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  1. #21
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    Default Re: Redskins Defense

    Yep. If Jay fielded a half way decent defense he would have had a couple more playoff berths here.

    At the very least if he utilizes his running game that would help the D tremendously. What trips Gruden up is he has to show off all the brilliant pass plays he can dream up to show his offensive wizardry. Even in Cincy he had the same problem. I'm hoping with Guice's arrival he will show the same level of creativity with run plays because he has a high level rusher to build them around.

  2. #22
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    Default Re: Redskins Defense

    Quote Originally Posted by Burgundy Burner View Post
    The defense will certainly be improved, but I'm hoping we can avoid the injury bug this season. Bad luck, karma, evil spirits, gremlins, coodies, zombies - whatever the reason - we just need good things to happen. So tired of all the bad things that seem to plague the Skins each year.

    But...

    I'm still not over the Wade Phillips thing. That could end up being Jay's achilles heel.
    I was gonna mention this, but decided against it...didn't want to beat a deadhorse, but... Haha!

    And welcome to the board Reyskin Solo!
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  3. #23
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    Default Re: Redskins Defense

    Quote Originally Posted by Fear The Spear View Post
    The Raiders game last year - on national television - with a rare healthy defense, is the measuring stick I use for how good they can be.
    And that's not even including the improvements we made in the offseason.
    Luv ya brother, but that's a horrible measuring stick. Da Raidahs O was way off last year, we kind of caught them in a perfect storm for 60 minutes. If you ask me we're going to grade out top 15, no higher. As has already been said, a lot will depend on how the rooks step up. One thing I love is the addition of Payne to our D-line. Along with a recuperated Allan and others, we should finally be able to stuff the run and make teams beat us through the air. I am so over seeing us get gashed from one end of the field to the other with mediocre running games.
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  4. #24
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    Default Re: Redskins Defense

    Quote Originally Posted by DudeRedskin View Post
    Luv ya brother, but that's a horrible measuring stick. Da Raidahs O was way off last year, we kind of caught them in a perfect storm for 60 minutes. If you ask me we're going to grade out top 15, no higher. As has already been said, a lot will depend on how the rooks step up. One thing I love is the addition of Payne to our D-line. Along with a recuperated Allan and others, we should finally be able to stuff the run and make teams beat us through the air. I am so over seeing us get gashed from one end of the field to the other with mediocre running games.
    Yeah that one was a bit smoke'n'mirrors.

    We went into that game early in the season thinking that the Raiders were the team from the previous year that looked like SB contenders till their season was derailed when Carr bust his leg.

    I admit that watching us disassemble them in that game was a joy, but it became evident afterwards as the season progressed that they weren't the same team at all, finishing 6-10/

    I do believe still though that early in the year our D was really starting to turn a corner and showing some real swagger, the Raiders game was a part of that. The Raiders game kind of showed that. Even if in hindsight they weren't the team we thought they were we STILL stomped on them and that's what teams are supposed to do to bad teams, and is something the Skins have long been accused of not doing. Too many times have we shown up against superior opponents only to stumble badly against teams we should beat handily. It's that inconsistency that has been doing my noggin in over the last few (many) years.

    I think if our D hadn't been derailed by injury then we'd have seen steady improvement all year. I'm hoping that's what we see this year. I'd like to think we'll be fairly solid out of the gate and if we can stay healthy we'll gel and become a real force as the year progresses and our rookies get reps.

    As usual I'm an optimistic soul, but I'm not sure I'd project top 5. Top 10 to 12 maybe... I think we have the players now to be certainly above average this year. Then I'll look forward to a step up in year 2 as our rooks have a year under their belts and get more in tune to the NFL game and life.

    If we do manage to force them to go to the air, I just hope that Norman is an all-pro, Scandrick has some left in the tank and that Dunbar is what the coaches think he is and we don't miss Fuller too much.

    If we can put together an above average Offense and an above average Defense so we at least have a balanced squad, I think we'll start going places. And, fingers crossed, poise ourselves for a step forwards again next year when Smith has a year of familiarity in the system and after we draft some more Alabama defense players
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  5. #25

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    Default Re: Redskins Defense

    That the D was significantly better before devastated by injuries isn't an opinion - it's a fact. People cite our defensive rankings at the end of the year as evidence we were awful, but in September and halfway through October (prior to Jonathan Allen and others going down), we were ranked right in the low teens in terms of overall defense. You didn't need rankings to see how much more physical, aggressive, and disciplined the defense was. Subtract a few key injuries last year, and we were a playoff team. We don't lose several games (notably the New Orleans game) and we were likely a wildcard team at least.

    If we can just limit injuries to the usual NFL rate this season, we are going to make some noise, especially on defense.
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  6. #26
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    Default Re: Redskins Defense

    First 5 games we gave up 440 yds for a 88 ypg average defensively against the run

    Allen went down in the 5th game of the season vs San Fran.

    The remaining 11 games we allowed 1706 which is 155.09 ypg.

    Obviously quality of opponent can influence that, as well as one of those games Russell Wilson tried to run his way to a victory, but the point still stands.
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  7. #27

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    Default Re: Redskins Defense

    I think the other thing to keep in mind is that no individual unit of the defense operates independent of the other. When we lost what was becoming an intimidating pass rush and solid run stopping ability, it put tremendous pressure on the secondary and LBs. If we can have seasons where all of the units experience only minimal injuries where depth can maintain competency, we're going to see a dramatically improved overall unit imho.
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  8. #28
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    Default Re: Redskins Defense

    Quote Originally Posted by SilentThreat View Post
    First 5 games we gave up 440 yds for a 88 ypg average defensively against the run

    Allen went down in the 5th game of the season vs San Fran.

    The remaining 11 games we allowed 1706 which is 155.09 ypg.

    Obviously quality of opponent can influence that, as well as one of those games Russell Wilson tried to run his way to a victory, but the point still stands.
    They weren't bad teams either.

    Eventual SB Champs in game 1
    A very feisty Rams team in game 2
    An admittedly overhyped Raiders in game 3
    A solid Kansas City in game 4
    And another feisty underdog in game 5

    The stats you quote bear out what the eye test told me, that we were better and were gaining momentum. It's a shame we got derailed so badly. I think, like Boone, that if the injury Gods had averted their gaze we'd have had a better record and been a playoff team.
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  9. #29
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    Default Re: Redskins Defense

    Quote Originally Posted by DudeRedskin View Post
    Luv ya brother, but that's a horrible measuring stick. Da Raidahs O was way off last year, we kind of caught them in a perfect storm for 60 minutes. If you ask me we're going to grade out top 15, no higher.
    Quote Originally Posted by Knightingale View Post
    Yeah that one was a bit smoke'n'mirrors.

    We went into that game early in the season thinking that the Raiders were the team from the previous year that looked like SB contenders till their season was derailed when Carr bust his leg.

    I admit that watching us disassemble them in that game was a joy, but it became evident afterwards as the season progressed that they weren't the same team at all, finishing 6-10/
    Thing is, we practically duplicated that defensive performance the following week - also on national TV, and this time on the road, and this time against a hotter team in KC that was arguably a top tier team. The only difference is we didn't come out with a W.
    But if Doctson catches that last ball, we win anyway. Actually I thought he was interfered with.
    Last edited by Fear The Spear; 06-27-18 at 01:41 PM.
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  10. #30
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    Default Re: Redskins Defense

    Quote Originally Posted by Boone View Post
    That the D was significantly better before devastated by injuries isn't an opinion - it's a fact. People cite our defensive rankings at the end of the year as evidence we were awful, but in September and halfway through October (prior to Jonathan Allen and others going down), we were ranked right in the low teens in terms of overall defense. You didn't need rankings to see how much more physical, aggressive, and disciplined the defense was. Subtract a few key injuries last year, and we were a playoff team. We don't lose several games (notably the New Orleans game) and we were likely a wildcard team at least.

    If we can just limit injuries to the usual NFL rate this season, we are going to make some noise, especially on defense.
    The highlighted portion of your statement is why we will see improvement, Manusky and Tomsula are going to get the most out of their players, still concerned with other varying factors to put us in the "make waves" status of the NFL. 15th overall is probably more like it.
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  11. #31
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    Default Re: Redskins Defense

    Quote Originally Posted by Fear The Spear View Post
    Thing is, we practically duplicated that defensive performance the following week - also on national TV, and this time on the road, and this time against a hotter team in KC that was arguably a top tier team. The only difference is we didn't come out with a W.
    But if Doctson catches that last ball, we win anyway. Actually I thought he was interfered with.
    I hate to disagree about a positive post but KC had their way with us.

    vs Oak - 128 total yard allowed / 96 pass / 32 rush / 3 TO
    vs KC - 429 total yard allowed / 261 pass / 168 rush / 0 TO
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  12. #32
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    Default Re: Redskins Defense

    Quote Originally Posted by Knightingale View Post
    They weren't bad teams either.

    Eventual SB Champs in game 1
    A very feisty Rams team in game 2
    An admittedly overhyped Raiders in game 3
    A solid Kansas City in game 4
    And another feisty underdog in game 5

    The stats you quote bear out what the eye test told me, that we were better and were gaining momentum. It's a shame we got derailed so badly. I think, like Boone, that if the injury Gods had averted their gaze we'd have had a better record and been a playoff team.


    I will admit that our pass defense was not anywhere near stellar, but we were very effective at taking a way the run in all game except vs KC, and even that game we were in it til the end. Even giving up 250 ypg passing those first 5 weeks we still were 3 - 2 and the only truly convincing loss was week 1 vs Phi. Making a team 1 dimensional, even if they're semi-effective in that 1 dimension, instantly gets you into a level of being competitive, which ultimately is what you want every week.
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  13. #33
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    Default Re: Redskins Defense

    Quote Originally Posted by SilentThreat View Post
    I hate to disagree about a positive post but KC had their way with us.

    vs Oak - 128 total yard allowed / 96 pass / 32 rush / 3 TO
    vs KC - 429 total yard allowed / 261 pass / 168 rush / 0 TO
    A greatly competitive game, against a great team, and you had to kill my buzz with stats
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  14. #34
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    Default Re: Redskins Defense

    Quote Originally Posted by Fear The Spear View Post
    A greatly competitive game, against a great team, and you had to kill my buzz with stats

    LoL, sorry bout that... It was a game we absolutely were in.
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  15. #35
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    Default Re: Redskins Defense

    Quote Originally Posted by Fear The Spear View Post
    Thing is, we practically duplicated that defensive performance the following week - also on national TV, and this time on the road, and this time against a hotter team in KC that was arguably a top tier team. The only difference is we didn't come out with a W.
    But if Doctson catches that last ball, we win anyway. Actually I thought he was interfered with.
    I can't disagree.
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  16. #36

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    Default Re: Redskins Defense

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  17. #37
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    Default Re: Redskins Defense

    Quote Originally Posted by Burgundy Burner View Post


    If we were winning more games, he'd be in the same conversation as a lot of the 'best in the league' pass rushers....

    My major knock on him is his struggle in pass rushing himself out of a play. He'll get so far up field, and with our lack of interior pressuer, the QB can either step up into a sea of nothingness, or if it's an RB, there is a gaping hole allowing the RB to get outside with ease. It's killed us sometimes. I really hope having Allen and Ioan at end, with the big boys in the middle can help control the middle and it won't be such a glaring issue. At times I really wish Kerrigan would stay home and contain the play to the inside.
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    Default Re: Redskins Defense

    I guess if I had one "complaint" about Kerrigan, it would be when he gets his sacks. I haven't looked at stats to bear this out, but my gut instinct is that Ryan gets most of his earlier in games ... and not necessarily in those last couple of possessions in a game while protecting a lead or needing a 3rd down stop to give the offense one more shot. Von Miller gets his to close out Super Bowls.

    Yes, that's a bit hyperbolic, but it's been my impression of Ryan for a while now. Very solid player and very good pass rusher ... not a great one.
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  19. #39
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    Default Re: Redskins Defense

    Quote Originally Posted by Om View Post
    I guess if I had one "complaint" about Kerrigan, it would be when he gets his sacks. I haven't looked at stats to bear this out, but my gut instinct is that Ryan gets most of his earlier in games ... and not necessarily in those last couple of possessions in a game while protecting a lead or needing a 3rd down stop to give the offense one more shot. Von Miller gets his to close out Super Bowls.

    Yes, that's a bit hyperbolic, but it's been my impression of Ryan for a while now. Very solid player and very good pass rusher ... not a great one.

    Thinking about it I have to agree. You may be on to something.
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    Default Re: Redskins Defense

    So impacting the game early is not as good as late while the offense is supposed to take advantage of early defensive success, I'm lost on this one, sacks only matter in the 4th quarter?
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