Losers always whine about their best. Winners go home and **** the prom queen"

  7. #27
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    Default Re: If we think Haskins is the guy, then Gruden needs to go asap

    I'm a little behind on the forum, so spent some of today catching up and Brother Ax made me snort my drink during lunch when reading this...

    Quote Originally Posted by Ax View Post
    With equal respect, yes we are.

    Nothing good could even approach happening until Gruden was fired.

    The day is coming when the pendulum swing the other way for our team.
    Ah there's the voice of optimism I so love to embrace myself...

    Quote Originally Posted by Ax View Post
    Whether any of us are still alive is certainly debatable.
    … and then he shot the puppy in the head!

    I agree with this sentiment actually. (Not the puppy shooting, but the pendulum metaphor!)
    Things have GOT TO change at some point. Maybe we have to wait for Bruce and Dan to simply die of natural causes... but it will happen that a change will be made.

    I'm actually optimistic that we're looking at the end of the Bruce Allen era sooner rather than later.
    The Titanic IS going down slowly, we're taking on water and surely at some point Snyder will see that. Surely.

    Because if not I just don't get the mindset. The team is in the bin, the fanbase is riled up, the stadium is empty (unless it's opposition fans) and the organization is a laughing stock. We're fast becoming the punchline of the NFL. We're the New York Knicks of the NFL. I'm an NBA fan too, and if there's one situation that gives me hope it is the fact that the Clippers turned their organization around after Sterling was ousted. It can happen. I just don't get how Snyder can't be furious about the state of this team?? If it was me I'd be apoplectic about where we are.
    He's a successful business man in other arena's so how can he be so naïve about the Redskins?

    *shrugs*

    Anyhow, question for the masses re: Haskins and the future.

    Don't we still have Alex Smith on the books for next year?

    If there's one player I'd WANT to be a mentor for Haskins, then it's Smith. The issue here is... he'll want to play again. He'll surely want to be the starter if the leg is up to it.

    I think Colt and Keenum are a wash, sooner they're out of here the better. Haskins is the future. Would Smith want to accept a backup role mentoring the new kid?
    Or what are the other options for QB at the backup spot?

    If Callahan sits Haskins all year (which I don't think will happen) what do we do next year when Smith may be back?
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  8. #28

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    Default Re: If we think Haskins is the guy, then Gruden needs to go asap

    Glad I could give you a chuckle, Knight. We could use more of them.

    As to the QB situation, like everyone else, I have no idea. But, in my world, this would be a best case scenario.

    Keenum remains the healthy starter through week 12, or so. Regardless of our record. Colt to be backup, for now.
    If Haskins gets enough work in with the starters during practice, he should overtake Colt well before week 12.
    If we are mathematically eliminated by week 12, Haskins finishes the year. If we're still in it, Keenum starts until elimination.

    Something should be worked out with Alex over the offseason. Whether it's an injury settlement, or, it's shown that he will indeed be able to play again. Theismann's break was less disastrous than Smith's, and he couldn't continue playing. My guess is, he's done. Shame too, cause he's a great guy. Hopefully the team will add him to the staff in some capacity. If he's interested. If he can play, it will require a renegotiated contract. And an understanding that he will be the backup for Haskins in 2020.

    I'd keep Case and Colt on the roster for the rest of the year. If Case plays well for the remainder of this season, he would be an option at backup, next year.
    This should be Colt's last ride. Unless he somehow gets another shot, and lights it up.
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    "Losers always whine about their best. Winners go home and **** the prom queen"

  9. #29
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    Default Re: If we think Haskins is the guy, then Gruden needs to go asap

    Despite Gruden’s scorn Keenum is a much better quarterback than Colt McCoy.

    He has a lot more starts in the NFL under his belt and a stronger arm.

    If we don’t ask him to become Cam Newton with the consistent 50 yard heaves down the field (he has the strength but not the accuracy) then we can build a workable offense while we work with Dwayne to get him ready.
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  10. #30
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    Default Re: If we think Haskins is the guy, then Gruden needs to go asap

    Quote Originally Posted by Ax View Post
    Glad I could give you a chuckle, Knight. We could use more of them.

    As to the QB situation,*** Ax said lots of good and interesting stuff** .
    Yeah this is pretty much how I feel to be honest.

    I don't think we have a choice but to ride the season with Colt and Keenum. Too late in the day to change that now, or do anything meaningful. There are too many teams out there with a demand at QB right now due to injury. Look at the Steelers for example, or the Saints. (yes the latter have Bridgewater, but if he goes down who's up next?)

    Aside: Is it just me or are QB injuries particularly high this year considering we're only 5 games in? Maybe it's just that we're seeing more high profile injuries maybe...

    Anyhow.

    Moving forwards we have 4 QB's on the payroll.

    We know Haskins isn't going anywhere (provisionally).
    We know Colt is NOT the answer.
    Keenum is a back up at best in my opinion.
    Smith is the best of the bunch at the moment.... but only has one leg.

    For 2020 I'd want Smith in the QB room. The issue is that he'll probably want to start. I think it all comes down, as Ax said, to whether he's physically capable. I'd love to see us keep him on staff as a QB coach or something along those lines, but I'd imagine that he'd want to find a starters job somewhere (which at his age and coming off that injury would be hard maybe?). Maybe under those circumstances he'd accept a backup role to Haskins?

    I'd like to walk into 202 with a Haskins, Smith and maybe Keenum QB lineup.
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  11. #31
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    Default Re: If we think Haskins is the guy, then Gruden needs to go asap

    Smith counts against the cap so he will be on the roster for another year plus.

    Bruce brought in Keenum so if we keep another veteran it will be Case.

    McCoy is done here.

    Not only was he Gruden’s boy but he is the most limited physically of all the qbs on the roster at 32.
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  12. #32
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    Default Re: If we think Haskins is the guy, then Gruden needs to go asap

    Quote Originally Posted by Boone View Post
    Look - we're mired in misery. But we've seen nothing like 'the 70's Giants' who had 6/7 seasons of 5 wins or less. We've had 5 of those seasons in a 20 year stretch. A fair assessment is that we've been a .500 ball club that has been unable to make the playoffs and typically fades down the stretch. We have mostly been irrelevant, so perhaps it has been just as unsatisfying and frustrating. But we have not been the worst team in the league (or even close to it) for the entire Snyder era.

    That's not to say that the results haven't been totally unacceptable and that we are aren't in one of the worst seasons in recent memory. They are. And we are.
    Just saw this from an ESPN article. At least under Bruce Allen, which is now over nine seasons old (including the bad start to this year), the Redskins have the 5th worst record in the league over that time.

    https://www.espn.com/fantasy/footbal...s-busts-week-6
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  13. #33

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    Default Re: If we think Haskins is the guy, then Gruden needs to go asap

    Quote Originally Posted by Ax View Post
    It's simply a choice, my friend.

    I'm not in charge of what the team, or other people do. So I don't fret too much over it. I'll point out what I see. But beating dead horses, or picking on the disabled, isn't very fulfilling for me.

    I remain hopeful. It's all I can do. And I hope, that my positive attitude can pull others toward the light. However dim it can be, at times.

    You appear to hope your negativity will pull more folks into the dark, with you. Misery loving company, and all.
    Not exactly. I believe in confronting problems and fixing them.

    Allen and Snyder are incompetent boobs. The solution is rather obvious. Finding the path is the problematic, but noit impossible, part.

    Linving in a mountain of feces year after year and hoping the feces will eventually go away doesn't fix things. One has to clear out the feces and whatever causes it.
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  14. #34
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    Default Re: If we think Haskins is the guy, then Gruden needs to go asap

    Quote Originally Posted by Ax View Post
    Glad I could give you a chuckle, Knight. We could use more of them.

    As to the QB situation, like everyone else, I have no idea. But, in my world, this would be a best case scenario.

    Keenum remains the healthy starter through week 12, or so. Regardless of our record. Colt to be backup, for now.
    If Haskins gets enough work in with the starters during practice, he should overtake Colt well before week 12.
    If we are mathematically eliminated by week 12, Haskins finishes the year. If we're still in it, Keenum starts until elimination.

    Something should be worked out with Alex over the offseason. Whether it's an injury settlement, or, it's shown that he will indeed be able to play again. Theismann's break was less disastrous than Smith's, and he couldn't continue playing. My guess is, he's done. Shame too, cause he's a great guy. Hopefully the team will add him to the staff in some capacity. If he's interested. If he can play, it will require a renegotiated contract. And an understanding that he will be the backup for Haskins in 2020.

    I'd keep Case and Colt on the roster for the rest of the year. If Case plays well for the remainder of this season, he would be an option at backup, next year.
    This should be Colt's last ride. Unless he somehow gets another shot, and lights it up.
    Although not mathematically eliminated from the playoffs, no team has ever started 0-5 and made the playoffs. I don't think mathematical possibilities should factor into it at this point.
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  15. #35
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    Default Re: If we think Haskins is the guy, then Gruden needs to go asap

    mathematical elimination is a joke.

    The standard should be practical elimination.

    The Redskins have almost zero chance of making the playoffs in 2019.

    That’s rational.

    It’s irrational and wasteful to just put guys out there for today because at 0-5 there is a 3% chance or less to salvage the season.

    I am trading Williams and any other assets we can get future value for by the trade deadline whether this team beats the patsy Dolphins or not.

    I can just see some people talking up a turnaround after going to 1-5 with a win over Miami and saying we should bring Trent in and keep all these veterans.

    But from a personnel standpoint that is counterproductive and the worst scenario if you are playing the long game towards moving this team forward.
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  16. #36

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    Default Re: If we think Haskins is the guy, then Gruden needs to go asap

    Bruce Allen and Snyder are delusional. To treat the rest of this season like any other 0-5 team would (recognize that it's a lost season, start rebuilding, trade aging but still viable assets, garner additional picks, protect what talent you do have, etc...) would be an admission of 'failure'. While it may be obvious to the rest of this world that this franchise is an abject failure, Snyder and Allen are loathe to admit anything of the sort. So we'll go on pretending that Gruden was the problem, that Bruce Allen is a consummate professional, and that game results still matter.

    It's not so much that an in-season turnaround is impossible. Especially with a new HC (interim or not) sometimes team performance can dramatically improve. But even if Joe Gibbs were HC right now and a bigtime run were possible - why would anyone not named 'Ax' want it? We need a near entire blow-up from top to bottom. Racking up 5 or 6 wins the rest of the way only reduces the draft capital we will have, and perhaps worse, provides this inept FO and ownership a basis on which to believe things are moving in the right direction. That's the last thing we need.

    As if we don't have enough to worry about, I'm concerned about what the plan is with Alex Smith. I would guess that his playing career is over. He still appears to be limping around to me. If he were going to attempt an ill-advised comeback at age 36 next season, I don't believe he'll be physically healed enough to be an NFL QB. Might take an entire additional season for him to be sufficiently healed. So now we're looking at a situation where an old QB whose primary game relied on the ability to take off and use his feet, is openly competing with our 1st round draft pick for the starting job. Oh - and keep in mind, said aging QB has mostly been seen pal-ing around with our dysfunctional owner since his injury.

    That should all pan out well.

    I would hope that Smith clearly isn't ever going to be able to play NFL QB again, and that perhaps there are discussions about him moving into coaching or the front office. But that's probably wishful thinking.
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  17. #37
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    Default Re: If we think Haskins is the guy, then Gruden needs to go asap

    smith should be given an injury settlement and we need to make moves to get his money off the books asap. he is not coming back. what bugs me the most is that if he is rehabbing, he should be in the qb room working with the other guys, helping study the offence etc, he is being paid, he should be earning that money
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  18. #38
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    Default Re: If we think Haskins is the guy, then Gruden needs to go asap

    Smith has earned his $84 million. He actually walked on the sideline last week and acted like he was Dan's friend.

    Imagine if Dan had your phone number.
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    Thank you Jay Gruden. Multiple Superbowl appearances on deck.

  19. #39

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    Default Re: If we think Haskins is the guy, then Gruden needs to go asap

    Quote Originally Posted by fansince62 View Post
    Not exactly. I believe in confronting problems and fixing them.

    Allen and Snyder are incompetent boobs. The solution is rather obvious. Finding the path is the problematic, but noit impossible, part.

    Linving in a mountain of feces year after year and hoping the feces will eventually go away doesn't fix things. One has to clear out the feces and whatever causes it.
    Fine. Then you fix it. Oh, that's right, you can't. You have neither the authority, or the know how. Which makes it easy for you to act like you do. With the way you relish criticizing everything they do, I don't think you'd be happy if they did win. Unless you plan on taking personal credit for the win. You're not alone in wishing the worst for the team, while stating it's for their own good. You, and many others here, have allowed your pure hatred of the FO to totally control what and how you think. Sounds just like a ________.

    Quote Originally Posted by China View Post
    Although not mathematically eliminated from the playoffs, no team has ever started 0-5 and made the playoffs. I don't think mathematical possibilities should factor into it at this point.
    There's a first time for everything.

    Quote Originally Posted by Bulldog View Post
    mathematical elimination is a joke.

    The standard should be practical elimination.

    The Redskins have almost zero chance of making the playoffs in 2019.

    That’s rational.

    It’s irrational and wasteful to just put guys out there for today because at 0-5 there is a 3% chance or less to salvage the season.

    I am trading Williams and any other assets we can get future value for by the trade deadline whether this team beats the patsy Dolphins or not.

    I can just see some people talking up a turnaround after going to 1-5 with a win over Miami and saying we should bring Trent in and keep all these veterans.

    But from a personnel standpoint that is counterproductive and the worst scenario if you are playing the long game towards moving this team forward.
    Well, just call me Captain Cliché. It ain't over 'til it's over. Some obviously find it acceptable to quit before it's actually over.
    I do not. The only thing worse than losing, is quitting. IMHO.

    Quote Originally Posted by Boone View Post
    It's not so much that an in-season turnaround is impossible. Especially with a new HC (interim or not) sometimes team performance can dramatically improve. But even if Joe Gibbs were HC right now and a bigtime run were possible - why would anyone not named 'Ax' want it?
    Gee Wally, I don't know. Maybe because winning is the whole ****ing point of sports?
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    "Losers always whine about their best. Winners go home and **** the prom queen"

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    Default Re: If we think Haskins is the guy, then Gruden needs to go asap

    Quote Originally Posted by Ax View Post
    Fine. Then you fix it. Oh, that's right, you can't. You have neither the authority, or the know how. Which makes it easy for you to act like you do. With the way you relish criticizing everything they do, I don't think you'd be happy if they did win. Unless you plan on taking personal credit for the win. You're not alone in wishing the worst for the team, while stating it's for their own good. You, and many others here, have allowed your pure hatred of the FO to totally control what and how you think. Sounds just like a ________.


    There's a first time for everything.


    Well, just call me Captain Cliché. It ain't over 'til it's over. Some obviously find it acceptable to quit before it's actually over.
    I do not. The only thing worse than losing, is quitting. IMHO.


    Gee Wally, I don't know. Maybe because winning is the whole ****ing point of sports?
    lmao. AX the psychologist.

    Solving problems is a discipline of mind, methodology and creativity. Context may change. Experience and domain knowledge certainly matter. However, the tools, and as noted, habits/training of mind do not. Save the tears for someone else Ax. I feel for your sensitivities and your insistence on maintaining a positive outlook. Admirable. After 20+ years of sustained mediocrity, perhaps more masochistic than admirable.

    Btw...the path is rather obvious: build a team with better talent than the others. Install a coaching staff that knows what it's doing. Have a person at the top who sets the vision, culture, goals and objectives. The last is Snyder's responsibility - and he has been an abject failure. We have a tolerant society - to a point.

    Your armchair psychology is more revealing about you than it is anything else. I don't hate Snyder. That would be too easy. Now closer to the end than the beginning of my life, I can look back and see many victories, challenges and some losses. I confronted the challenges head on. I also didn't sit on my arse and not think about other matters and how how I would attack them - whether I owned the problem or not. Starting at an anchor point, one can apply the rational man theory on how others might solve a problem. Many of Snyder's challenges are not unique to football. They fall more in the domain of leadership.

    As for my happiness, I thank you for the attention and concern. Rest assured I have structured a healthy life where there are checks and balances. I expect better from the Redskins and will voice my feelings. I am not alone in this regard.

    Winning is clearly not the whole point of NFL football. Making money is an obvious priority. Meanwhile, attendance in the aggregate continues to decline. Why is that? I know one reason - poorly run franchises like the Washington Redskins.
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