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  1. #1

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    Virginia Tech

    Default OF: Peppers to Redskins? Must. Not. Think. It.

    The Daily Redskin 2.1.10

    I couldn’t help it. The first thing that flashed across my mind when I read that stud DE Julius Peppers is likely leaving Carolina ...

    “Damn he’d look good in a Redskins uniform.”

    Bet I’m not the only one.The retorts/questions immediately followed of course:

    - You serious?
    - Does “offseason champs” ring a bell?
    - Dude, you build through the draft.
    - I don't care if ...

    More...
    Last edited by Om; 02-01-10 at 10:06 AM.
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    Air Force

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    No, no, no and NOOOOOOOOOOOOO

    I'm tired of dudes looking for a payday and then throttling back after they arrive
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  3. #3

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    While Peppers is a great player, the signing of him would signify business as usual around here. Too lazy or incompetent to find and develop our own players for a reasonable price we resort to paying top dollar for a player someone else found and developed, on the down side of his career.

    So put me down for responses 2, 3 and 5.

    We found our own good player in Orakpo you say? Wonderful. Here's a cookie.

    Now do it again.
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  4. #4

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    Default

    Quote Originally Posted by Henry View Post
    While Peppers is a great player, the signing of him would signify business as usual around here. Too lazy or incompetent to find and develop our own players for a reasonable price we resort to paying top dollar for a player someone else found and developed, on the down side of his career.

    So put me down for responses 2, 3 and 5.

    We found our own good player in Orakpo you say? Wonderful. Here's a cookie.

    Now do it again.
    Let me 'splain. No, there is too much. Let me sum up ...

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  5. #5

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    Quote Originally Posted by Om View Post
    Let me 'splain. No, there is too much. Let me sum up ...

    Cookie Monster AND the Princess Bride in one post? Tough to counter that.

    My point is that seeing a high profile player and signing him without any thought beyond the fact that he's a high profile player has been our MO for far too long. Sure the thought of Peppers alongside Orakpo, Hayensworth and Carter seems really nice.

    On the other hand, what scheme are we running? Would Peppers fit in that scheme? If so, would he fill a role that we don't already have filled? Would his signing cause us to have one of our other top performers play out of position?

    We never seem to ask those questions. Then we end up with our best players playing out of position. Orakpo, Landry, Trotter, Arrington, Jason Taylor ... the list of supposedly great players underperforming because they are asked to fill a role to which they are unaccustomed has grown very long over the past ten years.

    We need to start doing more than looking at a list of names and assuming they'll play well together. We need to have a Plan. And grabbing up a big name to join a unit already full of big names would not go far towards convincing me that we have one for once.

    And if we have a Plan, drafting and signing guys that fit in with that plan shouldn't be seen as some amazing feat. That's our front office's job. You don't get a gold star for picking individual good players. They have to fit together. Orakpo is a good piece to the puzzle. I'm over it. Find the next piece.
    Last edited by Henry; 02-01-10 at 10:59 AM.
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  6. #6
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    Default

    Sure would be nice to use that money and build an offensive line.
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    Default

    Oh Mark....say it ain't so! Not you too brother.

    I am with Henry on this one. 100%.

    PS - Odd but true, while responding to this thread one of the great Mark Knophler guitar pieces from The Princess Bride came up randomly on WMP. It was a little spooky actually.
    Last edited by Neophyte; 02-01-10 at 11:19 AM.
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    Default

    Not sure, but I think my position on Peppers may not have conveyed despite the title.

    So here it is in a nutshell just in case:

    I don't favor bringing him here. The only caveat to that would be 1) if he came cheap AND 2) the team didn't treat his arrival (as with Jason Taylor's) as having addressed the need to draft young big men on both sides the ball both this year and as a matter of course in coming years.

    Mostly I was fessing up to that initial "Peppers is available? He'd look awesome opposite Orakpo on 3rd-and-longs" reaction to the story. They say confession is good for the soul.
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    Maryland

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    I'm sure if Vinny were here he'd already be on lockdown. What's the reason behind of Carolina letting him go? Doesn't seem like a smart move unless problems or injuries have happened. Perhaps they are just smart though and are going to get whatever they can off of him while they can.
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    For the record, I knew what you were saying, Om.

    My response was more to the Redskins than to you.
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    Quote Originally Posted by InsaneBoost View Post
    I'm sure if Vinny were here he'd already be on lockdown. What's the reason behind of Carolina letting him go? Doesn't seem like a smart move unless problems or injuries have happened. Perhaps they are just smart though and are going to get whatever they can off of him while they can.
    Publicly it's all about the money. What's going on in the meeting rooms at the Panther training facility is anyone's guess, but common sense suggests that his age and likely price tag simply makes them nervous. It would me.

    http://blogs.charlotte.com/panthers/...-moved-on.html

    ESPN's Adam Schefter cited an NFL source Sunday who claimed team owner Jerry Richardson had told people in the league the team would not try to keep Peppers.

    Panthers general manager Marty Hurney declined to discuss Peppers' situation last week at the Senior Bowl in Mobile, Ala., and so far has been unavailable for comment tonight.

    Peppers' contract is set to expire next month. In order to keep him, the Panthers either would have to sign him to a contract extension or apply their franchise tag.

    The tag would be ultra-expensive, however, costing the Panthers more than $20 million -- a 20 percent increase over the $16.683 million they paid him this season via the franchise tag.

    It has been widely believed that Peppers would only sign a long-term contract extension making him the highest paid defensive player in the NFL. Such a deal would have to average more than $15 million per year.

    However, Carey said of the Panthers, "The organization has no idea what Julius' salary requirement would be at this point because they haven't asked."

    Carey said Peppers was "open to hearing" from the Panthers after the regular season, but "because he has not heard from them, then he has to start looking forward to the likely scenario that he will enter free agency, and hes excited about that."

    Carey reiterated that the Panthers "have not made a single inquiry this offseason regarding Julius and the possibility of him having a future with the franchise. At this point, we do not expect to hear from them.
    Quote Originally Posted by Henry View Post
    For the record, I knew what you were saying, Om.

    My response was more to the Redskins than to you.
    And a fine response it was.

    Good news is, if you had written that post two months ago, it would have made my gut tighten into a knot. Today, with the Allen/Shanahan afterglow still, well ... afterglowing ... I'm prepared to at least temporarily suspend disbelief and think they actually will have "a plan" and stick to it.

    My gut is chillin' for the time being. It is only FEB 1, though.
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    HAHA....glad you qualified all that, Om. Here I thought you had tapped into the fountain of youth and were 20 years old again, thinking how awesome our D would "look" with Peppers.

    I like Sarge's comment about guys looking for a payday and then showing up and "throttling back". Fortunately, I don't see that happening with Shanahan and especially Haslett, when it comes to Defense.
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    Maryland

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    Quote Originally Posted by Om View Post
    Publicly it's all about the money. What's going on in the meeting rooms at the Panther training facility is anyone's guess, but common sense suggests that his age and likely price tag simply makes them nervous. It would me.
    They'll be shedding out some $$$ either way. In the end I guess it's best for them. If he were younger I'd like to have him, but I'd rather get some younger guys.
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    I think he fits the mold of a Vinny type pick-up - old guy, looking for a big check based upon past performance vice future potential with no consideration of locker room impact or suitability to current defensive scheme (anyone thinking of Archuleta here?).

    Who do we have as DE's currently on the roster? The list includes:

    Andre Carter - 8 yr. pro.
    Philip Daniels - 13 yr. pro.
    Rob Jackson - 2 yr. pro.
    Jeremy Jarmon - 1 yr. pro.
    Brian Orakpo - 1 yr. pro - listed as a LB/DE on the team's roster.
    J.D. Skolnitsky - 1 yr. pro.
    Reynaldo Wynn - 12 yr. pro.

    Who should stay?
    Who should go?

    Answer each based upon a 4-3 and a 3-4 defense.
    My take:
    Andre Carter - Stay for both. Would move to LB in a 3-4.
    Philip Daniels - stay for both. Best fit is a 3-4 DE at this stage of his career, he cannot push to the quarterback like he used to and is best against the run.
    Rob Jackson - stay for both.
    I think they tried to transition him to LB, like Chris Wilson, but got nowhere and dropped it.

    Jeremy Jarmon - stay for both. He might be too small for 3-4 DE, but might not.
    Brian Orakpo - stay for both. OLB all the way!
    J.D. Skolnitsky - stay for both.
    Reynaldo Wynn - Gone.

    With a 4-3 you have a DE rotation of Carter, Daniels, Jarmon and Jackson. Jackson either ups his game or will probably be gone. Wynn is too old. Skolnitsky is a practice squad guy. I don't see Peppers playing the rotation game. Solid line - kinda. Room for improvement? Definitely.

    With a 3-4, Orakpo and Wilson will do well. I think Wilson would benefit most because he would fit nicely as an ILB vice OLB. Carter would transition to OLB. But then, who are the 2 DEs? Daniels definitely, but who would be the other? Jarmon?
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  15. #15

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    VCU

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    Bringing in Peppers would be, as some have already mentioned, a very bad sign. He’s still a productive player but don’t look for him to be giving out and discount contracts.

    Adding Peppers would be adding strength to strength. That wouldn’t be a bad thing except we are so weak on the offensive line and have let that go for so long we don’t have the luxury to do that. Besides, Haynesworth used properly lets us save money on DEs because of the match-up issues he creates (At least I thought that was the idea). Bringing in a high priced free agent at DE sort of defeats the purpose.

    Normally I’m an advocate of drafting an offensive and defensive lineman in every draft, even if we are solid there, to add depth. I’d make an exception this year to address the offensive line.
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  16. #16
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    I can't wait to see how Jeremy Jarmon works out. There will be less pressure on him to succeed than Orakpo since he equates to a 3rd round pick. From the glimpses we have of him, I think we got a good one.

    Now, as for the first thought after hearing about Peppers, I will admit to envisioning Peppers in a Redskins' jersey as well. It is an attractive thought in light of the pass rushing deficiencies of our defensive line for too long. I think what is most exciting about what I have read so far in this thread is that we, as fans, have definitely evolved in our approach to the off-season.

    I still think Big Al was and will be a nice addition. Expensive, but he did make a difference about 60% of the season on D. I am not opposed to a big name signing. I think it has been expressed accurately here, we make a signing of this caliber only if it will fit the overall philosophy of the team. If Brad Johnson is performing at an All-Pro level, you don't sign Jeff George! But if your defensive line is struggling you can sign a younger, big, game changing tackle like Big Al who has a lot of potential if coached up to reach that potential.

    The educated fan has seen the futility of high priced purchases of big names since Bruce Smith and Deion Sanders back in Snyder's early reign. Over the years since, the Redskins were named "Off-Season Champs", when the reality is we had been failing all along! It is refreshing to see fans and especially the new regime come to the realization that these knee-jerk high profile moves "were" good for marketing in the immediate picture, but in the long run could prove to be extremely damaging to the product being sold. The idea that we are one or two players away from it all is no longer a reality, except for those few who will always see it that way.

    The average fans are no longer buying into it, thus the signing of Julius Peppers is attractive at first glance, but will likely not be a reality unless it fits the overall philosophy. The philosophy of big splashes just for the sake of being a splash appear to be a thing of the past here in Washington.
    Last edited by Elephant; 02-01-10 at 04:14 PM.
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  17. #17
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    I'm thankful that we have Allen and Shanahan running the show at this time. Like others here have said about previous FO...."we have information that was leaked saying the Redskins covet Peppers".

    First Peppers wants the big money. Second he wants to sign with a contender.

    Personally I think Orakpo is used correctly could be as good if not better. Like Elephant, I believe Jarmon has potential.

    But to be honest, just can't (and don't want) see Peppers in a Redskin uniform.
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  18. #18

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    Indiana

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    One reason I would not think bringing Peppers in is such a wonderful idea is that one of the knocks he's been getting recently from both media and Panthers' fans is that of inconsistency-they weren't sure which Julius Peppers was going to show up-one game he'd be his normal dominant self and the next he would seem to slack off. Adding that to the valid question of his expense and worrying about the possibility of another FA looking for somewhere to "wind-down" before retiring mitigates against adding him to the Skins roster in my view.
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    I'm giving it a 2-4 year window. Looking for improvement in all areas. Redskins, you're on the clock.

  19. #19
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    The Redskins were 4-12.

    Shanahan is too smart to believe that signing a 30/31 year old DE is in the best interest of the club long-term.

    That money can be spent on 3-4 other players who are all solid performers.

    And that is what Washington needs most, a complete roster with depth.

    Not merely 8-10 names and then a gaggle of waiver wire quality pickups.
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  20. #20
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    Navy Salisbury

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    As much as Peppers claimed he wanted to play in a 3-4, he looks like a 4-3 DE plain and simple.

    If you stay 4-3, it makes no sense to bring in Peppers when you have Orakpo, Carter and even Jeremy Jarmon who looked like he had a great deal of potential at LDE.

    If you go 3-4, again where does Peppers fit?
    He'd have to be converted to OLB, which may or may not work......at least Orakpo, Carter and Wilson have had some playing time as a OLB.

    It just would be an overall terrible move when the Skins have dire needs at other positions.
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